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Since then GM has dropped CarPlay. Rivian has appeared following Tesla and refusing to support it. And I thought there were some other existing manufacturer who

by MBCook 4mo ago

Since then GM has dropped CarPlay. Rivian has appeared following Tesla and refusing to support it. And I thought there were some other existing manufacturer who was either getting rid of it or thinking about it. Basically despite the popularity the market seems to be moving against it slowly. And the more those cars succeed the more other auto makers will be willing to follow.

bhhaskin 4mo ago
It's not that the market is moving away, but more like car companies realized if they want to sell monthly subscriptions in the future, they need to own the software.
- my_username_is_ 4mo ago
  This is crazy to me because the primary value proposition of Rivian's Connect+, as I see it, is enabling the hotspot while you're in the car and being able to monitor Gear Guard while you're away from the car. These are entirely separate from supporting CarPlay/Android Auto. If Rivian et al. truly want to sell a premium product, their software needs to be premium. And frankly it's just not there. The other day I was trying to listen to an upcoming album that has a few singles released. On my phone I can do that no problem. On the Rivian Spotify app, the album just didn't show up. It wasn't possible to play those songs in order without searching for the songs one by one. There are a ton of things that I love about my R1T, but as more time passes, the gap between what they offer and what other manufacturers offer becomes more and more apparent
- bitmasher9 4mo ago
  The car companies need to stay in their lanes on this one. You’re risking selling a >$40k piece of hardware that requires professional service every six months in order to sell me $240/yr in software subscriptions.
  - orthogonal_cube 4mo ago
    $240/yr in software subscriptions but likely far more than that by selling the extra metadata they can extract from the service
    - bhhaskin 4mo ago
      its likely not the metadata, since they already have access and sell that, but then they can sell ads on maps like Google does.
    - murderfs 3mo ago
      I don't understand why people are so deluded about the value of metadata about them. It's not that valuable, you're not that important.
  - xp84 3mo ago
    This is part of a broader trend I see in all consumer markets: especially in markets with just a few large important players: the companies start making very unpopular moves in the hopes that their competitors will realize the massive profit potential and follow them out of greed rather than try to steal customers by being the good guys. Examples: self-ordering kiosks at restaurants, every change made at every airline in the last 15 years, bandwidth caps at ISPs, “resort fees” at every hotel, tipping for car services, etc. They know that since there aren’t many options, it doesn’t matter if customers all hate it, as long as they have no choice. The automakers (at least in their fantasies) smell blood in the water for the idea of CarPlay/Android Auto, and want to kill it if they can.
    - monitorlizard 3mo ago
      Aviation is an incredibly low-margin business - airlines are less trying to earn "massive profits" and more just trying to continue to operate year over year
      - xp84 3mo ago
        Fair enough, it would be more accurate to simply say significant increases in the bottom line. Certainly possible that it simply moves from massively negative to less negative, like American Airlines. It still makes a big difference to them all the same.
  - JumpCrisscross 3mo ago
    I turned down buying a Rivian for exactly this reason, but it seems plenty of consumers don’t care. Curious if anyone has been able to calculate the sales and profits surrendered by the likes of GM and Rivian due to this switch. (My guess is it’s low.)
  - WorldMaker 3mo ago
    I think one of the things at issue here is that "professional service every six months" with EVs has gone from two oil changes, a tune-up, and a tire rotation to "maybe just a tire rotation". Most people don't do tire rotations that regularly, and any garage can do a tire rotation who needs to go to the dealership for that. They might be hoping that they can use some of that $240/yr to make dealers a little bit happier about selling EVs. Which does sort of get slightly to the heart of some recent things that the dealer model in the US has always been sometimes antagonistic to consumers, EVs make that worse, and it may be time for brand new dealer regulation. (Though that alone won't address the subscription fees because car companies will want recurring revenue with or without dealers.)
    - 0xffff2 3mo ago
      > two oil changes, a tune-up, and a tire rotation What is this, the 60s? Modern gas cars are so computer controlled that the concept of a "tune-up" effectively no longer exists, and they go 10,000 miles between oil changes so most people don't even average a single oil change every 6 months. EVs are even lower maintenance, but the difference isn't nearly as big as you're implying.
      - WorldMaker 3mo ago
        I think that is still in agreement to my point. Even ICE maintenance is no longer the same schedule (and cost patterns) as it was when the dealership model was invented. EVs push it to a "crisis mode", but it has been a building misaligned incentives problem for decades.
        bitmasher9 3mo ago
        Additionally self driving vehicles are promising to reduce the total number of collisions, and collision associated repair is a significant portion of all auto mechanic activity.
- shellfishgene 3mo ago
  I'm sure that's a big reason. But I think they also may be afraid that, if CarPlay/AndroidAuto really becomes such a must have that they can't sell cars without, Apple and Google with start charging them huge fees.
jghn 4mo ago
I'm in this camp: I will not buy a car without CarPlay. And I put so few miles on my car that while I'd like a new one, if the vendors make this impossible then no one gets my money.
- nozzlegear 4mo ago
  Same here. I have a Chevy that supports wireless CarPlay and I refuse to buy a car that doesn't have it. We're looking at replacing it soon, and we're going to go with a Subaru in no small part because it supports CarPlay.
