6 ms·

Just built a "hatchback" Slate with what I guess will be common options (speakers, wheel upgrade, spare wheel carrier, and a few other odds and ends) and it cam

Just built a "hatchback" Slate with what I guess will be common options (speakers, wheel upgrade, spare wheel carrier, and a few other odds and ends) and it came to $35k. So, still pretty inexpensive, but also getting close to some existing EV sedans that are known entities and have pretty decent interiors. So, I'm not totally sold on these, but not not sold either. Need to see one in person, I think.

cammil 4mo ago
Presumably you could reconfigure it easily later. Which seems like a plus
- alistairSH 4mo ago
  Yeah, you could buy a basic one and add the rear seats and roof later. But, is that likely? Most people buy cars on credit and won't have $10k cash to spend on those bits later. I guess they could put it on Visa, but that's a terrible financial choice.
  - giantg2 4mo ago
    It's possible they will offer financing for that. From a business strategy perspective it would be almost unimaginable that they wouldn't.
  - bitexploder 4mo ago
    If these become popular it should be reasonable to expect the aftermarket to provide less expensive options. These are clearly where Slate's margin will live right now.
  - Suppafly 4mo ago
    They'll end up being worth a ton of money in the future like those roofs from the original mazda miatas.
zamadatix 4mo ago
I'm simultaneously not interested in an electric truck & amazed the price is still reasonable if you want to turn it the truck into a hatchback instead. The range is also meh. Same conclusion: interesting, but not necessarily interested. Hope they go places though.
- alistairSH 4mo ago
  I see lots of tradesmen in Ford Mavericks or Transit Connects. The Slate could work well for some of them - basic truck model, with the ladder rack for long stuff (like ladders or pieces of wood). Saves them some money up front, and gas and maintenance (in theory).
  - zamadatix 4mo ago
    Ford Maverick is a hybrid for about the same price and I could definitely lean more easily towards that kind combo at the moment. The Transit Connect is discontinued in North America and was only ever a plug in hybrid here (outside a 500 unit collaboration in the early 2010s) but maybe one of the newer electric variants of the Transit lines will make its way over some time (e.g. looks like the Ford E-Tourneo Courier is an all electric in Europe).
  - SoftTalker 4mo ago
    Yes and no. I'd think residential plumber or HVAC service tech can easily drive more than the stated range just going from job to job during a day. They're going to want to be sure that they don't have to stop to charge between jobs; time is money for those guys, and especially if the fast charging infrastructure is not well built out in their area it could be a showstopper.
    - bluGill 4mo ago
      A fast charge over lunch would be acceptable. However there are not near enough fast chargers. Every fast food place needs to have 1/2 of their parking spots equipped with a faster charger (1/4 if there is a way to limit them to people charging)
p1mrx 4mo ago
> wheel upgrade At the same size (17"), going from steel to alloy improves performance but reduces durability. Larger wheels (20") are generally a downgrade for performance and ride quality. Engineering Explained has a video on this topic: NYvKxsYFqO8
- alistairSH 4mo ago
  Yeah, I kept 17", but went to alloy (I think).
- sokoloff 4mo ago
  Downgrade in ride quality for sure, but that’s the first I’ve heard of it being a performance downgrade. Will check out the video later to learn more.
  - therealdrag0 4mo ago
    Maybe just due to lift. Thinner wheels and lower car is better aerodynamics
    - sokoloff 4mo ago
      Typically larger wheels come with lower profile tires, such that the total diameter of the tire stays about the same. That means, for a given spindle height, the car ride height is the same regardless of wheel diameter.
  - jerlam 4mo ago
    I believe the smaller wheels accelerate better because they are lighter, but corner worse. The smaller wheels also get better efficiency.
- bruce343434 4mo ago
  tldw: - wider wheels are marginally less efficient but almost negligible - rims with larger diameter have larger air resistance. Probably because the rim patterns intersects the air in weird ways but it's not explained. Tire walls are relatively smooth, so tires with higher aspect are way more aero-efficient despite having more marginally lower rolling resistance.
roysting 4mo ago
