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> But for me, it becomes the event my whole day starts to revolve around. I have to break out of my flow, put my tasks on hold, take the call, and then get back

> But for me, it becomes the event my whole day starts to revolve around. I have to break out of my flow, put my tasks on hold, take the call, and then get back into context. In the end, a 10-minute call can cost me several hours of focus. Occasionally I get this feeling for a large customer meeting or a public talk, because there are consequences and serious prep. But this is just trying to normalize extreme social anxiety and call it a management style. One reason you get together to talk is so you can hash out details on potentially ambiguous topics, so you don't head in the wrong direction causing net negative contribution. Another is that people are not automata. Humans require inspiration and motivation and you need to reinforce the vision of what you are building and why. Its also even sometimes a reasonable idea to ask about how their life is going and check up on their family and pets and career aspirations. In general, some people should not be managers, and there is plenty of room in the world for super ICs.

Rohansi 5mo ago
> Another is that people are not automata. Humans require inspiration and motivation and you need to reinforce the vision of what you are building and why. Its also even sometimes a reasonable idea to ask about how their life is going and check up on their family and pets and career aspirations. And you need meetings to do all of this? There are so many other ways to communicate which you make more use of when you are less dependent on meetings. It's not a binary choice between meetings and extreme social anxiety.
- darkwater 5mo ago
  > And you need meetings to do all of this? There are so many other ways to communicate which you make more use of when you are less dependent on meetings. It's not a choice between meetings and extreme social anxiety. Yes, "this meeting could have been an email", async communication and all that jazz. Nonetheless stating that a 10 minutes quick chat is going to be the center of that day for you definitely signals social anxiety.
  - Rohansi 5mo ago
    > stating that a 10 minutes quick chat is going to be the center of that day for you definitely signals social anxiety. It really doesn't. You may not be aware of it but you quite literally have to structure your work day around your meetings because the meetings are fixed time blocks where you have to go and do something else. If you were in the zone, having a productive day, you are absolutely going to have a big slump (maybe) leading up to the meeting and after the meeting. > Yes, "this meeting could have been an email", async communication and all that jazz. That would be ideal for most cases! But even informal calls (messaging "can we hop on a call?) could be better because they are less overhead to book, not a commitment, have some preparation/context already in messages, etc.
CharlesW 5mo ago
Yes, the "10-minute call becomes the event my whole day starts to revolve around" is very ADHD and/or autism coded (I'm non-neurotyopical and also mountain this molehill), and there's a lot of rationalization about this in the article. Being a manager means accommodating neurotypical people, too. I agree that the author should think hard about whether management is the best place for them.
- eterm 5mo ago
  I can relate to being distracted for a time before a meeting and unable to focus on something else in preparation for it, but these lines stuck out in a way I can't relate: > unpleasant if I end up not liking the person > Their tone, manner of speaking, their emotions. That can ruin my whole day. Why should this person demand that they like or are liked by everyone, and why should it ruin their day to keep things professional? That sounds extremely highly-strung.
  - sersi 5mo ago
    I don't see those lines in the article text anymore. Wonder if the author edited them out..
InsideOutSanta 5mo ago
Yeah, I'm totally in favor of minimizing calls. It's easier to reference text, and I have more time to formulate my thoughts. But calls have value, too. It's important to show a client that you care by being there in person, it's important to see your coworkers once in a while and ask them how they're doing.
sonofhans 5mo ago
Yes, this post is one half of “Maker’s schedule, manager’s schedule” — https://paulgraham.com/makersschedule.html https://paulgraham.com/makersschedule.html “In all that time, I’ve never met a single person who sincerely wanted more dailies, syncs, and meetings.” Oh, I guarantee that OP has met these people, and that they have told him this multiple times in ways that he does not understand.
- theorchid 5mo ago
  Sorry, I forgot to add “I’ve never met a single person, except for managers and recruiters”.
  - sonofhans 5mo ago
    I can easily list in my head many people I’ve worked with who’ve expressed dissatisfaction at the lack of regular contact with their coworkers. I’ve seen this universally across engineers, designers, sales people … and yes, managers and recruiters. (Not as often as I’ve heard “We have too _many_ meetings,” I’ll grant you). If you claim only to have seen this in those limited roles then I still believe that you are filtering your inputs.

Rohansi 5mo ago

> Another is that people are not automata. Humans require inspiration and motivation and you need to reinforce the vision of what you are building and why. Its also even sometimes a reasonable idea to ask about how their life is going and check up on their family and pets and career aspirations. And you need meetings to do all of this? There are so many other ways to communicate which you make more use of when you are less dependent on meetings. It's not a binary choice between meetings and extreme social anxiety.

darkwater 5mo ago
> And you need meetings to do all of this? There are so many other ways to communicate which you make more use of when you are less dependent on meetings. It's not a choice between meetings and extreme social anxiety. Yes, "this meeting could have been an email", async communication and all that jazz. Nonetheless stating that a 10 minutes quick chat is going to be the center of that day for you definitely signals social anxiety.
- Rohansi 5mo ago
  > stating that a 10 minutes quick chat is going to be the center of that day for you definitely signals social anxiety. It really doesn't. You may not be aware of it but you quite literally have to structure your work day around your meetings because the meetings are fixed time blocks where you have to go and do something else. If you were in the zone, having a productive day, you are absolutely going to have a big slump (maybe) leading up to the meeting and after the meeting. > Yes, "this meeting could have been an email", async communication and all that jazz. That would be ideal for most cases! But even informal calls (messaging "can we hop on a call?) could be better because they are less overhead to book, not a commitment, have some preparation/context already in messages, etc.

CharlesW 5mo ago

Yes, the "10-minute call becomes the event my whole day starts to revolve around" is very ADHD and/or autism coded (I'm non-neurotyopical and also mountain this molehill), and there's a lot of rationalization about this in the article. Being a manager means accommodating neurotypical people, too. I agree that the author should think hard about whether management is the best place for them.

eterm 5mo ago
I can relate to being distracted for a time before a meeting and unable to focus on something else in preparation for it, but these lines stuck out in a way I can't relate: > unpleasant if I end up not liking the person > Their tone, manner of speaking, their emotions. That can ruin my whole day. Why should this person demand that they like or are liked by everyone, and why should it ruin their day to keep things professional? That sounds extremely highly-strung.
- sersi 5mo ago
  I don't see those lines in the article text anymore. Wonder if the author edited them out..

InsideOutSanta 5mo ago

Yeah, I'm totally in favor of minimizing calls. It's easier to reference text, and I have more time to formulate my thoughts. But calls have value, too. It's important to show a client that you care by being there in person, it's important to see your coworkers once in a while and ask them how they're doing.

sonofhans 5mo ago

Yes, this post is one half of “Maker’s schedule, manager’s schedule” — https://paulgraham.com/makersschedule.html https://paulgraham.com/makersschedule.html “In all that time, I’ve never met a single person who sincerely wanted more dailies, syncs, and meetings.” Oh, I guarantee that OP has met these people, and that they have told him this multiple times in ways that he does not understand.

theorchid 5mo ago
Sorry, I forgot to add “I’ve never met a single person, except for managers and recruiters”.
- sonofhans 5mo ago
  I can easily list in my head many people I’ve worked with who’ve expressed dissatisfaction at the lack of regular contact with their coworkers. I’ve seen this universally across engineers, designers, sales people … and yes, managers and recruiters. (Not as often as I’ve heard “We have too _many_ meetings,” I’ll grant you). If you claim only to have seen this in those limited roles then I still believe that you are filtering your inputs.