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There's also the argument that CSAM can act as a gateway leading people from just being a pedophile in their head, to going out and doing something to some chil

There's also the argument that CSAM can act as a gateway leading people from just being a pedophile in their head, to going out and doing something to some child.

MichaelDickens 2mo ago
Yes, this is an argument that exists. But it's not supported by evidence. It's the same as the old "video game violence should be outlawed because it might cause real violence", which is just as unsubstantiated.
- ButlerianJihad 2mo ago
  Yeah, that old canard is ridiculous! I mean, if there were any truth to it, surely our nation would have seen an uptick, in the past 30–40 years, of new generations picking up guns and just mercilessly mowing down soft targets as if playing GTA. Thankfully, that is all confined to fantasy in cyberspace!
  - Ardon 2mo ago
    Yeah, /your/ nation maybe. I wonder if there's any other reasons that could explain this, especially given the pretty uniform distribution of video games, and the extremely uneven distribution of violence. Oh, and everywhere in your nation? At the same time? Sorry, I think I have a button.
  - ButlerianJihad 2mo ago
    https://youtu.be/g7tII_3WXqo?is=MagnO5GswnVJJltM https://youtu.be/g7tII_3WXqo?is=MagnO5GswnVJJltM Mother Shares How Video Games Radicalized Her Son to Run Around and Pick up Coins
  - john_strinlai 2mo ago
    gta is played all around the world yet only one country is an outlier in mass shootings. perhaps there is more to it?
  - tancop 2mo ago
    school shootings happen when lonely boys with mental health issues a) have access to guns and b) feel like society failed them and they need to take revenge. the first one is the reason why it happens it america more than any other place. other countries also have youth unemployment and social isolation but they show up as bullying in schools or votes for fascist parties instead of mass murder. the actual problem is people feeling hopeless, like theres no way they could ever be successful in this world so they want to burn it down. thats why some of them turn violent, when you feel like nothing you can do will make life better the only thing left is making it worse for those you think are responsible, like your classmates or gay/queer people or Jews. none of this comes down to video games, feminism, rap music, violent movies, atheism or other cultural "problems" conservatives always like to blame. its a social issue that needs social solutions.
    - inigyou 2mo ago
      > fascist parties you mean anyone who isn't 100% all-in on globalism?
    - cindyllm 2mo ago
      [dead]
pembrook 2mo ago
Yes, it’s an argument but there’s zero data to support it, in fact the opposite. If this were true then widespread availability of pornography on the internet would have resulted in a massive increase in rape of adult females. When in fact, assault numbers have been on a steady decline for decades.
- IncreasePosts 2mo ago
  Why would general pornography lead to rape? Most pornography is not rape pornography. Would people watching a bunch of rape pornography lead to more rapes? I don't know, but that seems more likely than general pornography leading to rapes. 60% of respondents who were found looking for CSAM on the dark web stated that they were fearful that consuming CSAM would lead them to do something to a child in real life: https://doi.org/10.54501/jots.v1i2.29 https://doi.org/10.54501/jots.v1i2.29
  - pembrook 2mo ago
    Does it need to be said that by making all pornography easier to access the internet obviously makes rape pornography more prevalent and easier to access as well? Hence your theory should be easily visible in rape statistics, yet it’s the opposite.
    - IncreasePosts 2mo ago
      It would be easily visible or not visible in the rape statistics if the world had a single variable. In any case, even if the world was extremely simple, 'rape porn' could increase rapes, and we could still observe a decrease in rapes if 'general porn' decreased the odds of rape to a larger degree than rape porn increased them relative to the population that consumed each.
      - pembrook 2mo ago
        Yes exactly my point...so it sounds like you're admitting this "availability of porn leading to action" theory isn't a very good one? And that in fact it leads to less action given it satisfies urges at much lower cost.

There's also the argument that CSAM can act as a gateway leading people from just being a pedophile in their head, to going out and doing something to some child.

MichaelDickens 2mo ago

Yes, this is an argument that exists. But it's not supported by evidence. It's the same as the old "video game violence should be outlawed because it might cause real violence", which is just as unsubstantiated.

ButlerianJihad 2mo ago
Yeah, that old canard is ridiculous! I mean, if there were any truth to it, surely our nation would have seen an uptick, in the past 30–40 years, of new generations picking up guns and just mercilessly mowing down soft targets as if playing GTA. Thankfully, that is all confined to fantasy in cyberspace!
- Ardon 2mo ago
  Yeah, /your/ nation maybe. I wonder if there's any other reasons that could explain this, especially given the pretty uniform distribution of video games, and the extremely uneven distribution of violence. Oh, and everywhere in your nation? At the same time? Sorry, I think I have a button.
- ButlerianJihad 2mo ago
  https://youtu.be/g7tII_3WXqo?is=MagnO5GswnVJJltM https://youtu.be/g7tII_3WXqo?is=MagnO5GswnVJJltM Mother Shares How Video Games Radicalized Her Son to Run Around and Pick up Coins
- john_strinlai 2mo ago
  gta is played all around the world yet only one country is an outlier in mass shootings. perhaps there is more to it?
- tancop 2mo ago
  school shootings happen when lonely boys with mental health issues a) have access to guns and b) feel like society failed them and they need to take revenge. the first one is the reason why it happens it america more than any other place. other countries also have youth unemployment and social isolation but they show up as bullying in schools or votes for fascist parties instead of mass murder. the actual problem is people feeling hopeless, like theres no way they could ever be successful in this world so they want to burn it down. thats why some of them turn violent, when you feel like nothing you can do will make life better the only thing left is making it worse for those you think are responsible, like your classmates or gay/queer people or Jews. none of this comes down to video games, feminism, rap music, violent movies, atheism or other cultural "problems" conservatives always like to blame. its a social issue that needs social solutions.
  - inigyou 2mo ago
    > fascist parties you mean anyone who isn't 100% all-in on globalism?
  - cindyllm 2mo ago
    [dead]

pembrook 2mo ago

Yes, it’s an argument but there’s zero data to support it, in fact the opposite. If this were true then widespread availability of pornography on the internet would have resulted in a massive increase in rape of adult females. When in fact, assault numbers have been on a steady decline for decades.

IncreasePosts 2mo ago
Why would general pornography lead to rape? Most pornography is not rape pornography. Would people watching a bunch of rape pornography lead to more rapes? I don't know, but that seems more likely than general pornography leading to rapes. 60% of respondents who were found looking for CSAM on the dark web stated that they were fearful that consuming CSAM would lead them to do something to a child in real life: https://doi.org/10.54501/jots.v1i2.29 https://doi.org/10.54501/jots.v1i2.29
- pembrook 2mo ago
  Does it need to be said that by making all pornography easier to access the internet obviously makes rape pornography more prevalent and easier to access as well? Hence your theory should be easily visible in rape statistics, yet it’s the opposite.
  - IncreasePosts 2mo ago
    It would be easily visible or not visible in the rape statistics if the world had a single variable. In any case, even if the world was extremely simple, 'rape porn' could increase rapes, and we could still observe a decrease in rapes if 'general porn' decreased the odds of rape to a larger degree than rape porn increased them relative to the population that consumed each.
    - pembrook 2mo ago
      Yes exactly my point...so it sounds like you're admitting this "availability of porn leading to action" theory isn't a very good one? And that in fact it leads to less action given it satisfies urges at much lower cost.