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I do not know what comes after the recognition. The broader public directs its outrage at whatever the algorithm surfaces […] while the structural rearrangement

I do not know what comes after the recognition. The broader public directs its outrage at whatever the algorithm surfaces […] while the structural rearrangement of their economic lives proceeds without organized resistance. I wish I knew the answer to this question: What shape would organized resistance have in this day and age, especially with the fragmentation of reality caused by social media? Myself and almost everyone in my social circles under the age of 50 seem well-primed to participate in such organized resistance, were it to come to life.

theoreticalmal 3mo ago
You’d revolt? Against what?
- toomuchtodo 3mo ago
  America’s flavor of Capitalism, through politics and policy, to center the human over capital. (Socialism support is ~62% of the under 30 cohort, and 2M voters 55+ age out every year, progress is a function of time and electorate turnover, with progress visible via observing outcomes at election milestones) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46529387 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46529387 (citations)
  - xhkkffbf 3mo ago
    The easiest way to do this is to leave the US. Why not go to Cuba? Or Venezuela? Or Russia? The options are out there.
    - sillyfluke 3mo ago
      Well, if you enjoy Trump era corruption, authoritarian strongman rule, and a great chasm between the haves and the have nots you can go to those countries as well. The options are open.
    - toomuchtodo 3mo ago
      Isn’t it easier to wait for the minority opposition to age out versus moving? As long as young voters show up to vote, you just have to be on the ballot (as almost every election since the presidential election has shown). Perhaps you’re asking the wrong folks to move, as the future and the country belong to its youth, not its elderly (who, by definition, are time constrained). “The dead should not rule the living." -— Jefferson “Progress occurs one funeral at a time.” —- Max Planck
      - xhkkffbf 3mo ago
        You can be on the plane tomorrow. If you're really committed to living under the beautiful Communist dream, it can be yours within 24 hours. Do you really think that it's going to just be Mamdani victory after Mamdani victory going forward and that in 10-20 years you'll be living in paradise? And, btw, the youth are also time constrained. Sorry to burst your bubble.
        toomuchtodo 3mo ago
        I’m committed to universal healthcare, living wages, heavily subsidized or no cost education, affordable housing (even if it’s public or social, like the Vienna model) and high progressive tax rates. Call it whatever you want, but it’s certainly not communism. It’s less brutalist capitalism. I expect it to take 5-10 years to see progress, at least. I’m prepared for a long haul. > Do you really think that it's going to just be Mamdani victory after Mamdani victory going forward and that in 10-20 years you'll be living in paradise? If young people keep voting for democratic socialist candidates and old voters and representatives keep aging out, yes, I see a positive political and policy trajectory to achieving progressive policies. It’s simply demographics and electorate turnover. It’s wild to me these are considered radical ideas, but humans are tricky, emotional, and driven by rigid mostly low information mental models.
        xhkkffbf 3mo ago
        That's a big if. Maybe you'll be right. But the odds are you'll find yourself like Germany as it watches Poland blast by it in GDP. Or maybe you'll be like England where recently 30k++ people were kicked off the National Health waiting list. Why? Because they died before the doctor could see them. And, hey, you've got low cost education already. It's called YouTube and Udemy and Coursera, but I'm sure you've got some nutty dream that only includes huge leafy campuses and aging Marxist professors like Donald Sutherland in "Animal House." It's some old vision of what "education" might be. But I'm here like the Mayor in "Wizard of Oz" to tell you that you and your cohort already has the power thanks to the Great Capitalist engine of Silicon Valley that built the Internet. One of these days the public housing projects in Vienna will get the Internet. I'm sure.
    - dqv 3mo ago
      You know, I thought, surely, by now, capitalists would be calling for reform to capitalism to prevent the weird ponzy scheme from shutting down, but it's the same clichés! Not even an interrogation of why people are souring to capitalism, just the same old tired response. Make sure you do 5 prayers to Bezos and another 5 to Thiel on your capitalism rosary ($14.99/month subscription). If you've run out of prayers for the month, they actually have a sale for the 4th of July, $8.99 gives you 12 more prayers! Golly, I could use those two extra prayers to pray to Musk.
  - Herring 3mo ago
    I don't know how much I really trust polls when it comes to Americans and socialism. Look what happened in 2008 https://news.gallup.com/poll/4708/healthcare-system.aspx https://news.gallup.com/poll/4708/healthcare-system.aspx (first graph) Democrats saw what seemed like a massive opportunity, took it, got punished very hard for 20 years. Issues of culture are sticky. I think it could take many decades for Americans to unlearn their brand of toxic individualism. Maybe centuries.