> still pretty inexpensive Can we stop being so out of touch and/or deluding ourselves to believe $35k is “pretty inexpensive” for people not living in a bubble; whether that is the Americas bubble or the tech bubble within the bubble or the urban bubble within that; let alone for a tiny two seater electric truck that has a 200 mile range. The 45th percentile, i.e., the bottom 90% have a median income of roughly $40,000. $35,000 for a enclosed covered or even hatchback type mini SUV is not reasonable and you know very well when they come out with that, it’s going to be at least $40,000. None of that is inexpensive or even pretty inexpensive. That’s just rationalization and coping, trying to convince ourselves and others of things that are incongruent. “Pretty inexpensive” would be an enclosed bed version that cost $22,000 maybe. For additional context; the industry standard measure of income to cost ratio has risen from 9.3 weeks of household income gross pay for a baseline vehicle, i.e., civic, in 1973 to, 16.5 weeks of gross pay in 2024; and that’s based on the fraudulent official inflation numbers. Yet more context, a civic can seat 5 people and still has a range of 450 miles on a tank of gasoline that you can find all over the place, even in far off rural places OSD puppy can carry gasoline with you if need be. There is no sense in rationalizing and deluding ourselves about the real limitations that still exists that are real and are why adoption is not matching imaginations.
- bryanlarsen 4mo ago
  There are lots of vehicles available for $22K. On the used market. Buying new is a privilege. A $35K vehicle will reach $22K on the used market a lot faster than a $60K vehicle will.
  - unregistereddev 4mo ago
    There are new hybrids available for $30k. There are new vehicles available for $22k. There are reasonable used vehicles available for $10k. The problem with the Slate isn't that cheaper vehicles exist. The problem with the Slate is that you can buy nicer, better equipped vehicles for the same price.
    - jwx48 4mo ago
aidenn0 4mo ago
Compared to gas cars: Kia K4 hatchback is $26k with a lot more creature-comforts. Gets 34mpg, so if $6/gal gas is here to stay that's $0.17 per mile of fuel costs. My EV gets almost exactly 4miles/kW average and I pay $0.21 per kW so that's about $0.05 per mile. So $0.12 per mile saved in fuel costs implies about 80k miles for break-even. This excludes costs of servicing, which should be higher on the gas car. [edit typo'd an extra 0 it's 80k miles for break-even] [edit2] After looking up my energy bill I pay $0.27 so it's between 10 and 11 cents per mile saved. Break-even is still under 100k miles.
- fouc 4mo ago
  I think you meant 80k not 800k, $0.12 * 80,000 = $9,600
- beaviskhan 4mo ago
  I think you've got an extra zero in there somewhere $35k - $26k = $9k $9k / $0.12/mile savings ~= 75,000 miles breakeven
  - mgrandl 4mo ago
    And that is completely ignoring maintenance cost which tends to be a lot cheaper on EVs.
    - IshKebab 4mo ago
      Somewhat cheaper anyway (30% according to https://www.thecarexpert.co.uk/petrol-vs-electric-servicing-costs-2025/ https://www.thecarexpert.co.uk/petrol-vs-electric-servicing-... ), but I wouldn't be surprised if that is wiped out by the increased insurance costs. I definitely wouldn't buy an EV based on lower service costs.
      - bryanlarsen 4mo ago
        That's based on the manufacturer's "lets not upset our dealers" maintenance schedule and is completely unnecessary. In reality you can probably bring your EV to the dealer once every 4 years or so. On that schedule you should: - check the brake fluid for water - change the cabin air filter - change the gearbox oil - check/change the battery coolant If you're going in more frequent than that you're getting a very expensive windshield wiper replacement. The real kicker is going to be repair costs. An EV has about 10% of the moving parts of an ICE car, so in theory repairs should be much less frequent. But if the ICE is a Toyota and the EV is a Tesla, YMMV. You'll probably have to replace the battery at around 250,000 miles but at that point the car is worth pretty much scrap value anyways.
cherry_tree 4mo ago
There isn’t a hatchback option. Did you mean fastback?
- alistairSH 4mo ago
  Yeah, whatever the 4-seater with a notchback style is called.
stasomatic 4mo ago
A base trim Hyundai Ioniq 5 is now $35K in the US. The Slate looks very cool, I'd take 3, but it doesn't seem a good value as basic transportation, not including the perceived value of no telemetry, etc.

