4 ms·

Do people want to restrict 16 year olds with phones? That seems like a really bad idea. For 10 year olds it makes sense, but 16 is nearly adult; they need to re

• testing22321 3mo ago
  Do people really want to restrict 16 year olds with alcohol? 16 is nearly adult, they need to learn responsibility
  • mirashii 3mo ago
    This metaphor, while it seems intended to challenge the OP, kinda reinforces it. Many countries and cultures give some limited access to alcohol at a younger age, and the result is generally that they end up having fewer instances of problematic binge drinking when they come of age. A little bit of exposure instead of complete abstention helps people learn to have a healthier relationship than letting them hit 21 and dropping them into the deep end unrestricted.
  • skhr0680 3mo ago
    Teenagers learning how to have a couple of beers with a meal would be an improvement on them turning 18/20/21 and going and getting hammered on shots
    • socalgal2 3mo ago
      It's interesting how many conclusions are being assumed here In many countries cultures, strict parents/laws are seen as loving and protecting. Being told "don't drink untl you're at least 20" isn't seen as "forbidden fruit" you're being denied.
      • Dylan16807 3mo ago
        What countries do you have in mind? I find it hard to believe you can tell teenagers not to do some kind of fun activity based purely on age and cause no significant feelings of forbidden fruit.
    • tonyedgecombe 3mo ago
      I think the evidence points the other way. Giving younger people a drink with their meal during adolescence leads to more drinking problems later in life.
      • graemep 3mo ago
        As far as I know the evidence points to getting drunk younger leads to more drinking problems later in life. Drinking moderately younger leads to fewer.
        • tonyedgecombe 3mo ago
          I don't think so although I can't find the report I read right now.
        • saghm 3mo ago
          Is that data from kids who drank without adult supervision? It's hard to tell without more context if you're proving or disproving the point that's been made, which is that maybe learning how to drink responsibly with parents could lead to better outcomes than binging with buddies at parties when there are no adults around, which is a lot more common when adult are super strict about it (I'm saying this as someone who literally never drinks and never has; I've literally not had a beer or a glass of wine in my life, so I'm about as far from an apologist as I can imagine)
          • graemep 3mo ago
            IIRC its kids who drank without adult supervision or with adults who allowed them to drink excessively (e.g. people who had alcohol problems themselves). I definitely think it is a result of learning more responsible habits from adults, with supervision of what and how much they are allowed to drink. There is a huge difference between having a glass of wine (and maybe starting with diluted wine as mine did) with a family meal and spirits with mixers with friends who themselves do not have good habits. I think this applies to a lot of other things too: kids need to learn good habits and behaviour from adults in general. I sometimes wonder whether the worst effect on kids of phones is that they get less attention from distracted adults.
    • schnitzelstoat 3mo ago
      In Europe, I think it is more common tbh. Even in the UK my dad would let me try making cocktails etc. at the weekend when I was 17. It meant when I got to university I knew how much I could drink (although as a student I was too poor to drink much anyway haha) whereas there were people drinking like half a bottle of vodka. I don't drink any alcohol nowadays so it's not like it turned me into an alcoholic either.
      • graemep 3mo ago
        Its usually in the UK in my experience to give teenagers wine, beer or cider with meals. 16 year olds can currently have them with a meal in a restaurant or pub. Until a few years ago it was 14. > It meant when I got to university I knew how much I could drink (although as a student I was too poor to drink much anyway haha) whereas there were people drinking like half a bottle of vodka. I gave my kids some alcoholic drinks for just that reason.
      • marysol5 3mo ago
        The UK law on drinking is age 6 :D
  • Dylan16807 3mo ago
    It would be nice to ease people into alcohol over a greater amount of time, but with phones you're using them constantly and "avoid it" or "only have two" are not workable solutions like they are with alcohol.
  • deleted 3mo ago
    [deleted]
  • quotz 3mo ago
    In parts of europe you can legally drink wine and beer at the age of 14-16. In many parts of europe you start drinking alcohol at around 14-15 illegally but socially acceptable to some extent. I started at that age, which is the same age adolescents start going out and dating.
  • laserlight 3mo ago
    I appreciate giving another perspective, but alcohol is not a good analogue of phone. There's no need to “learn” how to use alcohol --- one can do without it. Yet, practically speaking, a phone is a necessity.
    • toofy 3mo ago
      > practically speaking, a phone is a necessity. no. it isn’t. my apologies for sounding more blunt than im meaning to, but, im not at all sure where i would fall on the idea of banning kids from having social media powered phones, but i know they’re not a “necessity”.
      • laserlight 3mo ago
        I could have been clearer. A phone is practically a necessity of modern life. Sooner or later people have to use it, unlike alcohol. Whether social media is a necessity is a different question. I bet everyone gets their own dose of it, whether they like it or not.
        • defrost 3mo ago
          > A phone is practically a necessity of modern life. It isn't yet. > Sooner or later people have to use it, unlike alcohol. So far I've avoided having a smart phone, I've not had a mobile phone since flip phones - I went off always being contactable about that time, having had bleeding edge sat phones for decades. I have a land line, an answering machine, travel, purchase, am part of several overlapping businesses and deliver work for clients. eMail, cash, debit cards still get me by <shrug>
          • laserlight 3mo ago
            > It isn't yet. Would you care to elaborate how you don't think a phone is not “practically necessary”? I have never personally met someone like you. I've never known someone who personally met someone like you either. Theoretically, nothing is a necessity. That's why I wrote “practically”. Practically nobody lives like you do.