- Induane 4mo ago
  Are there vehicles that support it in a way that isn't buggy? I have a few friends with it and I don't think I've been on a single ride with them without a glitch. Freezing interface, spontaneously jumping to regular Bluetooth, music playing but no actual volume, plugging into usb power causing some kind of mode-shift that makes the screen hang or briefly cease to work, all kinds of nonsense. Also kind of weirdly bad interface I feel (very subjective opinion there, obviously that's not a "fact"). I've only had Android Auto in my own vehicles, and while it hasn't been as buggy, it feels slow. I never use it anymore.
  - nerdsniper 4mo ago
    Haven’t had issues with Hondas or Toyotas since the 2020ish models at least
    - Induane 3mo ago
      It's funny you mention Toyota, my Dad's 2022 Civic Hybrid is the one I get to witness being buggy garbage pretty much non-stop with CarPlay. Lord don't plug it into the USB port that does data if you're already on wireless Carplay. You might be done until you pull over. I also love the way using speech to reply to a text often resumes the wrong song (seemingly just starts a random song midway through, and multiple times the Joe Rogan Podcast which dad doesn't listen to and is not subscribed to - when this happens it always starts at the same point in the intro). I don't actually know if the Toyota infotainment setup is to blame though. Since I've never encountered a reasonably stable, glitch free Carplay experience in the last 5 years, I've always just figured "that must be how CarPlay is". I have never owned an iPhone so I only get the cliffnotes version of the experience. But since it's got a 0% track record in that limited viewing, I'm either unlucky, emit magical anti-apple em waves, or am possessed by the soul of Steve Jobs favourite black shirt. I don't know if the sensitivity to Siri can be turned down, again not an iPhone guy myself, but it bugs me how often we will be talking and suddenly the audio stops and Siri says "I don't know how to help you with that" or something similar. Sometimes we just don't talk so that we don't constantly have Siri interrupting Hardcore History.
chris222 4mo ago
Tesla might support it. https://www.teslarati.com/apple-developing-missing-link-tesla-carplay-report/ https://www.teslarati.com/apple-developing-missing-link-tesl...
SirMaster 4mo ago
GM has not dropped CarPlay. I just checked out some 2026 GM vehicles (Chevy) and they list CarPlay.
- adamcstephens 4mo ago
  It may be for MY 2027. I know the new Bolt drops it.
  - dhosek 4mo ago
    Right now it’s only dropped in GM’s EVs. Of course when this causes a drop in EV sales, they’ll use that as an excuse to kill off their EV lines.
    - MBCook 4mo ago
      They’ll attribute that to something else and claim dropping CarPlay was a huge success and do it in gas models.
      - robrain 4mo ago
        Most likely they’ll do both, with a straight face.
- neogodless 3mo ago
  GM 100% dropped it in their EVs and announced moving away from it. https://www.theverge.com/transportation/804562/gm-apple-carplay-android-auto-gas-cars-mary-barra https://www.theverge.com/transportation/804562/gm-apple-carp...
  - SirMaster 3mo ago
    OK, but EVs are a fraction of their cars... And the OP didn't say EVs, so I was confused.
- phoghed 3mo ago
jnaina 4mo ago
Same here. CarPlay is in the top 10 features for my next Car. Even for my older 911 which I bought second hand, the first investment was a Pioneer head unit with CarPlay.
- artisinal 3mo ago
  In my opinion, anything older than a 996 shouldn’t have an infotainment screen. Looks very out of place. Just use a phone mount for navigation or use audio navigation through a period correct radio.
  - trinix912 3mo ago
    I agree. I find it tacky when people buy old BMWs and Mercedeses just to throw the original (often mint condition) radio unit out and put in a cheap carplay display. Like you have this 30 year old car with a pristine wooden trim where all components align nicely in design and you decide to ruin it for the convenience of having notifications in your face while driving? A phone holder looks much less invasive.
  - jnaina 3mo ago
    It's a 997. it had the original OEM double din stereo with the Nav. Porsche offered the PCCM CarPlay upgrade, but decided the Pioneer unit was much better.
    - artisinal 3mo ago
      Nice one. Yes on the 997 a CarPlay screen will not look out of place!
  - criddell 3mo ago
    There doesn’t have to be a big screen. Porsche sells head units with car play for their cars going back to the 1960’s. I think they look great. https://vehicle-accessories.porsche.com/prod/pag/Vehicle/Accessories.nsf/Finder?ReadForm&co=106&ac=product&pr=E406EDE24761C18AC1258C5F00504478&content=classic&content=classic#menu-content https://vehicle-accessories.porsche.com/prod/pag/Vehicle/Acc...
_fizz_buzz_ 4mo ago
Tesla might actually support car play soonish: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2025-11-13/tesla-is-working-to-add-apple-carplay-in-bid-to-boost-vehicle-sales?embedded-checkout=true https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2025-11-13/tesla-is-...
Reason077 3mo ago
> ”Rivian … following Tesla and refusing to support it.” Actually, Tesla is apparently planning to add CarPlay support via a software update. It hasn’t happened yet, as apparently it’s been waiting on a new feature from Apple which will allow navigation data to be shared/synced between CarPlay and the car’s self-driving system. This Route Sharing feature was announced at WWDC: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ykwG0I8UGjg&t=771s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ykwG0I8UGjg&t=771s
Spooky23 3mo ago
Tesla and I think Rivian goes deep into the computer as a control surface. They save $10 not having a handle for the glovebox or whatever. GM just wants to extract a pound of flesh. All are companies making dumb decisions by ignoring what customers want. It will cost them customers. My company buys like 10k cars a year and we make CarPlay a requirement. We see it as a safety and productivity issue. We want employees using maps to navigate and avoid hazards, but don’t want them operating our vehicles unsafely. Personally, it would be a long shot for me to buy any GM product due to high depreciation. The CarPlay/Android Auto thing disqualifies them.
deleted 3mo ago
[deleted]