    - toomuchtodo 3mo ago
      Kiros is a good sign so far outside of NY, winning against a 30 year centrist incumbent in Colorado. Democratic socialist Melat Kiros poised to become the first Gen Z woman in Congress - https://www.npr.org/2026/07/01/nx-s1-5876122/colorado-primary-election-melat-kiros-democratic-socialist https://www.npr.org/2026/07/01/nx-s1-5876122/colorado-primar... - July 1st, 2026 Arizona is up next for testing and observing via election. Democratic Socialists are winning elections nationwide. Is Arizona Next? - https://www.azfamily.com/2026/07/04/democratic-socialists-are-winning-elections-nationwide-is-arizona-next/ https://www.azfamily.com/2026/07/04/democratic-socialists-ar... - July 3rd, 2026 Paul Krugman: There Are Very Few Socialists in America, but most of us are social democrats - https://paulkrugman.substack.com/p/there-are-very-few-socialists-in https://paulkrugman.substack.com/p/there-are-very-few-social... - July 2nd, 2026 > Issues of culture are sticky. I think it could take many decades for Americans to unlearn their brand of toxic individualism. Maybe centuries. Strongly agree. Much work ahead to change the dysfunctional American culture around hyper individualism. I hope it can be done in only a generation or two. My mental model on this is US religiosity decline. This is Not Simple Generational Replacement - https://www.graphsaboutreligion.com/p/can-millennials-save-the-american https://www.graphsaboutreligion.com/p/can-millennials-save-t... - April 23rd, 2026 When Are Half Your Members Going to be Dead? - https://www.graphsaboutreligion.com/p/when-are-half-your-members-going https://www.graphsaboutreligion.com/p/when-are-half-your-mem... - January 29th, 2026 The Generational Collapse of American Religion - https://www.graphsaboutreligion.com/p/the-generational-collapse-of-american https://www.graphsaboutreligion.com/p/the-generational-colla... - January 19th, 2026 Drop in U.S. Religiosity Among Largest in World - https://news.gallup.com/poll/697676/drop-religiosity-among-largest-world.aspx https://news.gallup.com/poll/697676/drop-religiosity-among-l... - November 13th, 2025 Some fun YC history I think is tagentially related to this topic of culture: Interview with Mr. Money Mustache - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15348384 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15348384 - September 2017 (284 comments) ("Don't start a blog, start a cult.")
arn3n 3mo ago
There’s the DSA. Organized resistance to the cost of living crisis in NYC has been mostly organized through them, to great popularity.
- cmxch 3mo ago
  Only to the activist class. Thankfully, Palantir and others were built to counter them.
- mancerayder 3mo ago
  The DSA has a narrow agenda: Israel is number one, second is immigration, racial and gender issues, maybe a distant other wish is actual socialist principles. In other words, it truly feels as though the left in the U.S., just as the right has done for years, narrowly focuses on culture and social issues... When economic issues should be the focus. "The rent is too high" stuff in NYC is just dressing - they only touched the rent stabilized units, which is half of the rental stock, and almost every mayor limits those increases. And it doesn't help anything. What happened to "Medicare for All" being #1? How did we get here, that Israel and ICE are number 1? Did we not learn from the Right about 'Wedge Issues'?
  - xhkkffbf 3mo ago
    Can anyone explain why they're so excited about immigration? It means downward pressure on wages and upward pressure on rents. Yet they claim they're doing it for the good of the current US residents. I can't figure it out.
    - mancerayder 3mo ago
      The immigration issue is very much tied to race, for the DSA and much of the Progressive movement. Let us just say it is not Ukrainian immigrants they're losing sleep over protecting.
  - lux-lux-lux 3mo ago
    Really? Because in practice DSA candidates seem very focused on bread and butter issues like affordability, housing, and M4A. Like, Mamdani was the only NY Dem not talking about Israel, your description is seriously baffling.
aleqs 3mo ago
I think we need to build open/cooperative products and services to replace anything that is run/owned by less-than-moral entities, while boycotting those entities as much as possible. We need better open, fair and secure methods/protocols/tools/platforms for cooperating/organizing as well.
- toomuchtodo 3mo ago
  https://ilsr.org/ https://ilsr.org/ https://www.fulu.org/ https://www.fulu.org/ https://www.usworker.coop/directory/ https://www.usworker.coop/directory/ https://atproto.com/ https://atproto.com/
  - aleqs 3mo ago
    Thank you!
bossyTeacher 3mo ago
> Myself and almost everyone in my social circles under the age of 50 seem well-primed to participate in such organized resistance, were it to come to life. You are assuming it hasn't. And besides, are you a revolution to come by way of your instagram/tik tok/Facebook feed? It won't. It's like a relationship, if everyone expects everyone else to make the first move, everyone loses.
noman-land 3mo ago
We need a new citizen run internet whose physical infrastructure is distributed and owned by people not companies.

