4 ms·
Funny idea but wow the gameplay is terrible and full of bugs. Bad hitboxes, shells that bounce in front of holes, bad physics. AI still cannot oneshot 2D platf
by goldenarm 3mo ago
Funny idea but wow the gameplay is terrible and full of bugs. Bad hitboxes, shells that bounce in front of holes, bad physics.
AI still cannot oneshot 2D platformers, the most documented videogame genre with so much source code available.
- slopinthebag 3mo agoNot to mention it feels like 30hz on my 120hz monitor. It's actually impressive how it managed to mess that up. But yeah guys, AI sure will be writing all the code just give it another 6 months...
- tavavex 3mo agoIt feels like each new SOTA model brings the average quality a bit closer to the asymptote of well-made non-vibecoded software but it can't quite cross it.
- nsxwolf 3mo agoJust amazing how right a few people at Nintendo got this in 1985, and its still so easy to get it absolutely wrong.
- reactordev 3mo agoNintendo wasn’t even trying, it was all their old sprite characters from Japan market that didn’t do well smashed together in a rushed title for an NA launch. It surprised them.
- Wowfunhappy 3mo agoHuh? This is very much not my understanding of SMB1’s development. Are you maybe thinking of Donkey Kong (made to replace a failed arcade game) and/or the US version of SMB2 (a re-skinned non-Mario Japanese game)?
- reactordev 3mo agoNope, SMB1 was a smash up. SMB2 was made by folks that had no idea what they were doing so SMB3 went back to basics. I very much remember the sequence of events. Mario Bro's (and Donkey Kong) were games on the Famicom in Japan that were decent. The issue was with Arcade's in Japan making more money than home systems so they introduced the Nintendo VS cabinets. This helped but it wasn't enough and so in 1985 they greenlit the Super Mario Bros proposal while dealing with the NA launch and the NYC event. Shigeru Miyamoto carried the development and he deserves the credit but corporate was throwing shit at the fan and seeing what sticked. He just so happened to have a plan that required less work from creative.
- uncivilized 3mo agoAny links to read more about this?
- reactordev 3mo agoMost of it has been lost to internet history but there are still some remnants left. https://grantland.com/features/the-rise-of-nintendo-video-games-history/ https://grantland.com/features/the-rise-of-nintendo-video-ga... https://iwataasks.nintendo.com/interviews/wii/mario25th/4/0/ https://iwataasks.nintendo.com/interviews/wii/mario25th/4/0/ https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/comments/2w1zl4/when_the_super_mario_bros_game_came_out_for_the/#:~:text=While%20the%20Nintendo%20Entertainment%20system,titles%20available%20at%20the%20start. https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/comments/2w1zl4/when_...
- uncivilized 3mo agoThanks!
- deleted 3mo ago[deleted]
- nsxwolf 3mo agoShigeru Miyamoto has spoken many times about the process of perfecting the controls for SMB, which is quite the opposite of "wasn't even trying".
- reactordev 3mo agoOh he absolutely cared about the programming and process of game development, don't get me wrong. It's that Nintendo (corporate) needed something for the NA market and he was eager to fill that gap with already used characters (such as Mario). Anything else is corporate propaganda they have been telling as a creation myth to make it sound more fairytale-like than it was. They were going broke. They needed money. North America was ripe for the picking. The risk paid off.
- input_sh 3mo agoOn the "bright side", it's impossible to die!
- disillusioned 3mo agoThat's the power of venture capital!
- miyoji 3mo agoThis was my favorite bit of meta-commentary: it doesn't matter how poorly you play, you never lose!
- kridsdale1 3mo agoEven survived the Hegseth Bullet Bill attack
- thisisit 3mo agoMore like keeps "extending by 1 more week"
- mkagenius 3mo agoyou mean amodei
- zahlman 3mo agoIt seems that you do lose a life when hit by an enemy or falling in a pit, but the latter freezes until you click the toggle sound button, and running out of lives resets the counter to 3 and halves your "valuation".
- reactordev 3mo agoYou’re absolutely right! /s
- vunderba 3mo agoYep. Additionally having experimented pretty heavily in this space, I'll state that even with state-of-the-art models (like NB Pro or GPT-Image-2), good luck getting them to generate sprite sheets with consistent frames for animation particularly if you're shooting for a pixel art aesthetic. I've made a few sprite-based animations with AI assistance but it still required a fair amount of manual photoshop (or in my case Aseprite) post-processing.
- nananana9 3mo agoIf you're not going for pixel art, use the video to video models (the character swap ones that take in a video reference of the animation and a still of the character (the tiktok deepfake models)). You can e.g. download a run cycle from Mixamo, use Blender to render a video from whatever angle you wish, and feed that into the model along with your sprite on a green background, it's pretty much perfect.
- vunderba 3mo agoThanks for the info! I'll give this a shot. Most of my knowledge is from over a year ago, when I would set up OpenPose-style positioning with a controlnet at a high strength to guide an image-to-image workflow in comfyui. But it was pretty tedious and prone to errors.
- throwthrowuknow 3mo agoIt’s a tough problem but Retro Diffusion is making some incredible progress https://retrodiffusion.ai/ https://retrodiffusion.ai/
- vunderba 3mo agoNice. I need to go check them out again. I really liked their original Retro Diffusion models but this a while back in the SDXL days. It felt like it was trained on more natural language, so prompting it was quite nice for that era. But if they’ve been working on it specifically for animation, that’s pretty neat.
- dvt 3mo agoOne-shotting is a bit of a red herring, imo. Let's say I wanted to build a "Super Dario" meme platformer. I would do some research, find a platformer on Codepen or Github that "feels" good, tweak it to my liking, change the sprites, and voila. I constantly have to tell agents to just "look it up online" and "don't hallucinate your own components" because people have already done this a million times. Ironically, being more lazy could make these models more useful.
- bogwog 3mo agoSo you're saying that it's not fair to rate a coding model on its ability to code, and instead the best way to use it is to tell it to find existing human-written code online rather than generate actual code on its own?
- darkwater 3mo agoIsn't part of the human coding that Super Dario tells us LLM are going to replace also made of what you are saying GP is saying?
- dvt 3mo agoIf you're testing how good LLMs are at compressing information, then I think that's a fair test. Personally, I don't really think that's where their strength comes from (especially considering how much more useful local models that are orders of magnitude smaller than Claude/OpenAI-tier models have gotten). In other words, we already have a "super-intelligence"—it's called the internet, so just use the darn thing.
- deleted 3mo ago[deleted]
- sefrost 3mo agoYes for any slightly non-standard web UI components I either tell the LLM to search the web and find examples or I provide them myself. Usually the ones I provide myself are better than the ones they find themselves. I'm not super clear how they search the web or what they do and don't have access to. It seems to be quite fast.
- deleted 3mo ago[deleted]
- micromacrofoot 3mo agoI think that supports the premise more than it defies it
- boutell 3mo agoStrong agree. Very much part of the joke.
- uncivilized 3mo agoI don’t know if it’s showcasing that AI is still that bad, or if it’s purposely built to be this bad in a funny type of way.