4 ms·
Unless you’re from mainland China, you should.
by azinman2 3mo ago
Unless you’re from mainland China, you should.
- bilbo0s 3mo agoWhy? Serious question. I'm from the US, and I think it's hilarious.
- breppp 3mo agoOne example is that a totalitarian government known for erasing historical record of its crimes will control an arbitrator of truth.
- dylan604 3mo agoso what? this has nothing to do with them taking from those that took before them. china censoring information they do not like is nothing new and seems irrelevant to this conversation
- breppp 3mo agoFair enough you don't care, some people might want to know about the Uyghur happy camps, mass organ harvesting and such. In a world where information sources are only going to dwindle, it is not in anyone's interest to empower actors that will use these to manipulate perceptions
- dylan604 3mo agoThe people that care about that won't be using CCP products/services now will they?
- deleted 3mo ago[deleted]
- 4bpp 3mo agoAnd some people might want to know about [insert your favourite beyond-the-pale-in-the-US topic here, we're on a US forum after all]. I think it would be great if those people could turn to Chinese models, while anyone wanting to know about Uyghur camps can ask the US ones.
- customguy 3mo ago> beyond-the-pale-in-the-US topic Can you name one? It's an honest question, first of I'm not American, but also the stuff I do come up with (asking an LLM how to blow up a school or whatever) would also be handled similarly in China, so those would be a wash, and I can't think of any that aren't.
- antiamerican634 3mo agoFrom an outsiders point of view: - The Trail of Tears - The Tuskegee syphilis study - Use of Agent Orange in the Vietnam War - Open Air biological warfare testts in civilians eg. in 1950 San Francisco - The only use of nuclear weapons against civilians? - Coca Cola and "american culture" - Neoliberalist economy - Spreading blame for their sins to other "white" nations plus one: The text input method to HN comments :(
- customguy 3mo agoall of these things have books about them published in the US you are comparing a wooden stick to a fighter yet, try again
- 4bpp 3mo agoI would imagine a lot of things touching upon progressive politics would be affected (there were a few high-profile incidents demonstrating bias like Google's black Wehrmacht soldier pictures, but has anyone rigorously tabulated how the various commercial LLMs respond to questions about the gender binary or heritability of human traits considered good or bad?). Overall, I'm too reluctant to even write out in the abstract sequences of words that I never want to explain to a future job interviewer or HR employee who used GPT-7 to comb the internet for all text that stylistically can be traced to me, but just imagine whatever you believe to be vile and wrongheaded opinions in that general space which it is certainly more than justifiable to prohibit. The things that make you think "banning this is good actually" are exactly the things most likely to be banned (and this is true in China too). Another thing I would try if I had access to the models and enough proxies to hide behind is asking for advice on software/movie piracy or seeing to what extent the models can be elicited to straight up argue against the validity of intellectual property, though there it seems more probable to me that the US models would be permissive.
- queenkjuul 3mo agoPeople in China know about this stuff.
- VulgarExigency 3mo agoThe same people who say there is a Uyghur genocide are the ones who deny there is a Palestinian genocide. Guess which one there's video evidence of (a horrific, endless amount of evidence).
- deleted 3mo ago[deleted]
- queenkjuul 3mo agoThe US already decides what models get released by US companies...
- analognoise 3mo agoThe USA?
- sph 3mo agoA KGB spy and a CIA agent meet up in a bar for a friendly drink "I have to admit, I'm always so impressed by Soviet propaganda. You really know how to get people worked up," the CIA agent says. "Thank you," the KGB says. "We do our best but truly, it's nothing compared to American propaganda. Your people believe everything your state media tells them." The CIA agent drops his drink in shock and disgust. "Thank you friend, but you must be confused... There's no propaganda in America."
- breppp 3mo agoNo, there might be lesser known periods in USA history but none that are censored. Also generally the USA had never done crimes in the scale of the CCP (around 30+ million dead)
- azinman2 3mo agoFor a number of reasons. First, whether we like it or not (generally not), a fuck ton of money has been invested in US AI companies, data centers, RLHF datasets amongst other datasets, etc. If that were to go to 0 that’d be quite disastrous. Alternatively, if it goes well, it’s great for the US (and to a lesser extent allies) economy and global standing. Relatedly, tech has been a huge power house for the US economy for decades now. If the main driver of growth goes to China, what replaces it? Along with all the potential tax money, foreign investment, etc? Next, patriotism / nationalism. This is very much a zero-sum game that defines who owns the future. Would you rather your country win or lose this? Lose this and you start losing talent, money, global standing, etc. That furthers a cascading effect that’s very negative. It also will likely create social strife with the knock on effects leading to even more bad populist ideas that just further diminish the country and tear society’s fabric apart. None of this is hilarious.
- vinyl7 3mo ago> This is very much a zero-sum game that defines who owns the future. Would you rather your country win or lose this? Lose this and you start losing talent, money, global standing, etc. That furthers a cascading effect that’s very negative. This process is already well underway. The current massive over investment into the AI hype bubble is the final death throes of a failed economy trying to keep its head above water.
- xbmcuser 3mo agoNo you should not care unless you are a shareholder in one of these Ai ponzi companies. For the rest of the world Chinese companies matching and open sourcing llm's will keep 100 or so tech oligarchs taking over all the world economic output for themselves as all the idiot politician are unwilling to tax wealth.
- HDBaseT 3mo agoEveryone is technically (directly or indirectly) a shareholder of one of these AI or AI affiliated companies.
- cowboy_henk 3mo agoWe're also shareholders in all other publicly traded stocks (assuming you're referring to pension schemes etc), which means competition in the AI model market is better than a few winners making everyone paying through their nose for access. Even better, open weights models which cannot be disabled on a whim means the entire world economy can benefit.
- stuaxo 3mo agoThe majority being indirect and having no input to how these companies run if we can't get some strong regulation going.
- VulgarExigency 3mo agoWhy? Should we be held hostage to the whims of these companies and all the investors in the throes of AI psychosis, and let them do whatever the fuck they want, because if we don't then the economy will crash?
- owebmaster 3mo agoWhy so? If I'm from Europe or South America, should I hope Anthropic/Openai win?
- RazorBucksICO 3mo agoYes. They’re flawed, but you don’t want a global police state administered by the PRC.
- owebmaster 3mo agoWho said so? I don't want the current global police state administered by the US government and oligarchies
- SZJX 3mo agoNo matter your perception of PRC, I don't see how competition around open-weight models has much to do with a "global police state".
- wasfgwp 3mo agoThe better question is why would any rational consumer would want anyone to “win”? Disappearance of competition is the worst outcome for them (I guess being squeezed by a monopolistic company from your pwn country is slightly nicer)
- m4rtink 3mo agoI think it is only rational to want them to fail & to fail hard, to make an example. To avoid future situations where money is invested on hype only with no regards to what societal disruption it causes.
- azinman2 3mo agoAnswered in a sister thread. Are you from Europe or South America? Or just asking on their behalf? They are allies of the US, which includes economic spheres of influence. The premise of the petrodollar is that allies do better by being a part of it than not, which has been true for many, many decades now. China’s rise is providing an alternative for the first time in 70+ years, but so far it’s very unclear if these benefits will truly extend to allies of China or not. For example, China sends their own laborers when building infrastructure in Africa. Sure there’s new infrastructure but also debt to CCP without any benefits of knowledge transfer or local employment.
- NuclearPM 3mo agoWhy?