3 ms·

Three sacred cows that must die so Europe can live

7 points by backlit4034 3mo ago

abc42 3mo ago
Throw into that same fire also every Russian psyop attempt at destabilizing the West. Such as every alt-right/nu-right political party that sprang up over the last 30 years in Europe, brexit, QAnon, climate change denialism, Trump and all of MAGA, anti-vax, etc etc etc. I suspect that DHH is not so willing to meet at the center. He might be a great software/business leader, but politically he's just another whiner who at best will achieve nothing and at worst will be another Elon Musk.
- romanhounds 3mo ago
  [flagged]
  - deleted 3mo ago
    [deleted]
  - throw310822 3mo ago
    But how, exactly? Their political weight, at the moment, is negligible. Their economic impact is probably neutral to positive (workers for the economy). They do foster a discontent that expresses itself in vote for right-wing, populist parties- and this is indeed destabilising but not the direct fault of immigration, rather of our reaction to it.
  - abc42 3mo ago
    It's standard playbook that they do not create these situations. That would be completely obvious and thus ineffective. Instead, they pick existing or upcoming trends and make them worse.
  - archagon 3mo ago
    "Hordes," huh? Is that how your mother taught you to talk about other people?
- f30e3dfed1c9 3mo ago
  > He might be a great software/business leader There is little to no evidence of him as a great business leader. How many people does his company employ? I don't think it's as many as a hundred. This is the scale of, say, a single car dealership.
  - abc42 3mo ago
    That's a bit insane criticism to lay on him. 37signals is a 27 year old company and Basecamp has been a profitable product for more than a decade. Success is not measured by the number of people you employ.
    - f30e3dfed1c9 3mo ago
      That's a successful small business, not a claim to "greatness."
    - rsynnott 3mo ago
      Sure, but you wouldn't generally call someone who runs a mature small business a "great business leader". He's basically just a blogger; no particular reason to pay attention.
Unified-Mentor 3mo ago
[dead]
bell-cot 3mo ago
I could agree with his title, but not with any of his chosen cows.
- graemep 3mo ago
  Its been clear what he is politically since his "London is not white enough" post. He has only got worse since
throw310822 3mo ago
I'm not a defender of mass immigration- in fact I find all arguments in favour of it (or just fatalistic about it) to be naive or well-intentioned non sequiturs. Yet, I don't see how it is contributing to the decline of Europe, which is entirely endogenous- a product of Europe's fragmented history and culture. The only real macro impact of mass immigration is, for the time being, the discontent and slide towards populism that it fosters. But I'd be curious to hear what makes it one of the great problems of Europe now according to the author- the article doesn't even try to explain it.
- graemep 3mo ago
  The author wants to blame immigrants. I do not think it is fragmented culture either. There is no clear patter of bigger being better. I think it is complacency, bad government, and a decline in efficiency. I do agree it is endogenous.
  - throw310822 3mo ago
    It's cultural- European culture puts much more emphasis on safety and security and collective good vs individual freedom and reward. Plus it has sclerotic bureaucracies, and old nation-states that refuse to relinquish their power in favour of a collective entity- which results in a lot of uncoordinated or even adversarial actions. The collective entity finally might be even impossible given the linguistics and cultural differences between the various countries and the reciprocal, well entrenched distrust. All not necessarily in this order. One per theory of mine is that immigrants actually might help breaking up this course of things: as people with no built up wealth and much less to lose, they might be willing to work harder and risk more; and they might be more indifferent towards the national stereotypes that are still a source of mistrust between europeans.
    - graemep 3mo ago
      That culture varies a lot between countries, but they share a direction of travel. > a collective entity IMO is likely to create more bureaucracy rather than less. I am convinced it is impossible without a common identity and culture. > immigrants actually might help breaking up this course of things: as people with no built up wealth and much less to lose, they might be willing to work harder and risk more Possibly, but only the first generation. Not even them in countries (the UK does this, I am sure other countries do too) that strongly favour immigrants with money or who are highly skilled. On the other hand, I think one of the advantages the US has over Europe is its ability to attract high skilled immigrants.
ath3nd 3mo ago
[dead]
effed3 3mo ago
just (bad) opinions, without even minimal evidences of of -real- facts. The crisis of Europe is way more in the massive investment in speculative finance than in real in-house investments and development, in the past 30 years. results? No resources = no strategic tech, no defence, no cheap energy, low employments, no higher wages, no redistribution, no public sanity, austerity to keep orders in states finances = no resources for development, and so spiraling downward. Blaming immigration, green-tech and fighting-succes (?!) is simply brainless vapor.
Arodex 3mo ago
- Ethnic Cleansing - Burn the world - Believe Americans won't punish us for copying them There is not a single neuron, either logical nor moral, left in that idiot's head. Just money and hate.
- jboss10 3mo ago
  The second point is funny. I don't think not using air conditioning due to energy use is why Europeans don't have AC. (I'm European). It's beacuse it's expensive and difficult to retrofit. And we are getting more AC, lots of new buildings have it. I agree with the article that Europeans should install more AC and that worrying about climate change isn't a valid reason not to. But this isn't because I don't beleve in climate change, it's because I don't agree with the idea of a climate footprint, and that people should worry about their own energy usage. They should worry about energy generation and green energy policy. The rest of the article is either racist or ridiculous.
lordkrandel 3mo ago
Oh at least some reaction to this right wing extremist. Thank you HN, make me feel proud! ^^
garte 3mo ago
the question is how europe and the us will manage degrowth. atm europe is ahead while the us is acting like a spoilt child calling for more cars and ac.
archagon 3mo ago
Someday soon, I trust the present tide of white supremacy will turn. What will racist creeps like DHH do then? There’s no taking these dehumanizing words back. They are opting themselves out of participation in a future world. At the very least, it’s utterly boneheaded business acumen. If I was working at this company, I’d run for the door.

