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> Why is this time different? If it was just programming being automated, then whatever. Lots of professions have been automated and society adapts. The under
by ekidd 4mo ago
> Why is this time different?
If it was just programming being automated, then whatever. Lots of professions have been automated and society adapts.
The underlying worry here is that current AI provides a partial automation of intelligence. The endgame for the investors and the corporations using AI is complete automation of intelligence (and manual labor, too). They want a $25,000 robot that works around the clock, and AI models that will do anything a human office worker can do for less money. Now, they don't know how to build either yet. But they'll spend every last dollar on the planet trying.
Strictly speaking, they don't even need us as customers. They can just have the robots build them yachts and mansions directly. And act as security guards.
- unsnap_biceps 4mo ago> Strictly speaking, they don't even need us as customers. They can just have the robots build them yachts and mansions directly. And act as security guards. That sounds like we'll devolve into wars over resources so houses can build more war-bots and get more resources....
- smallmancontrov 4mo agoStarcraft for Billionaires In the voice of worker-bot: "That's your plan?!?!"
- D-Machine 4mo ago> That sounds like we'll devolve into wars over resources Two astronauts meme: "Wait, it's all been over resources?" "Always has been"
- galactushonor 4mo agoThis time the have-nots have a better target to attack. The datacenters. A concentrated physical manifestation of would-be trillionaire superrichs.
- tasoeur 4mo agoUntil the datacenters happen to be in space.
- kibwen 4mo agoThere is no such thing as a self-sufficient version of any industry in space, and you should expect this to remain the case for approximately the next 10,000 years. Until then, everything that happens in space will have a supply chain rooted on Earth.
- kelnos 4mo agoThen the targets become the launch pads. Those space-based datacenters will need constant resupply and maintenance. Destroy launch capability, and their orbits will decay and all that computing capacity will burn up in the atmosphere. We are so so so far away from self-sustaining machinery in space that it's not even funny.
- neutronicus 4mo agoOnce there are like 150,000 humans resources will be functionally unlimited
- scoofy 4mo agoI mean, you are describing the vast majority of history.
- nerdsniper 4mo ago> Strictly speaking, they don't even need us as customers. I think they'd employ some number of humans for entertainment.
- danaris 4mo agoAt that point, why bother to employ? If we have no recourse, no power to resist them (as must be the case in that scenario), then they might as well just keep us as pets. Or slaves.
- cholmdomsky 4mo agoGotta feed both, so...
- red-iron-pine 4mo agothey're already replacing actors with AI, mate. Once the slop machine gets better you won't know the difference
- nerdsniper 4mo agoThere are some types of entertainment which are less audio-visual.
- palmotea 4mo ago> I think they'd employ some number of humans for entertainment. The key point is: some number. Chances are you and everyone you love won't make the cut. If 10 billionaires control the all the capital of the planet, they could exterminate 99% of humanity and not even notice any change in their day to day life. 83 million NPCs are more than enough for 10 people.
- coffeemug 4mo agoThe future you're describing doesn't seem likely to me because in this event the public will force redistribution through political action.
- idiotsecant 4mo agoNo they won't, not if they have just enough bread and circuses and someone below them to hate. Boil the frog slowly enough and it'll work out just fine for the capital class.
- c-smile 4mo agoYep. Evolutionary way to get to communism where "from each according to his ability, to each according to his needs" [1] [1] "https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/From_each_according_to_his_ability,_to_each_according_to_his_needs https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/From_each_according_to_his_abi...", circa 1875
- ako 4mo agoI don't see how you can relate this to communism. Sounds more like oligarchy/roman empire: a few own almost everything, but most have almost nothing and are being controlled with bread and games. Marxism is the opposite where everything is owned by everyone (in theory).
- c-smile 4mo agoWhat would be the name of the society where, say, 30,000 people + technology produce enough food and goods to satisfy the needs of the rest of Earth population? So those people will get whatever they need for life but will not be technically obligated to produce anything. We will first switch to 4 day working week, then 3 and so on, right? We will see Universal Basic Income "experiments" [1] more often until they become a norm. At least we are on the way to all this... [1] https://weall.org/resource/finland-universal-basic-income-pilot#:~:text=Finland%E2%80%99s%20two-year%20scheme%2C%20which%20ran%20in%202017%20and,reduction%20in%20their%20payment%20if%20they%20accepted%20one. https://weall.org/resource/finland-universal-basic-income-pi...