theoreticalmal 3mo ago

You’d revolt? Against what?

toomuchtodo 3mo ago
America’s flavor of Capitalism, through politics and policy, to center the human over capital. (Socialism support is ~62% of the under 30 cohort, and 2M voters 55+ age out every year, progress is a function of time and electorate turnover, with progress visible via observing outcomes at election milestones) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46529387 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46529387 (citations)
- xhkkffbf 3mo ago
  The easiest way to do this is to leave the US. Why not go to Cuba? Or Venezuela? Or Russia? The options are out there.
  - sillyfluke 3mo ago
    Well, if you enjoy Trump era corruption, authoritarian strongman rule, and a great chasm between the haves and the have nots you can go to those countries as well. The options are open.
  - toomuchtodo 3mo ago
    Isn’t it easier to wait for the minority opposition to age out versus moving? As long as young voters show up to vote, you just have to be on the ballot (as almost every election since the presidential election has shown). Perhaps you’re asking the wrong folks to move, as the future and the country belong to its youth, not its elderly (who, by definition, are time constrained). “The dead should not rule the living." -— Jefferson “Progress occurs one funeral at a time.” —- Max Planck
    - xhkkffbf 3mo ago
      You can be on the plane tomorrow. If you're really committed to living under the beautiful Communist dream, it can be yours within 24 hours. Do you really think that it's going to just be Mamdani victory after Mamdani victory going forward and that in 10-20 years you'll be living in paradise? And, btw, the youth are also time constrained. Sorry to burst your bubble.
      - toomuchtodo 3mo ago
        I’m committed to universal healthcare, living wages, heavily subsidized or no cost education, affordable housing (even if it’s public or social, like the Vienna model) and high progressive tax rates. Call it whatever you want, but it’s certainly not communism. It’s less brutalist capitalism. I expect it to take 5-10 years to see progress, at least. I’m prepared for a long haul. > Do you really think that it's going to just be Mamdani victory after Mamdani victory going forward and that in 10-20 years you'll be living in paradise? If young people keep voting for democratic socialist candidates and old voters and representatives keep aging out, yes, I see a positive political and policy trajectory to achieving progressive policies. It’s simply demographics and electorate turnover. It’s wild to me these are considered radical ideas, but humans are tricky, emotional, and driven by rigid mostly low information mental models.
        xhkkffbf 3mo ago
        That's a big if. Maybe you'll be right. But the odds are you'll find yourself like Germany as it watches Poland blast by it in GDP. Or maybe you'll be like England where recently 30k++ people were kicked off the National Health waiting list. Why? Because they died before the doctor could see them. And, hey, you've got low cost education already. It's called YouTube and Udemy and Coursera, but I'm sure you've got some nutty dream that only includes huge leafy campuses and aging Marxist professors like Donald Sutherland in "Animal House." It's some old vision of what "education" might be. But I'm here like the Mayor in "Wizard of Oz" to tell you that you and your cohort already has the power thanks to the Great Capitalist engine of Silicon Valley that built the Internet. One of these days the public housing projects in Vienna will get the Internet. I'm sure.
  - dqv 3mo ago
    You know, I thought, surely, by now, capitalists would be calling for reform to capitalism to prevent the weird ponzy scheme from shutting down, but it's the same clichés! Not even an interrogation of why people are souring to capitalism, just the same old tired response. Make sure you do 5 prayers to Bezos and another 5 to Thiel on your capitalism rosary ($14.99/month subscription). If you've run out of prayers for the month, they actually have a sale for the 4th of July, $8.99 gives you 12 more prayers! Golly, I could use those two extra prayers to pray to Musk.
- Herring 3mo ago
  I don't know how much I really trust polls when it comes to Americans and socialism. Look what happened in 2008 https://news.gallup.com/poll/4708/healthcare-system.aspx https://news.gallup.com/poll/4708/healthcare-system.aspx (first graph) Democrats saw what seemed like a massive opportunity, took it, got punished very hard for 20 years. Issues of culture are sticky. I think it could take many decades for Americans to unlearn their brand of toxic individualism. Maybe centuries.
  - toomuchtodo 3mo ago
    Kiros is a good sign so far outside of NY, winning against a 30 year centrist incumbent in Colorado. Democratic socialist Melat Kiros poised to become the first Gen Z woman in Congress - https://www.npr.org/2026/07/01/nx-s1-5876122/colorado-primary-election-melat-kiros-democratic-socialist https://www.npr.org/2026/07/01/nx-s1-5876122/colorado-primar... - July 1st, 2026 Arizona is up next for testing and observing via election. Democratic Socialists are winning elections nationwide. Is Arizona Next? - https://www.azfamily.com/2026/07/04/democratic-socialists-are-winning-elections-nationwide-is-arizona-next/ https://www.azfamily.com/2026/07/04/democratic-socialists-ar... - July 3rd, 2026 Paul Krugman: There Are Very Few Socialists in America, but most of us are social democrats - https://paulkrugman.substack.com/p/there-are-very-few-socialists-in https://paulkrugman.substack.com/p/there-are-very-few-social... - July 2nd, 2026 > Issues of culture are sticky. I think it could take many decades for Americans to unlearn their brand of toxic individualism. Maybe centuries. Strongly agree. Much work ahead to change the dysfunctional American culture around hyper individualism. I hope it can be done in only a generation or two. My mental model on this is US religiosity decline. This is Not Simple Generational Replacement - https://www.graphsaboutreligion.com/p/can-millennials-save-the-american https://www.graphsaboutreligion.com/p/can-millennials-save-t... - April 23rd, 2026 When Are Half Your Members Going to be Dead? - https://www.graphsaboutreligion.com/p/when-are-half-your-members-going https://www.graphsaboutreligion.com/p/when-are-half-your-mem... - January 29th, 2026 The Generational Collapse of American Religion - https://www.graphsaboutreligion.com/p/the-generational-collapse-of-american https://www.graphsaboutreligion.com/p/the-generational-colla... - January 19th, 2026 Drop in U.S. Religiosity Among Largest in World - https://news.gallup.com/poll/697676/drop-religiosity-among-largest-world.aspx https://news.gallup.com/poll/697676/drop-religiosity-among-l... - November 13th, 2025 Some fun YC history I think is tagentially related to this topic of culture: Interview with Mr. Money Mustache - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15348384 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15348384 - September 2017 (284 comments) ("Don't start a blog, start a cult.")