7 points by backlit4034 3mo ago

abc42 3mo ago

Throw into that same fire also every Russian psyop attempt at destabilizing the West. Such as every alt-right/nu-right political party that sprang up over the last 30 years in Europe, brexit, QAnon, climate change denialism, Trump and all of MAGA, anti-vax, etc etc etc. I suspect that DHH is not so willing to meet at the center. He might be a great software/business leader, but politically he's just another whiner who at best will achieve nothing and at worst will be another Elon Musk.

romanhounds 3mo ago
[flagged]
- deleted 3mo ago
  [deleted]
- throw310822 3mo ago
  But how, exactly? Their political weight, at the moment, is negligible. Their economic impact is probably neutral to positive (workers for the economy). They do foster a discontent that expresses itself in vote for right-wing, populist parties- and this is indeed destabilising but not the direct fault of immigration, rather of our reaction to it.
- abc42 3mo ago
  It's standard playbook that they do not create these situations. That would be completely obvious and thus ineffective. Instead, they pick existing or upcoming trends and make them worse.
- archagon 3mo ago
  "Hordes," huh? Is that how your mother taught you to talk about other people?
f30e3dfed1c9 3mo ago
> He might be a great software/business leader There is little to no evidence of him as a great business leader. How many people does his company employ? I don't think it's as many as a hundred. This is the scale of, say, a single car dealership.
- abc42 3mo ago
  That's a bit insane criticism to lay on him. 37signals is a 27 year old company and Basecamp has been a profitable product for more than a decade. Success is not measured by the number of people you employ.
  - f30e3dfed1c9 3mo ago
    That's a successful small business, not a claim to "greatness."
  - rsynnott 3mo ago
    Sure, but you wouldn't generally call someone who runs a mature small business a "great business leader". He's basically just a blogger; no particular reason to pay attention.

