4 ms·
Empathy and respect for users is what product managers should be doing. Shipping tens of megabytes per web page is impolite, if not outright disrespectful to u
by ungreased0675 5mo ago
Empathy and respect for users is what product managers should be doing.
Shipping tens of megabytes per web page is impolite, if not outright disrespectful to users.
- ai_slop_hater 5mo agoThey don't know what a megabyte is
- jorisw 5mo agoThey feel the slowness of the page load
- alex_suzuki 5mo agoNot on their iPhones operating over 5G or the corporate WiFi.
- jorisw 5mo agoYou don't think there's any palpable difference as long as the connection is any good?
- hamburglar 5mo agoI think there’s a palpable difference but many young developers have no concept of why.
- afavour 5mo agoIt's still present. JSON/JS parsing still has a delay. And in either case (as the author states) not everyone is using an iPhone over 5G. Heavy React apps are a miserable experience on low end Android phones, even when the connection is fast. I've seen JS/JSON parsing times in the multiple seconds.
- kitd 5mo agoRead the article. Typical users had old browsers often with poor reception. One user was using a PlayStation Portable which had very limited WWW capability.
- sarchertech 5mo agoThe person you are replying to is saying the PMs are using new phones on WiFi, not that the customers are.
- alex_suzuki 5mo agoThank you.
- msla 5mo ago"What, support Safari? Isn't that, like, less than 20%? And its standards support is abysmal! No, not worth my time, they can upgrade to a normal browser like everyone else."
- shakna 5mo agoSalesforce and SAP are not fast, even on that. But ubiquitous for building corporate platforms for their customers.
- pier25 5mo agoThe vast majority of global users are not using iPhones.
- alex_suzuki 5mo agoYes, that was kind of the point of my comment. Apparently not well made.
- nonethewiser 5mo agoBut if they dont, where is the disrespect? They dont know what a megabyte is, they dont feel a slow page load. Where is the disrespect? React is too heavy weight for a lot of things. But it's ridiculous to call it disrespectful.
- Ruarl 5mo agoIf Rick Rubin could take a tape to his car to listen to his mixes, your product people can try their websites on £20 phones from Tesco. They can ask to sit in on user tests with minority groups. Extending your knowledge like this is trivial, but rarely done.
- genewitch 5mo agoMay i ask why, specifically, Rick Rubin? I don't know who that is, but whenever we finished mastering a new song, we had a series of "systems" we listened to it on. We went out to my dad's work van and listened there. We called up our friend with a street-comp sound system in his car, and listened in there (neighbors must have loved us!), and then a "cheap" boombox with large-ish speakers but cheap. if it sounded "clean" on all 3, without the bass muffling everything, and the highs not hurting the eardrums, we called it "good" and released.
- bgarbiak 5mo agoWorking in the music industry and not being aware who Rick Rubin is… is a bit weird.
- genewitch 4mo agoi don't work in the industry, sorry. We just made music and released mp3s, 1997-2008. Co-creator of Def Jam, alright. I wonder if David Lynch watches his stuff on a tiny screen just to make sure everyone has a good experience. hint: no, he thinks small screens are stupid. ETA: after like 3 years of mastering and reviewing this way i trusted my ears and my studio monitors enough to know what it would sound like. I also wrote in headphones and mastered on speakers, then remastered in monitor headphones. Anyhow, i think the whole point i was making is "yes, this is a good thing to do, for music, for websites, for software, etc"
- alok-g 5mo ago+1. I have been asked by someone in late 40s why uploading a video takes a lot longer than uploading a photo. They are not dumb people. They just do not know. The onus is on the engineers to design for them.
- shooly 5mo ago"Does it take longer to upload 10,000 photos than to upload 1 photo?" If a 40-year-old can not answer that question, then they are in fact - dumb.
- alok-g 5mo agoThis is a matter of perspectives here. Some of my friends are absolutely brilliant lawyers and they trump me in their reasoning abilities (while I am a typ. HN member, high-tech engineer). Yet, they would not know some tech basics. I see lawyers struggle with formatting in Microsoft Word all the time :-), for one. A brilliant physicist friend likewise once told me he is clueless how real numbers are handled in computers (not talking about floating point encoding specifics but conceptually itself). Yes, I can say that feels dumb, but I cannot deny that he is a brilliant physicist.
- shooly 4mo agoIt's not about perspectives, basically every human has the same baseline reasoning capabilities. Understanding that "more work = more time needed" is part of that baseline. The only "excuse" would be if someone didn't know what a film is at all, because they can't be expected to reason about something they don't have any knowledge about.
- pier25 5mo agoThe consequences of MBs of JavaScript can be perceived by anyone in terms of performance and mobile data consumption.
- HumblyTossed 5mo ago"If our users can't afford the bits, we don't need them!"
- epolanski 5mo agoYou're not a good and modern engineer who knows his craft if you aren't defaulting to react and tailwind. And don't dare to contradict me, the fact that MIT-bred leetcode ninjas paid half a million per year can't produce a simple (mostly static) website on that stack it's only because of management that wants to ship the next product. /s
- pier25 5mo ago> Shipping tens of megabytes per web page is impolite, if not outright disrespectful to users. You're being generous with what I would consider negligence.