7 ms·
The bootstrapper's EU stack for under €10 per month
- gitowiec 5mo agoI thought I will find GetResponse there, but they are fucking greedy!
- embedding-shape 5mo agoWhat about DNS buying/hosting? Seems it's not mentioned (neither is emailing besides transactional/marketing). I'm currently on DNSimple but been trying to replace it with some closer to home (Europe) alternative that still offers the same level of possible automation as DNSimple does, anyone know of any that fits the bill?
- panja 5mo agoBunny.net is based in Europe
- mnahkies 5mo agoIt's not European, rather a New Zealand company but I find https://zonomi.com/ https://zonomi.com/ pretty good. There's a Lego resolver that works fine https://github.com/go-acme/lego https://github.com/go-acme/lego - although my only complaint is the DNS propagation takes a while though I suspect that's a my config problem (dig will show the txt record long before Lego sees it)
- SyneRyder 5mo agoWow, I'd never heard of Zonomi, or RimuHosting (which appears to be the parent company). Data centers in NZ & Oz & UK & Germany, and the website gives me the vibe of those customer focused companies of the late 90s / early 2000s, probably because they started in 2002. Pricing is a little more than I'd like, but I'm just pleased to see alternatives like this in Oceania. Thanks for sharing! Bookmarked immediately.
- mnahkies 5mo agoI've used their (same family of company) email hosting services lightly in the past and found that to work well also. For the DNS I'm paying like $1 a month which is probably more than it needs to be, but sufficiently low that I'm happy to support small/local business. I'm also reasonably confident I could get a response if anything ever goes wrong, untested as nothing has so far.
- byyll 5mo agoClouDNS is probably the most popular one.
- seszett 5mo agoOVH is one of the cheapest and works satisfactorily for me. I went back to OVH when Gandi stopped being a recommendable company. OVH's API allows full control of an account, but I don't know how that compares to DNSimple.
- omnimus 5mo agoI've just been moving some domains of cloudflare. I moved some to hetzner dns (works fine). Then i got recomended deSEC which is it's own open source project. But for one domain i needed CNAME for apex (or ANAME/ALIAS record) so that i moved to bunny.net. I think Bunny is pretty good replacement for many features of cloudflare.
- satvikpendem 5mo agoOn Herzner add Dokploy (Honduras, I prefer this even if it's not European) or Coolify (Hungary) to get a Vercel-like PaaS experience for free. Any others that are good?
- czhu12 5mo agoWe've been building canine.sh free and open source for an enterprise ready deployment platform. Think about it like coolify is to a VPS as Canine is to Kubernetes.
- ExpertAdvisor01 5mo agoLook at lowendtalk/box
- byyll 5mo agoI don't think that's an alternative to US hyperscalers. Scaleway is the closest thing there is. Replacing a single service with 10 others is not really an alternative in my opinion.
- veselin 5mo agoI would argue that with AI, this becomes less of an issue. Connect N services, deploy to bare metal. Granted, AI is an additional cost now local or remote. But so is the MacBook people use to develop their software.
- dotancohen 5mo agoNow you've got N potential points of failure.
- fmbb 5mo agoNot putting all your eggs in one basket is a good choice. I think the AWS service catalog makes you adopt more than you need or want anyway, it is a great way of locking people into one vendor.
- ted_dunning 5mo agoPutting your single egg into multiple baskets isn't all that much better. Now you have many points of failure rather than a single point of failure.
- thinkindie 5mo agothis website seems a clone of https://european-alternatives.eu/ https://european-alternatives.eu/ Either way, one of the most critical parts is that many are still hosting on Google Cloud, AWS or Microsoft, therefore you are not 100% insulated from Cloud Act.
- fmbb 5mo agoA lot of the alternatives there are tagged "EU hosted". Some are not. Are the ones that are tagged "EU hosted" among the ones you mean host on Google Cloud, AWS or Microsoft?
- thinkindie 5mo agoTake Tally (tally.so), the one I took the time to check. In their footer they say: Made and hosted in the EU which technically it's not wrong, but since they are using Google Cloud and Cloudflare, they are not insulated from the effect of the CLOUD Act.
- pickleballcourt 5mo agoHaven’t used herzner but heard good things
- redfloatplane 5mo agoI know it's boring to comment and say that something sounds like it was written by an AI, but this sounds like it was written by an AI. I am often especially suspicious of these listicle recommendation sites because it's pretty cheap and easy to have dozens of sites doing some list which just so happens to mention a specific service that 'quietly' does a 'surprisingly good job' of some doodad. This kind of submarine advertising feels like it might be quite common. Although in this case it seems they're trying more for a 'sponsorship' thing - 'our website got X views in Y days, sponsor us, random company!'