Unified-Mentor 3mo ago

[dead]

bell-cot 3mo ago

I could agree with his title, but not with any of his chosen cows.

graemep 3mo ago
Its been clear what he is politically since his "London is not white enough" post. He has only got worse since

throw310822 3mo ago

I'm not a defender of mass immigration- in fact I find all arguments in favour of it (or just fatalistic about it) to be naive or well-intentioned non sequiturs. Yet, I don't see how it is contributing to the decline of Europe, which is entirely endogenous- a product of Europe's fragmented history and culture. The only real macro impact of mass immigration is, for the time being, the discontent and slide towards populism that it fosters. But I'd be curious to hear what makes it one of the great problems of Europe now according to the author- the article doesn't even try to explain it.

graemep 3mo ago
The author wants to blame immigrants. I do not think it is fragmented culture either. There is no clear patter of bigger being better. I think it is complacency, bad government, and a decline in efficiency. I do agree it is endogenous.
- throw310822 3mo ago
  It's cultural- European culture puts much more emphasis on safety and security and collective good vs individual freedom and reward. Plus it has sclerotic bureaucracies, and old nation-states that refuse to relinquish their power in favour of a collective entity- which results in a lot of uncoordinated or even adversarial actions. The collective entity finally might be even impossible given the linguistics and cultural differences between the various countries and the reciprocal, well entrenched distrust. All not necessarily in this order. One per theory of mine is that immigrants actually might help breaking up this course of things: as people with no built up wealth and much less to lose, they might be willing to work harder and risk more; and they might be more indifferent towards the national stereotypes that are still a source of mistrust between europeans.
  - graemep 3mo ago
    That culture varies a lot between countries, but they share a direction of travel. > a collective entity IMO is likely to create more bureaucracy rather than less. I am convinced it is impossible without a common identity and culture. > immigrants actually might help breaking up this course of things: as people with no built up wealth and much less to lose, they might be willing to work harder and risk more Possibly, but only the first generation. Not even them in countries (the UK does this, I am sure other countries do too) that strongly favour immigrants with money or who are highly skilled. On the other hand, I think one of the advantages the US has over Europe is its ability to attract high skilled immigrants.

ath3nd 3mo ago

[dead]

effed3 3mo ago

just (bad) opinions, without even minimal evidences of of -real- facts. The crisis of Europe is way more in the massive investment in speculative finance than in real in-house investments and development, in the past 30 years. results? No resources = no strategic tech, no defence, no cheap energy, low employments, no higher wages, no redistribution, no public sanity, austerity to keep orders in states finances = no resources for development, and so spiraling downward. Blaming immigration, green-tech and fighting-succes (?!) is simply brainless vapor.

Arodex 3mo ago

- Ethnic Cleansing - Burn the world - Believe Americans won't punish us for copying them There is not a single neuron, either logical nor moral, left in that idiot's head. Just money and hate.

jboss10 3mo ago
The second point is funny. I don't think not using air conditioning due to energy use is why Europeans don't have AC. (I'm European). It's beacuse it's expensive and difficult to retrofit. And we are getting more AC, lots of new buildings have it. I agree with the article that Europeans should install more AC and that worrying about climate change isn't a valid reason not to. But this isn't because I don't beleve in climate change, it's because I don't agree with the idea of a climate footprint, and that people should worry about their own energy usage. They should worry about energy generation and green energy policy. The rest of the article is either racist or ridiculous.

lordkrandel 3mo ago

Oh at least some reaction to this right wing extremist. Thank you HN, make me feel proud! ^^

garte 3mo ago

the question is how europe and the us will manage degrowth. atm europe is ahead while the us is acting like a spoilt child calling for more cars and ac.

archagon 3mo ago

Someday soon, I trust the present tide of white supremacy will turn. What will racist creeps like DHH do then? There’s no taking these dehumanizing words back. They are opting themselves out of participation in a future world. At the very least, it’s utterly boneheaded business acumen. If I was working at this company, I’d run for the door.