- daxfohl 4mo agoReminds me of the old short story "With Folded Hands" from 1947. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/With_Folded_Hands_ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/With_Folded_Hands_...
- PaulHoule 4mo agoThe sequel https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Humanoids https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Humanoids is even better!
- fragmede 4mo ago> They want a $25,000 robot that works around the clock Don't you? For the cost of less than a new car, I can have a live-in butler/maid? I'd sell my car and downgrade to afford one at $25k if it actually worked. I can't afford to and don't want to hire a human to live in my house and do all my chores for me, 24/7, plus the overhead and the headache and liability, but a robot for $25k is pretty tempting. Never have to fold laundry or the dishes again? Or remember that it's Tuesday and I was supposed to take out the trash, right when I'm in bed? It's an iterated prisoner's dilemma and everyone's vocally defecting.
- kuerbel 4mo agoUhm, no? What if it has a glitch or bug or gets hacked and wants to hurt me or someone else? I'd rather do all of that myself than own a movable bot that could crush my head like a melon for any reason while I'm sleeping, no thank you
- kelnos 4mo agoThis is just a function of the overton window. A couple decades ago most people probably thought a robot vacuum (with a camera on it!) was creepy, but now they're fairly commonplace, or at least well-accepted[0]. The bot safety issues are certainly real, but that's a trust/confidence hump to get over, and robotics companies will get there eventually. [0] Even considering we know employees of the manufacturers have abused the camera access!
- SauntSolaire 4mo agoIs it defecting if you get a robot to do your dishes, instead of doing them yourself? As you said, it's not taking a job from anyone, just freeing up time for yourself. If anything, this specific use-case sounds like it would be a major boon for nation-wide productivity with little downside.
- hunterpayne 4mo agoWe have had that for decades, its called a dishwasher. Its so common that its a compound word instead of dish washer. I feel like there are basic concepts of psychology and history that you don't understand if this is the point you want to make.
- deleted 4mo ago[deleted]
- bonoboTP 4mo agoI won't deny the comfort value of yachts and private jets, but I doubt that this material comfort is the main value proposition of these things. Instead, it's status symbols, status above slightly less rich people. The yachts are in a way an epiphenomenon of intra-elite social competition, and if you don't manage your network well, you can easily lose out in the next generation. Investment into social relations is what really matters. And when you're generationally rich, you typically think about making impressive impacts over society, the kind that impresses your social circle, based 9n their philosophy, which typically happens to be self serving but with just enough other stuff to not seem to crass. Taste is the highest status thing,not intelligence, not skill. It's hard to extrapolate. What will be the goals and motivations of this super elite? Let's say all of us normal people just die off either starving or just by not reproducing any more, just watching VR, sedated with subsidized happiness drugs. Let's just suppose that. What then? Will the rich keep reproducing? What will limit their reproduction if material abundance is there? Will the elite families keep each other in check not to over-reproduce? Or will these people repopulate the earth, each living on yachts and in comfort, living an elite life? Surely that will bump up against all kinds of limits, similar to what the current earth-populating humans are facing. You can't have a super yacht per person to an unlimited amount of millions of people. At some point they will have to willingly not reproduce despite having all access to robot care, robots watching your every whim etc. I don't see any stable endpoint.
- agumonkey 4mo agoHas anybody written about this ? in fiction or as report even. It seems obvious the current techbros are only thinking about a radical shift where labour changes meaning and human societies are irrelevant for those who owns datacenter and have pocket deep enough to buy the rest when people can't sustain their own lives.
- nevertoolate 4mo ago> If it was just programming being automated, then whatever. There is nothing on horizon which automates a programmer’s work. Typing in code is faster now, and some things “only need pointing out” like an existence of a “bug” which an llm + harness might be able to mitigate. Automated tests might capture regressions and possibly written by llm + harness. If you replicate this in other professions what will you get?