cammil 4mo ago

Presumably you could reconfigure it easily later. Which seems like a plus

alistairSH 4mo ago
Yeah, you could buy a basic one and add the rear seats and roof later. But, is that likely? Most people buy cars on credit and won't have $10k cash to spend on those bits later. I guess they could put it on Visa, but that's a terrible financial choice.
- giantg2 4mo ago
  It's possible they will offer financing for that. From a business strategy perspective it would be almost unimaginable that they wouldn't.
- bitexploder 4mo ago
  If these become popular it should be reasonable to expect the aftermarket to provide less expensive options. These are clearly where Slate's margin will live right now.
- Suppafly 4mo ago
  They'll end up being worth a ton of money in the future like those roofs from the original mazda miatas.

zamadatix 4mo ago

I'm simultaneously not interested in an electric truck & amazed the price is still reasonable if you want to turn it the truck into a hatchback instead. The range is also meh. Same conclusion: interesting, but not necessarily interested. Hope they go places though.

alistairSH 4mo ago
I see lots of tradesmen in Ford Mavericks or Transit Connects. The Slate could work well for some of them - basic truck model, with the ladder rack for long stuff (like ladders or pieces of wood). Saves them some money up front, and gas and maintenance (in theory).
- zamadatix 4mo ago
  Ford Maverick is a hybrid for about the same price and I could definitely lean more easily towards that kind combo at the moment. The Transit Connect is discontinued in North America and was only ever a plug in hybrid here (outside a 500 unit collaboration in the early 2010s) but maybe one of the newer electric variants of the Transit lines will make its way over some time (e.g. looks like the Ford E-Tourneo Courier is an all electric in Europe).
- SoftTalker 4mo ago
  Yes and no. I'd think residential plumber or HVAC service tech can easily drive more than the stated range just going from job to job during a day. They're going to want to be sure that they don't have to stop to charge between jobs; time is money for those guys, and especially if the fast charging infrastructure is not well built out in their area it could be a showstopper.
  - bluGill 4mo ago
    A fast charge over lunch would be acceptable. However there are not near enough fast chargers. Every fast food place needs to have 1/2 of their parking spots equipped with a faster charger (1/4 if there is a way to limit them to people charging)

p1mrx 4mo ago

> wheel upgrade At the same size (17"), going from steel to alloy improves performance but reduces durability. Larger wheels (20") are generally a downgrade for performance and ride quality. Engineering Explained has a video on this topic: NYvKxsYFqO8

alistairSH 4mo ago
Yeah, I kept 17", but went to alloy (I think).
sokoloff 4mo ago
Downgrade in ride quality for sure, but that’s the first I’ve heard of it being a performance downgrade. Will check out the video later to learn more.
- therealdrag0 4mo ago
  Maybe just due to lift. Thinner wheels and lower car is better aerodynamics
  - sokoloff 4mo ago
    Typically larger wheels come with lower profile tires, such that the total diameter of the tire stays about the same. That means, for a given spindle height, the car ride height is the same regardless of wheel diameter.
- jerlam 4mo ago
  I believe the smaller wheels accelerate better because they are lighter, but corner worse. The smaller wheels also get better efficiency.
bruce343434 4mo ago
tldw: - wider wheels are marginally less efficient but almost negligible - rims with larger diameter have larger air resistance. Probably because the rim patterns intersects the air in weird ways but it's not explained. Tire walls are relatively smooth, so tires with higher aspect are way more aero-efficient despite having more marginally lower rolling resistance.