arn3n 3mo ago

There’s the DSA. Organized resistance to the cost of living crisis in NYC has been mostly organized through them, to great popularity.

cmxch 3mo ago
Only to the activist class. Thankfully, Palantir and others were built to counter them.
mancerayder 3mo ago
The DSA has a narrow agenda: Israel is number one, second is immigration, racial and gender issues, maybe a distant other wish is actual socialist principles. In other words, it truly feels as though the left in the U.S., just as the right has done for years, narrowly focuses on culture and social issues... When economic issues should be the focus. "The rent is too high" stuff in NYC is just dressing - they only touched the rent stabilized units, which is half of the rental stock, and almost every mayor limits those increases. And it doesn't help anything. What happened to "Medicare for All" being #1? How did we get here, that Israel and ICE are number 1? Did we not learn from the Right about 'Wedge Issues'?
- xhkkffbf 3mo ago
  Can anyone explain why they're so excited about immigration? It means downward pressure on wages and upward pressure on rents. Yet they claim they're doing it for the good of the current US residents. I can't figure it out.
  - mancerayder 3mo ago
    The immigration issue is very much tied to race, for the DSA and much of the Progressive movement. Let us just say it is not Ukrainian immigrants they're losing sleep over protecting.
- lux-lux-lux 3mo ago
  Really? Because in practice DSA candidates seem very focused on bread and butter issues like affordability, housing, and M4A. Like, Mamdani was the only NY Dem not talking about Israel, your description is seriously baffling.

aleqs 3mo ago

I think we need to build open/cooperative products and services to replace anything that is run/owned by less-than-moral entities, while boycotting those entities as much as possible. We need better open, fair and secure methods/protocols/tools/platforms for cooperating/organizing as well.

toomuchtodo 3mo ago
https://ilsr.org/ https://ilsr.org/ https://www.fulu.org/ https://www.fulu.org/ https://www.usworker.coop/directory/ https://www.usworker.coop/directory/ https://atproto.com/ https://atproto.com/
- aleqs 3mo ago
  Thank you!

bossyTeacher 3mo ago

> Myself and almost everyone in my social circles under the age of 50 seem well-primed to participate in such organized resistance, were it to come to life. You are assuming it hasn't. And besides, are you a revolution to come by way of your instagram/tik tok/Facebook feed? It won't. It's like a relationship, if everyone expects everyone else to make the first move, everyone loses.

noman-land 3mo ago

We need a new citizen run internet whose physical infrastructure is distributed and owned by people not companies.