4 ms·

> You seem strongly in favor science that you understand, and opposed to research that you don't take an interest in or have read. Just say it the clear way, s

by timr 4mo ago

> You seem strongly in favor science that you understand, and opposed to research that you don't take an interest in or have read. Just say it the clear way, so that everyone can see what you're doing: if I don't like it, it must be because I don't understand it.

mold_aid 4mo ago
Perhaps better than "if I don't like it, it deserves to have its funding cut"
nixon_why69 4mo ago
I'm not well-versed in social science either so I don't have a slam dunk here, but I'd be very willing to bet it's more involved than you're portraying. To flip it on your space telescope, another one? They've been doing this for years, they're just going to tell us there's a lot of galaxies out there, boring.
- timr 4mo ago
  > To flip it on your space telescope, another one? They've been doing this for years, they're just going to tell us there's a lot of galaxies out there, boring. You’re not “flipping”, you’re just making a silly reduction. There’s tons of things we don’t know about black holes. We don’t need another study to tell us that poor people are sicker due to past racism. (One can certainly argue that it’s not worth the money to know more stuff about black holes. I am agnostic, but at least I see the difference in kind between the quality of the questions.)
  - nixon_why69 4mo ago
    Now imagine that there might be more depth to social sciences as well? Do you think we have it all figured out? Is Economics solved as well?
    - timr 4mo ago
      > Now imagine that there might be more depth to social sciences as well? I didn't malign all social sciences. > Do you think we have it all figured out? No.
      - nixon_why69 4mo ago
        Ok so its just specifically the stuff at the intersection of race and poverty that bothers you? I'm not sure where this is going. I mean, yes, there's some shoddy ideology-as-science at various universities but those people all still have jobs. That's not what got cut by DOGE, apparently.
        timr 4mo ago
        > Ok so its just specifically the stuff at the intersection of race and poverty that bothers you? I'm not sure where this is going. No, it's bad science that bothers me, and this particular article prominently mentioned this example of bad science in like, the third paragraph. I quoted this at the top of the thread. But I appreciate the subtle insinuation!
        nixon_why69 4mo ago
        From TFA (more like 10th graf after a lot on the NASA project): > research into the social determinants of health—structural racism in home-loan practices meant that nonwhite people got iced out of home ownership and generational wealth, which forced them to live in neighborhoods closer to toxic sites such as factories and highways, without sidewalks and amenities. “It’s a challenging field to quantify, but we’re getting to a place in science where we can start asking these questions,” That sounds like science to me, they're trying to quantify health outcomes relative to community environment. Later research can use the figures, just like with your black hole observations. One could say that maybe they should measure low-income communities in general with race as a dimension, but that doesn't make the whole thing "bad science".
        4mo ago
- SanjayMehta 4mo ago
  [flagged]
  - Windchaser 4mo ago
    I don't follow. Are there not sciences that primarily study a type of human relationship? Economics, for instance, which covers our financial relationships with each other.
    - SanjayMehta 4mo ago
      Economics is not a science either. It's a collection of factoids with correlations retrofitted to claim causation. This is all it is: "if x goes up then y goes down."
  - archagon 4mo ago
    Having mingled and worked at length with PhD-level folks in both STEM and the social sciences, rest assured: social scientists are some of the smartest researchers out there, almost to a frightening degree. So your dismissal is genuinely chuckle-inducing to me.

by timr 4mo ago

mold_aid 4mo ago

Perhaps better than "if I don't like it, it deserves to have its funding cut"

nixon_why69 4mo ago

I'm not well-versed in social science either so I don't have a slam dunk here, but I'd be very willing to bet it's more involved than you're portraying. To flip it on your space telescope, another one? They've been doing this for years, they're just going to tell us there's a lot of galaxies out there, boring.

timr 4mo ago
> To flip it on your space telescope, another one? They've been doing this for years, they're just going to tell us there's a lot of galaxies out there, boring. You’re not “flipping”, you’re just making a silly reduction. There’s tons of things we don’t know about black holes. We don’t need another study to tell us that poor people are sicker due to past racism. (One can certainly argue that it’s not worth the money to know more stuff about black holes. I am agnostic, but at least I see the difference in kind between the quality of the questions.)
- nixon_why69 4mo ago
  Now imagine that there might be more depth to social sciences as well? Do you think we have it all figured out? Is Economics solved as well?
  - timr 4mo ago
    > Now imagine that there might be more depth to social sciences as well? I didn't malign all social sciences. > Do you think we have it all figured out? No.
    - nixon_why69 4mo ago
      Ok so its just specifically the stuff at the intersection of race and poverty that bothers you? I'm not sure where this is going. I mean, yes, there's some shoddy ideology-as-science at various universities but those people all still have jobs. That's not what got cut by DOGE, apparently.
      - timr 4mo ago
        > Ok so its just specifically the stuff at the intersection of race and poverty that bothers you? I'm not sure where this is going. No, it's bad science that bothers me, and this particular article prominently mentioned this example of bad science in like, the third paragraph. I quoted this at the top of the thread. But I appreciate the subtle insinuation!
        nixon_why69 4mo ago
        From TFA (more like 10th graf after a lot on the NASA project): > research into the social determinants of health—structural racism in home-loan practices meant that nonwhite people got iced out of home ownership and generational wealth, which forced them to live in neighborhoods closer to toxic sites such as factories and highways, without sidewalks and amenities. “It’s a challenging field to quantify, but we’re getting to a place in science where we can start asking these questions,” That sounds like science to me, they're trying to quantify health outcomes relative to community environment. Later research can use the figures, just like with your black hole observations. One could say that maybe they should measure low-income communities in general with race as a dimension, but that doesn't make the whole thing "bad science".
        4mo ago
SanjayMehta 4mo ago
[flagged]
- Windchaser 4mo ago
  I don't follow. Are there not sciences that primarily study a type of human relationship? Economics, for instance, which covers our financial relationships with each other.
  - SanjayMehta 4mo ago
    Economics is not a science either. It's a collection of factoids with correlations retrofitted to claim causation. This is all it is: "if x goes up then y goes down."
- archagon 4mo ago
  Having mingled and worked at length with PhD-level folks in both STEM and the social sciences, rest assured: social scientists are some of the smartest researchers out there, almost to a frightening degree. So your dismissal is genuinely chuckle-inducing to me.