by MBCook 4mo ago

bhhaskin 4mo ago

It's not that the market is moving away, but more like car companies realized if they want to sell monthly subscriptions in the future, they need to own the software.

my_username_is_ 4mo ago
This is crazy to me because the primary value proposition of Rivian's Connect+, as I see it, is enabling the hotspot while you're in the car and being able to monitor Gear Guard while you're away from the car. These are entirely separate from supporting CarPlay/Android Auto. If Rivian et al. truly want to sell a premium product, their software needs to be premium. And frankly it's just not there. The other day I was trying to listen to an upcoming album that has a few singles released. On my phone I can do that no problem. On the Rivian Spotify app, the album just didn't show up. It wasn't possible to play those songs in order without searching for the songs one by one. There are a ton of things that I love about my R1T, but as more time passes, the gap between what they offer and what other manufacturers offer becomes more and more apparent
bitmasher9 4mo ago
The car companies need to stay in their lanes on this one. You’re risking selling a >$40k piece of hardware that requires professional service every six months in order to sell me $240/yr in software subscriptions.
- orthogonal_cube 4mo ago
  $240/yr in software subscriptions but likely far more than that by selling the extra metadata they can extract from the service
  - bhhaskin 4mo ago
    its likely not the metadata, since they already have access and sell that, but then they can sell ads on maps like Google does.
  - murderfs 3mo ago
    I don't understand why people are so deluded about the value of metadata about them. It's not that valuable, you're not that important.
- xp84 3mo ago
  This is part of a broader trend I see in all consumer markets: especially in markets with just a few large important players: the companies start making very unpopular moves in the hopes that their competitors will realize the massive profit potential and follow them out of greed rather than try to steal customers by being the good guys. Examples: self-ordering kiosks at restaurants, every change made at every airline in the last 15 years, bandwidth caps at ISPs, “resort fees” at every hotel, tipping for car services, etc. They know that since there aren’t many options, it doesn’t matter if customers all hate it, as long as they have no choice. The automakers (at least in their fantasies) smell blood in the water for the idea of CarPlay/Android Auto, and want to kill it if they can.
  - monitorlizard 3mo ago
    Aviation is an incredibly low-margin business - airlines are less trying to earn "massive profits" and more just trying to continue to operate year over year
    - xp84 3mo ago
      Fair enough, it would be more accurate to simply say significant increases in the bottom line. Certainly possible that it simply moves from massively negative to less negative, like American Airlines. It still makes a big difference to them all the same.
- JumpCrisscross 3mo ago
  I turned down buying a Rivian for exactly this reason, but it seems plenty of consumers don’t care. Curious if anyone has been able to calculate the sales and profits surrendered by the likes of GM and Rivian due to this switch. (My guess is it’s low.)
- WorldMaker 3mo ago
  I think one of the things at issue here is that "professional service every six months" with EVs has gone from two oil changes, a tune-up, and a tire rotation to "maybe just a tire rotation". Most people don't do tire rotations that regularly, and any garage can do a tire rotation who needs to go to the dealership for that. They might be hoping that they can use some of that $240/yr to make dealers a little bit happier about selling EVs. Which does sort of get slightly to the heart of some recent things that the dealer model in the US has always been sometimes antagonistic to consumers, EVs make that worse, and it may be time for brand new dealer regulation. (Though that alone won't address the subscription fees because car companies will want recurring revenue with or without dealers.)
