4 ms·

Unfortunately this is not just precarious, it's extremely vulnerable to changing political conditions. Many of the food bank services in my state have lost sig

Unfortunately this is not just precarious, it's extremely vulnerable to changing political conditions. Many of the food bank services in my state have lost significant funding owing to the use of words like 'women' or 'black' in their grants, which were duly grepped for and shut down. https://www.whitehouse.gov/wp-content/uploads/2025/05/Cuts-to-Woke-Programs-Fact-Sheet.pdf https://www.whitehouse.gov/wp-content/uploads/2025/05/Cuts-t... Civilization can't rely effectively on systems that are this fragile.

StilesCrisis 3mo ago
> Civilization can't rely effectively on systems that are this fragile. That's American politics in a nutshell. We've spent 250 years assuming scruples and common decency would be sufficient.
- nradov 3mo ago
  Is it not sufficient? Americans give more to charity than citizens of any other developed country. The arguments that all food aid should be routed through government bureaucracies are entirely unconvincing. I'd rather donate to organizations like Second Harvest than pay higher taxes. https://www.shfb.org/ https://www.shfb.org/
  - xboxnolifes 3mo ago
    Does this account for the portion of taxes that go to the type of efforts that donations do? If not, is it really giving more? OR is it giving less and feeling better about it?
    - gowld 3mo ago
      On average, Americans donate 1-2% of income, while spending 7-20% less on contributions to government. On the other hand, Americans receive less for the government, and spend more on caring for themselves (health care) than Europeans receive from the government. To sort that you, you'd have to figure out how cost-efficient the two models are, for services provided.
  - DFHippie 3mo ago
    We used to live in a world where individual virtue was what everyone fell back on. That is the default state. It has many problems -- free riding by the selfish, for one, but also a lack of capacity to prepare for large-scale disasters like the Great Depression. We have a government precisely to solve this sort of problem. It works (when it is competent and not corrupt) for defense, international trade, and the enforcement of law. Solving resource distribution and aid coordination is right in its wheelhouse.
  - DFHippie 3mo ago
    It is my understanding that this claim about Americans' charitable giving does not disaggregate giving to food banks, Girl Scout cookie drives, political causes, the environment, cultural events, religious institutions, etc. Much of this charitable giving does not feed the hungry or house the homeless.
    - monkpit 3mo ago
      Plus the fact that there’s bias in the first place - citizens in a country where they know social programs will care for their needy would not need to donate.
      - DFHippie 3mo ago
        Right. You can vote for a government that will tax you and then fix misfortunes and injustices. It's probably a lot more effective and efficient than writing a check to a megachurch.
        fragmede 3mo ago
        The important question is who gets to fly private under the respective systems.
    - nradov 3mo ago
      Purchasing Girl Scout cookies isn't counted as a charitable donation.
  - pixl97 3mo ago
    This is what happens when you don't think through a problem completely. >I'd rather donate to organizations like Second Harvest than pay higher taxes. I'm sure you would. And when economic hard times come you'll stop donating, and the people that need it the most will kick your door in and take what food you have to live another day, even at the risk of you shooting them because they'll die either way. Hence the argument of 'just donate' are just as unconvincing to me.

StilesCrisis 3mo ago

> Civilization can't rely effectively on systems that are this fragile. That's American politics in a nutshell. We've spent 250 years assuming scruples and common decency would be sufficient.

nradov 3mo ago
Is it not sufficient? Americans give more to charity than citizens of any other developed country. The arguments that all food aid should be routed through government bureaucracies are entirely unconvincing. I'd rather donate to organizations like Second Harvest than pay higher taxes. https://www.shfb.org/ https://www.shfb.org/
- xboxnolifes 3mo ago
  Does this account for the portion of taxes that go to the type of efforts that donations do? If not, is it really giving more? OR is it giving less and feeling better about it?
  - gowld 3mo ago
    On average, Americans donate 1-2% of income, while spending 7-20% less on contributions to government. On the other hand, Americans receive less for the government, and spend more on caring for themselves (health care) than Europeans receive from the government. To sort that you, you'd have to figure out how cost-efficient the two models are, for services provided.
- DFHippie 3mo ago
  We used to live in a world where individual virtue was what everyone fell back on. That is the default state. It has many problems -- free riding by the selfish, for one, but also a lack of capacity to prepare for large-scale disasters like the Great Depression. We have a government precisely to solve this sort of problem. It works (when it is competent and not corrupt) for defense, international trade, and the enforcement of law. Solving resource distribution and aid coordination is right in its wheelhouse.
- DFHippie 3mo ago
  It is my understanding that this claim about Americans' charitable giving does not disaggregate giving to food banks, Girl Scout cookie drives, political causes, the environment, cultural events, religious institutions, etc. Much of this charitable giving does not feed the hungry or house the homeless.
  - monkpit 3mo ago
    Plus the fact that there’s bias in the first place - citizens in a country where they know social programs will care for their needy would not need to donate.
    - DFHippie 3mo ago
      Right. You can vote for a government that will tax you and then fix misfortunes and injustices. It's probably a lot more effective and efficient than writing a check to a megachurch.
      - fragmede 3mo ago
        The important question is who gets to fly private under the respective systems.
  - nradov 3mo ago
    Purchasing Girl Scout cookies isn't counted as a charitable donation.
- pixl97 3mo ago
  This is what happens when you don't think through a problem completely. >I'd rather donate to organizations like Second Harvest than pay higher taxes. I'm sure you would. And when economic hard times come you'll stop donating, and the people that need it the most will kick your door in and take what food you have to live another day, even at the risk of you shooting them because they'll die either way. Hence the argument of 'just donate' are just as unconvincing to me.