  • mcv 3mo ago
    16 used to be the minimum drinking age in Netherland, until they raised it to 18. It wouldn't surprise me if there were still countries where it's 16. But it's not really a fair comparison, because alcohol has a very direct detrimental effect on brain development. Many things can have a detrimental effect, but alcohol always does. Which is probably why they raised the age to 18.
• alwa 3mo ago
  Seems wise to experience at least a little bit of “functioning as an adult in the world” independently of phone habits… It seems like, in this situation, we watch primarily non-phone-enabled virtues save the day: a clear sense of right and wrong, assertiveness, courage, steadiness in a tense situation, an attentive social environment with bystanders who both noticed and backed each other up… Even having practiced some of those skills in moving through the world, I worry that, if I were a phone-carrying person, I’d be tempted to “just record it and let the internet sort it out.” Which is orthogonal to fixing the wrong in the moment.
  • sheept 3mo ago
    The severity depends on where you are, even within a country, but in many places you can't authentically "function as an adult in the world" without a phone, unless you want to roleplay an adult from the previous century. In some places, payment requires a phone. Tracking unreliable public transit requires a phone. Getting rideshare requires a phone. The issue probably isn't the phone but letting them outside in the first place.
    • RealityVoid 3mo ago
      This is obviously an overstatement. Sure, a phone is convenient, but we managed to function just fine without smartphones. I assure you, it's possible to do all those things without a phone.
      • fragmede 3mo ago
        Without knowing where GP is posting from, you can't make that claim. We can want and wish it were true, but there exist places where it's no longer possible to do things without a phone because the service requires signing in online, or the form is only available via the website, there is no paper version anymore. Parts of the world are moving on from bits of paper, no matter how much you don't want that to be true. Parts of the world also aren't, we simply don't know where GP is so you can't make that claim.
• GeekyBear 3mo ago
  Personally, I would rather see public resources used to teach parents how to use the existing controls (in iOS and Android) to restrict what their own kids can do on their own smartphone. However, if a school district wants to restrict the use of smartphones during the school day for all students, I would be OK with that.
  • Triphibian 3mo ago
    Where's the setting to make YouTube not display shorts?
    • pluralmonad 3mo ago
      This works for me: echo "0.0.0.0 youtube.com www.youtube.com m.youtube.com" | sudo tee -a /etc/hosts
      • amtamt 3mo ago
        One really does that on phones?
        • marysol5 3mo ago
          You'd have to root it....which breaks most functionality even if you do it. So it's a flat no
      • InvisibleUp 3mo ago
        That’s all of YouTube. There’s some good stuff on there, just not in the “Shorts” tab.
        • Dylan16807 3mo ago
          > There’s some good stuff on there, just not in the “Shorts” tab. Why do people get so weird about the shorts tab? There are perfectly good videos in there, they're just tilted weird. You can fit quality content into 3 minutes. And remember Elsagate? That was entirely landscape videos.
• NoMoreNicksLeft 3mo ago
  > And of course they need a phone when they go out like these girls. Do teens need phones? Sure, they need a phone. Arguably any child old enough to know how to make a phone call needs one. But do they need a miniature computer to scroll through AI slop 10+ hours a day? These aren't the same question. Confusing these two is dangerous.
  • makeitdouble 3mo ago
    > make a phone call Kids don't want to call, and parents don't want to receive calls except for critical situations. Only elders and scammers are actually phoning. > AI slop Same deal as what the GP is pointing at: you need to train kids to deal with slop, and not have them face it on their own at once at some arbitrary adult age.
    • jjulius 3mo ago
      I'm a parent in my 30's. Call me up anytime, for whatever. Always down to chat!
    • NoMoreNicksLeft 3mo ago
      >Same deal as what the GP is pointing at: you need to train kids to deal with slop, Sure. That's why I have mine mainlining China White. How will they learn to deal with addictive substances unless they're waist-deep in it?
      • makeitdouble 3mo ago
        If you're waist deep in China White, you may as well teach your kids about it, get them as much knowledge as possible, and how to stay clear of it. Letting choose a different path than you is IMHO the minimum you should be doing.
        • NoMoreNicksLeft 3mo ago
          Maybe back in some earlier era when we all had so many children that 3 or 4 were basically disposable, stupid parenting methods like "letting them learn to deal with this ruinously dangerous vice on their own" would have worked (or maybe there's a reason no one did that then). But for those of you that have just the one or two, this is well beyond reckless. Nothing I could ever say will persuade you otherwise, and even observation of reality won't help since the aftermath will play out for 50 or more years. Good luck, you'll need it.
• mdavid626 3mo ago
  Give them a bottle of scotch and pack of cigarettes as well.
  • toofy 3mo ago
    yeah i’m not sure where people are coming from when they imply the best way to fight off an extremely addictive thing is to use it. we warn kids about the impacts of heroin, we don’t shoot them up with it.
    • mdavid626 3mo ago
      Feels like the seventies. Remember the time when tobacco CEO-s sweared, that they didn’t know cigarettes are unhealthy?
• abc42 3mo ago
  I'm for very restrictive digital device and service use for children and I also think that 16 is roughly the age when most or all of those restrictions can be lifted.
• toasty228 3mo ago
  > but 16 is nearly adult On paper yes, biologically not really