  - 0xffff2 3mo ago
    > two oil changes, a tune-up, and a tire rotation What is this, the 60s? Modern gas cars are so computer controlled that the concept of a "tune-up" effectively no longer exists, and they go 10,000 miles between oil changes so most people don't even average a single oil change every 6 months. EVs are even lower maintenance, but the difference isn't nearly as big as you're implying.
    - WorldMaker 3mo ago
      I think that is still in agreement to my point. Even ICE maintenance is no longer the same schedule (and cost patterns) as it was when the dealership model was invented. EVs push it to a "crisis mode", but it has been a building misaligned incentives problem for decades.
      - bitmasher9 3mo ago
        Additionally self driving vehicles are promising to reduce the total number of collisions, and collision associated repair is a significant portion of all auto mechanic activity.
shellfishgene 3mo ago
I'm sure that's a big reason. But I think they also may be afraid that, if CarPlay/AndroidAuto really becomes such a must have that they can't sell cars without, Apple and Google with start charging them huge fees.

jghn 4mo ago

I'm in this camp: I will not buy a car without CarPlay. And I put so few miles on my car that while I'd like a new one, if the vendors make this impossible then no one gets my money.

nozzlegear 4mo ago
Same here. I have a Chevy that supports wireless CarPlay and I refuse to buy a car that doesn't have it. We're looking at replacing it soon, and we're going to go with a Subaru in no small part because it supports CarPlay.
Induane 4mo ago
Are there vehicles that support it in a way that isn't buggy? I have a few friends with it and I don't think I've been on a single ride with them without a glitch. Freezing interface, spontaneously jumping to regular Bluetooth, music playing but no actual volume, plugging into usb power causing some kind of mode-shift that makes the screen hang or briefly cease to work, all kinds of nonsense. Also kind of weirdly bad interface I feel (very subjective opinion there, obviously that's not a "fact"). I've only had Android Auto in my own vehicles, and while it hasn't been as buggy, it feels slow. I never use it anymore.
- nerdsniper 4mo ago
  Haven’t had issues with Hondas or Toyotas since the 2020ish models at least
  - Induane 3mo ago
    It's funny you mention Toyota, my Dad's 2022 Civic Hybrid is the one I get to witness being buggy garbage pretty much non-stop with CarPlay. Lord don't plug it into the USB port that does data if you're already on wireless Carplay. You might be done until you pull over. I also love the way using speech to reply to a text often resumes the wrong song (seemingly just starts a random song midway through, and multiple times the Joe Rogan Podcast which dad doesn't listen to and is not subscribed to - when this happens it always starts at the same point in the intro). I don't actually know if the Toyota infotainment setup is to blame though. Since I've never encountered a reasonably stable, glitch free Carplay experience in the last 5 years, I've always just figured "that must be how CarPlay is". I have never owned an iPhone so I only get the cliffnotes version of the experience. But since it's got a 0% track record in that limited viewing, I'm either unlucky, emit magical anti-apple em waves, or am possessed by the soul of Steve Jobs favourite black shirt. I don't know if the sensitivity to Siri can be turned down, again not an iPhone guy myself, but it bugs me how often we will be talking and suddenly the audio stops and Siri says "I don't know how to help you with that" or something similar. Sometimes we just don't talk so that we don't constantly have Siri interrupting Hardcore History.

chris222 4mo ago

Tesla might support it. https://www.teslarati.com/apple-developing-missing-link-tesla-carplay-report/ https://www.teslarati.com/apple-developing-missing-link-tesl...

