4 ms·

I have a friend who uses a wheelchair and he hates encountering these things in the wild. I know there's a couple different companies making these things and I

I have a friend who uses a wheelchair and he hates encountering these things in the wild. I know there's a couple different companies making these things and I'm not sure if they all behave like this, but they take up the whole sidewalk and won't backup or turn to get out of the way. Instead they just sit there blinking and beeping at my friend, and of course in a wheelchair it's not easy (or safe!) to go over the curb or anything to get around them. Automated delivery sounds cool at first glance but they probably shouldn't be on the sidewalk if they can't accommodate the humans who also need to get around.

exmadscientist 4mo ago
Robots that cannot share sidewalks with humans, including humans in wheelchairs, should be banned from sidewalks. Full stop. End of discussion. They can use the streets proper if they want to. I'm sure there is some way to formalize that using ADA sidewalk requirements or something similar.
- Grombobulous 4mo ago
  I really don’t understand how a four wheeled self-driving powered vehicle is allowed to drive on the sidewalk when riding a bicycle on the sidewalk in that same city is illegal.
  - rcxdude 4mo ago
    Probably under the same regulations that allow a powered wheelchair on the sidewalk. A low maximum speed makes up for a lot of things. But they should have a plan for encountering a wheelchair user.
    - Grombobulous 4mo ago
      Perhaps, but I imagine those regulations are written around an actual person being involved.
  - slyall 4mo ago
    Because traffic laws work for cars and pedestrians. Anything else in between in fuzzy and hard to define or legislate
  - lovich 4mo ago
    Because corporations have more rights than the common man and these robots are the property of corporations. If you as a regular person cause some sort of damage to a corporation you’ll be arrested and locked up while they determine the legality and if there was an actual illegal damage. If these corporations cause regular people problems then it’s “oopsies, you can sue us in court with your far smaller resources in a system that is heavily incentivized for those with more resources” and no equivalent corporate entity is getting the equivalent of cash bail.
    - nisegami 4mo ago
      The law protects but does not bind corporations while binding but not protecting individuals.
- Hizonner 4mo ago
  > They can use the streets proper if they want to. How about no? They'll block traffic there, too.
  - fouc 4mo ago
    Vehicles have been far too dominant in city planning, it's probably time to re-prioritize, make it look more like Netherlands or some other European countries perhaps. I suggest a priority order somewhat like: pedestrians > bicyclists > delivery bots > vehicles currently in America I suppose it probably looks more like this currently: vehicles > delivery bots > pedestrians.
    - patrick451 4mo ago
      The vast majority of Americans prefer roads being dedicated to vehicles. I live in a town that is stealing drivable roadway for bike lanes. It's a total wast of tax dollars. There is never anybody in this bike lanes. Because even in this flaming blue, bike friendly city, people drive because it's just better.
      - ai-astrologer 4mo ago
        Often it feels unsafe to bike on roadways, so people just avoid doing so. And most bike lanes on roadways have trash in them and are basically a glorified shoulder.
      - wffurr 4mo ago
        "Stealing" as in having a public process for proposed street designs that you can't be bothered to attend. "There is never anybody in this bike lanes" you don't see them because they aren't stuck in traffic like you. Also the city has to build out a full network of high quality bike facilities to convince a bunch of skeptics and scaredy cats to get out of their cars and enjoy life and actually get somewhere instead of just be traffic all the time.
        Hizonner 4mo ago
- lesostep 4mo ago
  There should be some some way to sue for unlawful restriction of access to public infrastructure. As far as I'm aware, you can't just put a border on a sidewalk. Bots that stop you from using sidewalk are essentially that. A border on a public infrastructure put there by some company.
  - stevenicr 4mo ago
    close to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trespass_to_chattels https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trespass_to_chattels ? If blocking access to your store, your car, etc. this kicks in maybe.
colechristensen 4mo ago
This would seem like an easy ADA case.
- solid_fuel 4mo ago
  I'm not aware of someone filing such a case yet, but I would think so too. I'm not sure if you would sue the city or the robot company, or both? It feels like a failure on the part of both.
  - bluefirebrand 4mo ago
    It's not the city's responsibility to make the sidewalks delivery robot friendly, it's 100% a failure on the part of the robot company
    - solid_fuel 4mo ago
      > It's not the city's responsibility to make the sidewalks delivery robot friendly, it's 100% a failure on the part of the robot company I don't expect them to make the sidewalks robot friendly, but I think they are responsible for keeping the sidewalks clear of obstructions - so if the robots are obstructing people in my view the city should remove them and fine the company. Failing to do that would be a failure to maintain the sidewalk space, at least that's my thinking.
      - danaris 4mo ago
        ...The robots aren't (by and large) just sitting there taking up space. They're not something you're going to be able to have a standard city street cleaning crew just pick up and toss in the bin when they go around in the early morning. They're actively scooting around, mostly from midmorning through early evening, because that's when people want to receive deliveries.
        solid_fuel 4mo ago
        I thought it was obvious but to be extra clear "remove" in this case would mean fining the company and revoking their permits to operate in the city. Not... running around and herding robots into a truck or whatever.
al_borland 4mo ago
Delivery robots also can’t come to the door. So for a person with a disability, or who simply ordered food because they didn’t want to leave the house for whatever reason (maybe they have the flu), it kills the value proposition.
xnx 4mo ago
> won't backup or turn to get out of the way. This seems surprising. As far as I know all these carts are controlled remotely in real time.
- solid_fuel 4mo ago
  I think it depends on the robot. The ones around here seem to be semi-automatic and seem to get taken over by a human when they're blocked, but it often takes 5 or 10 minutes before that happens.
- eloisius 4mo ago
  Remote controlled by people in faraway LCOL places where they may not understand or be trained on Western disability norms, but are certainly incentivized by how many deliveries they complete.
  - Sabinus 4mo ago
    The same issues exist for platform moderation. Often they're complex decisions on divisive topics, delegated to people outside the culture with little training, time, or incentive to make wise judgements.
_doctor_love 4mo ago
I worry that some enterprising person representing the delivery companies will find a way to make it so that if humans in wheelchairs block the path of the robots, then it's the humans who will have to yield. It makes me think of that scene from The Man In The High Castle - "drag on the state."
- _doctor_love 4mo ago
  Note for the downvoters: https://www.nytimes.com/2026/06/20/us/politics/special-education-rfk.html https://www.nytimes.com/2026/06/20/us/politics/special-educa... Gee, yeah, not an ill-founded worry at all. Wake the fuck up.
ncallaway 4mo ago
If I saw a delivery robot blocking someone in a wheel-chair, I'm moving it off the sidewalk and I'm not particularly concerned if it's able to complete its trip after that.
- thatguy00 4mo ago
  Don't pussyfoot around it. Break the fuckin' thing. Let the owner know this is absolutely fucking unacceptable. A person would get the shit kicked out of them for that kind of behavior.
onetokeoverthe 4mo ago
[dead]
jurgenburgen 4mo ago
> Instead they just sit there blinking and beeping at my friend, and of course in a wheelchair it's not easy (or safe!) to go over the curb or anything to get around them. I would keep on rolling into the robot. Sometimes the provider needs some production incidents to get motivated into fixing a bug.
- thatguy00 4mo ago
  Or to understand that public sentiment makes their stupid business venture wholly unviable, economically. That happens when people break your shit. We didn't get traction on scooters and e-bikes until they started landing in ponds and off overpasses. Your politicians want new business. They won't help. You have to fight the businesses directly.