- sjdrc 5mo agoThe use of the word genuinely is always a dead giveaway
- ant6n 5mo agoIt genuinely is.
- chrisweekly 5mo agoYou're absolutely wrong.
- michaelsalim 5mo agoBut someone can genuinely like using the word!
- nodar86 5mo agoAnd “honestly” in the way it is used in this piece
- redfloatplane 5mo agoI recently came across https://tropes.fyi/directory https://tropes.fyi/directory which has a pretty solid set of common patterns, and I like it a lot. The pattern that always really bothers me is the one named "short punchy fragments", for example from the site “He published this. Openly. In a book. As a priest.” It kills me every time. I automatically lose any interest in the substance and often just throw away the whole conversation!
- FlxMgdnz 5mo agoThanks for listing Hanko as EU-based authentication provider. To be upfront about this, we’re still on AWS (Frankfurt), but "EU-owned" hosting/data regions will be available very soon.
- zuzululu 5mo agoany good reason to serve the EU? I am observing through various SaaS and support tickets and EU seem no average way more finicky and stingy than North American customers not to mention the absurd level of EU regulations you have to follow just to serve the same product at a much higher cost. It's like a bad mix of culture (bordering on arrogance and pathological in some bad cases) and over regulation. I always advise clients to avoid the EU at launch and focus on UK if they really want to do a test run and encourage them to focus on East Asia instead. You'd think Europe is this affluent and sophisticated customer demographic but again and again from data I see it couldn't be further from the truth.
- lstodd 5mo agoMaybe your product is just not an acceptable fit to EU customers? (as in "you are pushing shite no one wants but not accustomized to getting a well-deserved push-back")
- rhizome 5mo agoOut of curiosity, what EU laws does your 'same product' break?
- grim_io 5mo agoMaybe we have a more refined taste :)
- kevinkatzke 5mo agoHappy to see my friends from Hanko on the list, they are great and you should really try their privacy-first authentication.
- hollow-moe 5mo agoHave a look to OVH VPS their offers are real cheap and if you're not scarred of openstack they have this too.
- CodesInChaos 5mo ago> passkeys, the modern way to handle login that gets rid of password resets entirely Doesn't that just trade password resets for passkey resets? Or do they permanently lock out users who lose their passkey?
- Fire-Dragon-DoL 5mo agoThe second one
- iknowstuff 5mo agoYeah you just allow setting a new passkey by sending an email link, just like password resets. Passkeys don't have to be remembered, can't be phished, and don't need 2FA.
- c7b 5mo agoThat's highly misleading to outright misinformation. > Passkeys don't have to be remembered Because you need an app for the login flow. You also don't have to remember passwords if you use a password manager app. > don't need 2FA Not true, a second factor in the form of eg a biometric ID or PIN is mandatory. Phishing resistance exists, but only truly so if you completely surrender control over your device and access to your credentials. Something that the same organizations who you'll depend on for Passkeys are actively pushing for through various initiatives.
- iknowstuff 5mo agoNo it is not. You’re free to save passkeys in your manager of choice and it still won’t let you use a passkey on the wrong website. Users are freed from having to copy&paste TOTPs. No app other than a browser needed.
- port11 5mo agoPasskeys cannot be cryptographically reset, but plenty of providers have account recovery flows in case you lose your passkey. Without a recovery mechanism you’d be technically locked out, that’s true.
- BrunoBernardino 5mo agoAs someone who tries to "buy local", I have been a happy customer of the following recommended services for many months or years: - Hetzner (Cloud, Box, and Object Storage) - Brevo (for transactional emails) - Mollie For monitoring I use and recommend UpDown.io, which doesn’t seem to be listed there.
- port11 5mo agoI think you mean Brevo instead of Brave? Previously known by the (much better) name SendInBlue.
- BrunoBernardino 5mo agoYes, thank you! It’s so annoying how frequently that typo gets me, and my brain just skips over it. I’ve updated it above. And I also preferred SendInBlue!
- port11 5mo agoiOS still thinks I really, really mean ‘bexause’ instead of ‘because’, so your typo barely registered. My only gripe with SIB was terribly low deliverability to Outlook, even with full config.