SirMaster 4mo ago

GM has not dropped CarPlay. I just checked out some 2026 GM vehicles (Chevy) and they list CarPlay.

adamcstephens 4mo ago
It may be for MY 2027. I know the new Bolt drops it.
- dhosek 4mo ago
  Right now it’s only dropped in GM’s EVs. Of course when this causes a drop in EV sales, they’ll use that as an excuse to kill off their EV lines.
  - MBCook 4mo ago
    They’ll attribute that to something else and claim dropping CarPlay was a huge success and do it in gas models.
    - robrain 4mo ago
      Most likely they’ll do both, with a straight face.
neogodless 3mo ago
GM 100% dropped it in their EVs and announced moving away from it. https://www.theverge.com/transportation/804562/gm-apple-carplay-android-auto-gas-cars-mary-barra https://www.theverge.com/transportation/804562/gm-apple-carp...
- SirMaster 3mo ago
  OK, but EVs are a fraction of their cars... And the OP didn't say EVs, so I was confused.
phoghed 3mo ago

jnaina 4mo ago

Same here. CarPlay is in the top 10 features for my next Car. Even for my older 911 which I bought second hand, the first investment was a Pioneer head unit with CarPlay.

artisinal 3mo ago
In my opinion, anything older than a 996 shouldn’t have an infotainment screen. Looks very out of place. Just use a phone mount for navigation or use audio navigation through a period correct radio.
- trinix912 3mo ago
  I agree. I find it tacky when people buy old BMWs and Mercedeses just to throw the original (often mint condition) radio unit out and put in a cheap carplay display. Like you have this 30 year old car with a pristine wooden trim where all components align nicely in design and you decide to ruin it for the convenience of having notifications in your face while driving? A phone holder looks much less invasive.
- jnaina 3mo ago
  It's a 997. it had the original OEM double din stereo with the Nav. Porsche offered the PCCM CarPlay upgrade, but decided the Pioneer unit was much better.
  - artisinal 3mo ago
    Nice one. Yes on the 997 a CarPlay screen will not look out of place!
- criddell 3mo ago
  There doesn’t have to be a big screen. Porsche sells head units with car play for their cars going back to the 1960’s. I think they look great. https://vehicle-accessories.porsche.com/prod/pag/Vehicle/Accessories.nsf/Finder?ReadForm&co=106&ac=product&pr=E406EDE24761C18AC1258C5F00504478&content=classic&content=classic#menu-content https://vehicle-accessories.porsche.com/prod/pag/Vehicle/Acc...

_fizz_buzz_ 4mo ago

Tesla might actually support car play soonish: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2025-11-13/tesla-is-working-to-add-apple-carplay-in-bid-to-boost-vehicle-sales?embedded-checkout=true https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2025-11-13/tesla-is-...

Reason077 3mo ago

> ”Rivian … following Tesla and refusing to support it.” Actually, Tesla is apparently planning to add CarPlay support via a software update. It hasn’t happened yet, as apparently it’s been waiting on a new feature from Apple which will allow navigation data to be shared/synced between CarPlay and the car’s self-driving system. This Route Sharing feature was announced at WWDC: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ykwG0I8UGjg&t=771s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ykwG0I8UGjg&t=771s

Spooky23 3mo ago

Tesla and I think Rivian goes deep into the computer as a control surface. They save $10 not having a handle for the glovebox or whatever. GM just wants to extract a pound of flesh. All are companies making dumb decisions by ignoring what customers want. It will cost them customers. My company buys like 10k cars a year and we make CarPlay a requirement. We see it as a safety and productivity issue. We want employees using maps to navigate and avoid hazards, but don’t want them operating our vehicles unsafely. Personally, it would be a long shot for me to buy any GM product due to high depreciation. The CarPlay/Android Auto thing disqualifies them.

deleted 3mo ago

[deleted]