exmadscientist 4mo ago

Robots that cannot share sidewalks with humans, including humans in wheelchairs, should be banned from sidewalks. Full stop. End of discussion. They can use the streets proper if they want to. I'm sure there is some way to formalize that using ADA sidewalk requirements or something similar.

Grombobulous 4mo ago
I really don’t understand how a four wheeled self-driving powered vehicle is allowed to drive on the sidewalk when riding a bicycle on the sidewalk in that same city is illegal.
- rcxdude 4mo ago
  Probably under the same regulations that allow a powered wheelchair on the sidewalk. A low maximum speed makes up for a lot of things. But they should have a plan for encountering a wheelchair user.
  - Grombobulous 4mo ago
    Perhaps, but I imagine those regulations are written around an actual person being involved.
- slyall 4mo ago
  Because traffic laws work for cars and pedestrians. Anything else in between in fuzzy and hard to define or legislate
- lovich 4mo ago
  Because corporations have more rights than the common man and these robots are the property of corporations. If you as a regular person cause some sort of damage to a corporation you’ll be arrested and locked up while they determine the legality and if there was an actual illegal damage. If these corporations cause regular people problems then it’s “oopsies, you can sue us in court with your far smaller resources in a system that is heavily incentivized for those with more resources” and no equivalent corporate entity is getting the equivalent of cash bail.
  - nisegami 4mo ago
    The law protects but does not bind corporations while binding but not protecting individuals.
Hizonner 4mo ago
> They can use the streets proper if they want to. How about no? They'll block traffic there, too.
- fouc 4mo ago
  Vehicles have been far too dominant in city planning, it's probably time to re-prioritize, make it look more like Netherlands or some other European countries perhaps. I suggest a priority order somewhat like: pedestrians > bicyclists > delivery bots > vehicles currently in America I suppose it probably looks more like this currently: vehicles > delivery bots > pedestrians.
  - patrick451 4mo ago
    The vast majority of Americans prefer roads being dedicated to vehicles. I live in a town that is stealing drivable roadway for bike lanes. It's a total wast of tax dollars. There is never anybody in this bike lanes. Because even in this flaming blue, bike friendly city, people drive because it's just better.
    - ai-astrologer 4mo ago
      Often it feels unsafe to bike on roadways, so people just avoid doing so. And most bike lanes on roadways have trash in them and are basically a glorified shoulder.
    - wffurr 4mo ago
      "Stealing" as in having a public process for proposed street designs that you can't be bothered to attend. "There is never anybody in this bike lanes" you don't see them because they aren't stuck in traffic like you. Also the city has to build out a full network of high quality bike facilities to convince a bunch of skeptics and scaredy cats to get out of their cars and enjoy life and actually get somewhere instead of just be traffic all the time.
      - Hizonner 4mo ago
lesostep 4mo ago
There should be some some way to sue for unlawful restriction of access to public infrastructure. As far as I'm aware, you can't just put a border on a sidewalk. Bots that stop you from using sidewalk are essentially that. A border on a public infrastructure put there by some company.
- stevenicr 4mo ago
  close to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trespass_to_chattels https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trespass_to_chattels ? If blocking access to your store, your car, etc. this kicks in maybe.

