4 ms·

You should realise (apparently not?) that many people alive today still farm with minimal technology .. moreover there are people alive still hunting and gather

by defrost 5mo ago

You should realise (apparently not?) that many people alive today still farm with minimal technology .. moreover there are people alive still hunting and gathering. They've not lost their skill to survive sans tech - unlike, say, yourself. Still, if it helps you - take notes: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7gmCX7R-W4c https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7gmCX7R-W4c

NoMoreNicksLeft 5mo ago
>You should realise (apparently not?) that many people alive today still farm with minimal technology Actually, I know alot more about this than you do. And what you call "minimal technology" is not the case at all. Do you think you could make a plow or use it, supposing you had a mule to go with it? Why do you think it's "minimal technology"? But if you insist it is, I take it to mean that you think just anyone could construct or procure a plow in the Mad Max wastelands, which is silly on its face. It's not just the bronze/iron/steel work. Now we're back to "can you make a rope?"... can you? I think with an hour or two you could make something. If I brought the tool for you to use. And if you had the fiber for it. But it takes quite alot of practice to get good at it, I'll never get there. And even if you had the tool (haha, sandcast one in iron for bonus points!), and had the practice, now you're a fucking hemp/jute/sissal/something farmer just to have enough fiber to make the ropes to plow, but you're no longer growing grain so you don't need the plow. Why is this minimal technology so uncooperative, do you think? Why do you need so many fucking specialties just to do subsistence farming? Maybe you should go out there like they did 12,000 years ago with a stone hoe and plant the seeds stooped over, one at a time. I'm sure the yields will be high enough with that that humanity's numbers can start growing again instead of shrinking. >Still, if it helps you - take notes: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7gmCX7R-W4c https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7gmCX7R-W4c Cute, someone who watches video instead of reads. That's... I dunno. Maybe if you read, you'd understand how centuries ago this continent was so full of game that those Europeans who saw it were astounded, but now there's practically nothing left. Not enough to feed a recovering civilization with anyway. Even if they used firearms instead of the spear in that video. I'll even forgiven that now you've stepped back even further from the subsistence agriculture thing to hunting-and-gathering. Maybe humanity should crawl back into the ocean and become fish too... that's how we'll beat extinction.
- defrost 5mo ago
  > Actually, I know alot more about this than you do. So you say. > Do you think you could make a plow or use it, supposing you had a mule to go with it? What, another one? We used oxen and draught horses rather than mules. > you think just anyone could construct or procure a plow in the Mad Max wastelands, I live in Australia, I know where many working old ploughs are - most of the farms here still have them on display - there are several on this very property. > Now we're back to "can you make a rope? Sure - been there, down that, have you? Look, this is getting dull - I'm 70, I grew up in a remote location, my father, still alive, born in 1935, fed his family as a child while his father was away at war - I've often spent months in remote areas. In the event of the collapse of the modern US tech sphere some humans will get by, others will not.
  - bombcar 5mo ago
    This whole line of argument has been incredibly entertaining to me, given those I know who could build a functional plow out of the ruins of damn near anything made of metal - even freeway signs can be made to service. That's not even counting those who can keep old Farmall tractors running on whatever they have laying around. It's not the greatest, but it's functional, and a mechanical horse is way more powerful than a real one - and even then, real ones are still quite capable of supporting more than subsistence.
    - defrost 5mo ago
      Yeah, I kind of take it for granted that humans can survive on what exists around them ... essentially everybody I know in rural W.Australia can do so. Most farms here keep a back log of every bit of kit they ever had, going back to the 1880s and earlier in some cases - I've helped strip down and rebuild a couple of Allis-Chalmers tractors in the past four years and the local small town car museum has a crazy number of historic vehicles (three wheels, steam powered, one time speed record holding, etc) that are kept in working order by locals. I've renovated old old houses in Fremantle and flipped them with very few contractors (while working on bleeding edge code bases) and built air strips in the PNG highlands, worked with wood workers, glass blowers and metal workers, etc. I suspect some people have spent a little too long behind screens and forgotten how to shear a sheep, draw, card, spin, and knit a jumper.

