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Do you pay API prices? Or are you on some of those plans that are deeply unprofitable? I am not even sure if API prices are actually profitable, but they certa

Do you pay API prices? Or are you on some of those plans that are deeply unprofitable? I am not even sure if API prices are actually profitable, but they certainly aren't as unprofitable as the subscription plan users. Either way, that's why you don't have access. It has nothing to do with capacity constraints.

user43928 4mo ago
We do not know whether subscription plans are unprofitable at all. Some estimates suggest that this is the case only for the heaviest users. Many seem to confuse API prices with the actual cost to serve the models, and thus reach the conclusion that subscriptions must be deeply unprofitable. Anthropic is officially citing capacity constraints with the intent to bring the Fable model back to subscriptions plans as soon as capacity allows.
- surgical_fire 4mo ago
  > We do not know whether subscription plans are unprofitable at all. That's pretty much certain. It's sort of cute when people like to pretend otherwise. > Many seem to confuse API prices with the actual cost to serve the models, and thus reach the conclusion that subscriptions must be deeply unprofitable. I don't make that mistake. I actually suspect that the actual costs may be higher than the API prices. I think those may still be subsidized. > Anthropic is officially citing capacity constraints with the intent to bring the Fable model back to subscriptions plans as soon as capacity allows. Yeah, I don't think they are being truthful at all.
  - anthonypasq 3mo ago
    > I don't make that mistake. I actually suspect that the actual costs may be higher than the API prices. I think those may still be subsidized. how are you still under this delusion? so you think that all the hosting companies on openrouter are just burning money selling GLM 5.2 tokens at 1/6th the cost of opus 4.8 api pricing? Mark Zuckerberg literally tweeted today that they are pricing Muse Spark 1.1 much lower because other companies have excessive margin.
    - surgical_fire 3mo ago
      > delusion It's not me the one that believes whatever comes out of the mouth of Zuckerberg.
      - anthonypasq 3mo ago
        I love how you think that is my primary argument. Want to address the openrouter point?

user43928 4mo ago

We do not know whether subscription plans are unprofitable at all. Some estimates suggest that this is the case only for the heaviest users. Many seem to confuse API prices with the actual cost to serve the models, and thus reach the conclusion that subscriptions must be deeply unprofitable. Anthropic is officially citing capacity constraints with the intent to bring the Fable model back to subscriptions plans as soon as capacity allows.

surgical_fire 4mo ago
> We do not know whether subscription plans are unprofitable at all. That's pretty much certain. It's sort of cute when people like to pretend otherwise. > Many seem to confuse API prices with the actual cost to serve the models, and thus reach the conclusion that subscriptions must be deeply unprofitable. I don't make that mistake. I actually suspect that the actual costs may be higher than the API prices. I think those may still be subsidized. > Anthropic is officially citing capacity constraints with the intent to bring the Fable model back to subscriptions plans as soon as capacity allows. Yeah, I don't think they are being truthful at all.
- anthonypasq 3mo ago
  > I don't make that mistake. I actually suspect that the actual costs may be higher than the API prices. I think those may still be subsidized. how are you still under this delusion? so you think that all the hosting companies on openrouter are just burning money selling GLM 5.2 tokens at 1/6th the cost of opus 4.8 api pricing? Mark Zuckerberg literally tweeted today that they are pricing Muse Spark 1.1 much lower because other companies have excessive margin.
  - surgical_fire 3mo ago
    > delusion It's not me the one that believes whatever comes out of the mouth of Zuckerberg.
    - anthonypasq 3mo ago
      I love how you think that is my primary argument. Want to address the openrouter point?