colechristensen 4mo ago

This would seem like an easy ADA case.

solid_fuel 4mo ago
I'm not aware of someone filing such a case yet, but I would think so too. I'm not sure if you would sue the city or the robot company, or both? It feels like a failure on the part of both.
- bluefirebrand 4mo ago
  It's not the city's responsibility to make the sidewalks delivery robot friendly, it's 100% a failure on the part of the robot company
  - solid_fuel 4mo ago
    > It's not the city's responsibility to make the sidewalks delivery robot friendly, it's 100% a failure on the part of the robot company I don't expect them to make the sidewalks robot friendly, but I think they are responsible for keeping the sidewalks clear of obstructions - so if the robots are obstructing people in my view the city should remove them and fine the company. Failing to do that would be a failure to maintain the sidewalk space, at least that's my thinking.
    - danaris 4mo ago
      ...The robots aren't (by and large) just sitting there taking up space. They're not something you're going to be able to have a standard city street cleaning crew just pick up and toss in the bin when they go around in the early morning. They're actively scooting around, mostly from midmorning through early evening, because that's when people want to receive deliveries.
      - solid_fuel 4mo ago
        I thought it was obvious but to be extra clear "remove" in this case would mean fining the company and revoking their permits to operate in the city. Not... running around and herding robots into a truck or whatever.

al_borland 4mo ago

Delivery robots also can’t come to the door. So for a person with a disability, or who simply ordered food because they didn’t want to leave the house for whatever reason (maybe they have the flu), it kills the value proposition.

xnx 4mo ago

> won't backup or turn to get out of the way. This seems surprising. As far as I know all these carts are controlled remotely in real time.

solid_fuel 4mo ago
I think it depends on the robot. The ones around here seem to be semi-automatic and seem to get taken over by a human when they're blocked, but it often takes 5 or 10 minutes before that happens.
eloisius 4mo ago
Remote controlled by people in faraway LCOL places where they may not understand or be trained on Western disability norms, but are certainly incentivized by how many deliveries they complete.
- Sabinus 4mo ago
  The same issues exist for platform moderation. Often they're complex decisions on divisive topics, delegated to people outside the culture with little training, time, or incentive to make wise judgements.

_doctor_love 4mo ago

I worry that some enterprising person representing the delivery companies will find a way to make it so that if humans in wheelchairs block the path of the robots, then it's the humans who will have to yield. It makes me think of that scene from The Man In The High Castle - "drag on the state."

_doctor_love 4mo ago
Note for the downvoters: https://www.nytimes.com/2026/06/20/us/politics/special-education-rfk.html https://www.nytimes.com/2026/06/20/us/politics/special-educa... Gee, yeah, not an ill-founded worry at all. Wake the fuck up.

ncallaway 4mo ago

If I saw a delivery robot blocking someone in a wheel-chair, I'm moving it off the sidewalk and I'm not particularly concerned if it's able to complete its trip after that.

thatguy00 4mo ago
Don't pussyfoot around it. Break the fuckin' thing. Let the owner know this is absolutely fucking unacceptable. A person would get the shit kicked out of them for that kind of behavior.

onetokeoverthe 4mo ago

[dead]

jurgenburgen 4mo ago

> Instead they just sit there blinking and beeping at my friend, and of course in a wheelchair it's not easy (or safe!) to go over the curb or anything to get around them. I would keep on rolling into the robot. Sometimes the provider needs some production incidents to get motivated into fixing a bug.

thatguy00 4mo ago
Or to understand that public sentiment makes their stupid business venture wholly unviable, economically. That happens when people break your shit. We didn't get traction on scooters and e-bikes until they started landing in ponds and off overpasses. Your politicians want new business. They won't help. You have to fight the businesses directly.