roysting 4mo ago

> still pretty inexpensive Can we stop being so out of touch and/or deluding ourselves to believe $35k is “pretty inexpensive” for people not living in a bubble; whether that is the Americas bubble or the tech bubble within the bubble or the urban bubble within that; let alone for a tiny two seater electric truck that has a 200 mile range. The 45th percentile, i.e., the bottom 90% have a median income of roughly $40,000. $35,000 for a enclosed covered or even hatchback type mini SUV is not reasonable and you know very well when they come out with that, it’s going to be at least $40,000. None of that is inexpensive or even pretty inexpensive. That’s just rationalization and coping, trying to convince ourselves and others of things that are incongruent. “Pretty inexpensive” would be an enclosed bed version that cost $22,000 maybe. For additional context; the industry standard measure of income to cost ratio has risen from 9.3 weeks of household income gross pay for a baseline vehicle, i.e., civic, in 1973 to, 16.5 weeks of gross pay in 2024; and that’s based on the fraudulent official inflation numbers. Yet more context, a civic can seat 5 people and still has a range of 450 miles on a tank of gasoline that you can find all over the place, even in far off rural places OSD puppy can carry gasoline with you if need be. There is no sense in rationalizing and deluding ourselves about the real limitations that still exists that are real and are why adoption is not matching imaginations.

bryanlarsen 4mo ago
There are lots of vehicles available for $22K. On the used market. Buying new is a privilege. A $35K vehicle will reach $22K on the used market a lot faster than a $60K vehicle will.
- unregistereddev 4mo ago
  There are new hybrids available for $30k. There are new vehicles available for $22k. There are reasonable used vehicles available for $10k. The problem with the Slate isn't that cheaper vehicles exist. The problem with the Slate is that you can buy nicer, better equipped vehicles for the same price.
  - jwx48 4mo ago

aidenn0 4mo ago

Compared to gas cars: Kia K4 hatchback is $26k with a lot more creature-comforts. Gets 34mpg, so if $6/gal gas is here to stay that's $0.17 per mile of fuel costs. My EV gets almost exactly 4miles/kW average and I pay $0.21 per kW so that's about $0.05 per mile. So $0.12 per mile saved in fuel costs implies about 80k miles for break-even. This excludes costs of servicing, which should be higher on the gas car. [edit typo'd an extra 0 it's 80k miles for break-even] [edit2] After looking up my energy bill I pay $0.27 so it's between 10 and 11 cents per mile saved. Break-even is still under 100k miles.

fouc 4mo ago
I think you meant 80k not 800k, $0.12 * 80,000 = $9,600
beaviskhan 4mo ago
I think you've got an extra zero in there somewhere $35k - $26k = $9k $9k / $0.12/mile savings ~= 75,000 miles breakeven
- mgrandl 4mo ago
  And that is completely ignoring maintenance cost which tends to be a lot cheaper on EVs.
  - IshKebab 4mo ago
    Somewhat cheaper anyway (30% according to https://www.thecarexpert.co.uk/petrol-vs-electric-servicing-costs-2025/ https://www.thecarexpert.co.uk/petrol-vs-electric-servicing-... ), but I wouldn't be surprised if that is wiped out by the increased insurance costs. I definitely wouldn't buy an EV based on lower service costs.
    - bryanlarsen 4mo ago
      That's based on the manufacturer's "lets not upset our dealers" maintenance schedule and is completely unnecessary. In reality you can probably bring your EV to the dealer once every 4 years or so. On that schedule you should: - check the brake fluid for water - change the cabin air filter - change the gearbox oil - check/change the battery coolant If you're going in more frequent than that you're getting a very expensive windshield wiper replacement. The real kicker is going to be repair costs. An EV has about 10% of the moving parts of an ICE car, so in theory repairs should be much less frequent. But if the ICE is a Toyota and the EV is a Tesla, YMMV. You'll probably have to replace the battery at around 250,000 miles but at that point the car is worth pretty much scrap value anyways.

cherry_tree 4mo ago

There isn’t a hatchback option. Did you mean fastback?

alistairSH 4mo ago
Yeah, whatever the 4-seater with a notchback style is called.

stasomatic 4mo ago

A base trim Hyundai Ioniq 5 is now $35K in the US. The Slate looks very cool, I'd take 3, but it doesn't seem a good value as basic transportation, not including the perceived value of no telemetry, etc.