- sparkling 5mo agoAfter Sendgrid got acquired by Twilio and retired their free plan, i also went with Brevo and am quite happy with it. No deliverability issues on the major email operators (Google, MS365) at all, decent delivery speed.
- chrisweekly 5mo agoFastmail is excellent, FWIW
- BrunoBernardino 5mo ago
- jviotti 5mo agoYou are missing https://unikraft.com/pricing https://unikraft.com/pricing. Amazing compute, 2 instances free. A German company. Offers EU hosting too. Just a happy paying user myself
- Onavo 5mo agoHow do they compare to the likes of fly.io, Railway, Render, Northflank ?
- jviotti 5mo agoThey focus on compute only. Otherwise roughly the same thing, but you get amazing performance with their own technology (from research, part of the Linux Foundation) to boot, sleep, and wake instances up in bare milliseconds. You deploy using a Dockerfile, or Docker Compose. Definitely suggest you give it a shot. The free plan is a no-brainer for the performance you get. We are on the team plan at https://www.sourcemeta.com https://www.sourcemeta.com
- Doohickey-d 5mo agoHm, interesting. But the pricing page is quite confusing to me: the $39 "pro plan" says "Up to 8 instances running". And above that, "Pricing that scales to zero". But if I'm always paying $39, what's the point of scaling to zero vs just keeping the 8 instances running? I guess the point is that you can scale down one workload and scale up another, but that seems a bit niche compared to the much more common use case of "scale up with increased user activity, and pay less when users are sleeping". It's missing some sort of per-minute / per-GB RAM "pay as you go" pricing model. It seems like Fly.io, but missing the pay-as-you-go pricing & rapid scaling model that makes Fly worth using.
- Reubend 5mo agoYeah I really agree. There's no overage pricing on their website's main pricing page, which makes me think the jump from "Team" to "Pro" to negotiating an enterprise contract will really hurt. Going from $39/month to $199/moth because you needed slightly more is a really big jump in pricing. It's pretty much the opposite of what I would expect from a service that lets you scale to 0.
- selectively 5mo ago[flagged]
- neuronic 5mo agoXenophobic from whose perspective...? For Europeans, every EU alternative should be strongly considered to help reduce dependency risks wherever possible.
- aplomb1026 5mo ago[flagged]
- loremm 5mo ago[dead]
- zkmon 5mo agoInteresting. Wonder if they have competitive pricing on GPU instances.
- conqrr 5mo agoFor a bootstrapper's computeless log search solution using Duckdb and s3 compatible store, use Blobsearch (https://github.com/amr8t/blobsearch https://github.com/amr8t/blobsearch)
- haarolean 5mo agoCreem is just a MoR layer on top of Stripe. Not really an EU alternative.
- omnimus 5mo agoIs it? I couldn't find info about it.
- amelius 5mo agoBut what laptop do you access it from? Apple is more a service provider than a hardware vendor these days. You can't realistically own Apple hardware without periodically connecting to Apple.
- gyanchawdhary 5mo agoFremdschämen
- grebc 5mo agoI read this, and the list is fine. But the title made me think VPS + self hosting of services like xmox for email/transactional email… you know since we’re bootstrapping and all.
- _pdp_ 5mo agocbk.ai - nearly 100% eu with a few small exceptions we will finish migrating by the end of Q3
- rowbin 5mo agoInteresting, I looked into some of these types of services for my SaaS but used none of the listed providers except Mollie. I landed on IONOS for hosting, Scaleway for transactional mails, mailbox.org for receiving and sending manual mails and statichost.eu for hosting my docs.
- tmaier 5mo agoI would be interested to learn more about Mollie as an alternative to Stripe. I saw that it has some Subscription API endpoints, but I am not sure how it compares in real life to Stripe. How much would I need to build myself in a classical Ruby on Rails SaaS app compared to pay gem/stripe? Are there any reference implementations for any of mainstream programming language and web development frameworks for this use-case?
- dominikz 5mo agoFrom the two cloud services listed I have only experience with Hetzner Cloud (extensive) and OVHCloud (less). The other day (2 years back) when I did research on whether to use one or the other, it turned out that OVHCloud did not have any reasonable user management, ie. you would need to do all the machine acquisition under one 'root' account. That was a deal breaker and the reason why going with Hetzner Cloud felt more natural. I can still confirm that the choice was good from my perspective. I wonder if anything changed WRT to user management in OVHCloud and how does it compare to other platforms.
- alanorourke 4mo agoA European alternative to Substack is https://www.getlouderlines.com/ https://www.getlouderlines.com/.