by defrost 5mo ago

NoMoreNicksLeft 5mo ago

>You should realise (apparently not?) that many people alive today still farm with minimal technology Actually, I know alot more about this than you do. And what you call "minimal technology" is not the case at all. Do you think you could make a plow or use it, supposing you had a mule to go with it? Why do you think it's "minimal technology"? But if you insist it is, I take it to mean that you think just anyone could construct or procure a plow in the Mad Max wastelands, which is silly on its face. It's not just the bronze/iron/steel work. Now we're back to "can you make a rope?"... can you? I think with an hour or two you could make something. If I brought the tool for you to use. And if you had the fiber for it. But it takes quite alot of practice to get good at it, I'll never get there. And even if you had the tool (haha, sandcast one in iron for bonus points!), and had the practice, now you're a fucking hemp/jute/sissal/something farmer just to have enough fiber to make the ropes to plow, but you're no longer growing grain so you don't need the plow. Why is this minimal technology so uncooperative, do you think? Why do you need so many fucking specialties just to do subsistence farming? Maybe you should go out there like they did 12,000 years ago with a stone hoe and plant the seeds stooped over, one at a time. I'm sure the yields will be high enough with that that humanity's numbers can start growing again instead of shrinking. >Still, if it helps you - take notes: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7gmCX7R-W4c https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7gmCX7R-W4c Cute, someone who watches video instead of reads. That's... I dunno. Maybe if you read, you'd understand how centuries ago this continent was so full of game that those Europeans who saw it were astounded, but now there's practically nothing left. Not enough to feed a recovering civilization with anyway. Even if they used firearms instead of the spear in that video. I'll even forgiven that now you've stepped back even further from the subsistence agriculture thing to hunting-and-gathering. Maybe humanity should crawl back into the ocean and become fish too... that's how we'll beat extinction.

defrost 5mo ago
> Actually, I know alot more about this than you do. So you say. > Do you think you could make a plow or use it, supposing you had a mule to go with it? What, another one? We used oxen and draught horses rather than mules. > you think just anyone could construct or procure a plow in the Mad Max wastelands, I live in Australia, I know where many working old ploughs are - most of the farms here still have them on display - there are several on this very property. > Now we're back to "can you make a rope? Sure - been there, down that, have you? Look, this is getting dull - I'm 70, I grew up in a remote location, my father, still alive, born in 1935, fed his family as a child while his father was away at war - I've often spent months in remote areas. In the event of the collapse of the modern US tech sphere some humans will get by, others will not.
- bombcar 5mo ago
  This whole line of argument has been incredibly entertaining to me, given those I know who could build a functional plow out of the ruins of damn near anything made of metal - even freeway signs can be made to service. That's not even counting those who can keep old Farmall tractors running on whatever they have laying around. It's not the greatest, but it's functional, and a mechanical horse is way more powerful than a real one - and even then, real ones are still quite capable of supporting more than subsistence.
  - defrost 5mo ago
    Yeah, I kind of take it for granted that humans can survive on what exists around them ... essentially everybody I know in rural W.Australia can do so. Most farms here keep a back log of every bit of kit they ever had, going back to the 1880s and earlier in some cases - I've helped strip down and rebuild a couple of Allis-Chalmers tractors in the past four years and the local small town car museum has a crazy number of historic vehicles (three wheels, steam powered, one time speed record holding, etc) that are kept in working order by locals. I've renovated old old houses in Fremantle and flipped them with very few contractors (while working on bleeding edge code bases) and built air strips in the PNG highlands, worked with wood workers, glass blowers and metal workers, etc. I suspect some people have spent a little too long behind screens and forgotten how to shear a sheep, draw, card, spin, and knit a jumper.