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The official replies started off by addressing ... the "unacceptable abusive behavior towards AMD". The most important thing here is obviously to ask people not

by mort96 5mo ago

The official replies started off by addressing ... the "unacceptable abusive behavior towards AMD". The most important thing here is obviously to ask people not to use such hurtful words as "disgraceful" towards poor little AMD... Answering the actual question seems not a high priority

adrian_b 5mo ago
Some people, including the management of most big corporations, claim that verbal insults, which do no actual physical harm to anyone, are "unacceptable abusive behavior", while the actions that do physical harm to others, e.g. by tricking or forcing them to pay an extra part of their hard-earned money for things that should not have been paid, because they had already been paid in another form, instead of using that money for worthy purposes, are not "unacceptable abusive behavior". Obviously, I believe that a decision like that made by AMD now is a much more "unacceptable abusive behavior" than any kind of verbal insult ever known to mankind. This kind of decision is a masked price rise of the AMD FPGAs that applies only to small businesses and individuals, while the big quasi-monopolistic companies are not affected, which will make competing with them even more difficult. What annoys me most about this kind of policies aimed to hurt small businesses and individuals and favor big companies, which have become more and more frequent, is that in most cases they do not provide any financial benefit whatsoever to the company that enacts them, because they limit competition not in the market where that company activates, but in related markets. However such policies are very beneficial for the entire class of people who are major shareholders, board members or executives in big companies, by ensuring that all markets are eventually dominated by few, which has happened especially after the end of the nineties of the past century, resulting in the current unhealthy economies of the Western countries and especially of USA. This success of the quasi-monopolies has been caused by the lack of truly adequate consumer protection laws.
- Drakim 5mo ago
  I agree with your point (that AMD does a lot more harm than what they are indignant about) but not the way you go there. If emotional abusive behavior is not "physical harm" because it's just emotions, then financial abusive behavior is not "physical harm" either because it's just numbers. When you consider what incredible harm being emotionally unwell can lead to, I don't think it deserves to be dismissed. AMD is clearly just putting on a performance here though, using the backlash they get as a weapon.
  - mort96 5mo ago
    Yea insulting and being verbally abusive towards individuals is something that it's worth taking action against. My problem with AMD's response is simply that they take issue with "bad language or abusive behavior towards AMD".
    - OneDeuxTriSeiGo 5mo ago
      NGL that phrase reads as an "ESL-ism" where the intended phrasing is "towards AMD moderators/employees/whatever" i.e. "Don't be a dick to the people trying to help/answer questions" not "don't be mean to the company". Other quirks with their writing style seem to lend support to this being an "ESL-ism" as well.
  - cumshitpiss 5mo ago
    AMD is not a person. It has no emotions. Any perceived emotional harm by humans is them projecting themselves onto the AMD entity. Whereas AMDs actions here cause real harm to individuals.
    - speff 5mo ago
      AMD and any other corpo is made of people, who do have emotions. Abuse towards these people impacts corp operations. This is an entity protecting itself from damage that it feels is not worth the benefit the offering would bring. And I question your assertion of real harm to individuals, by not offering free support, being worse than receiving verbal abuse.
      - cumshitpiss 5mo ago
        Was the abuse and response directed at a person or AMD? Even AMDs response is vague and deflects it as “Abuse towards AMD” AMD is free to change their terms of their product, but then characterizing the backlash as abuse towards AMD is laughable. Have empathy for people not corporations
      - stavros 5mo ago
- makeitdouble 5mo ago
  > claim that verbal insults, which do no actual physical harm to anyone, are "unacceptable abusive behavior" Which is true in a vacuum. Insulting _people_ is abusive behavior and shouldn't be accepted. The issue here is the posts aren't insulting people, they're insulting a company, and a company can't be mentally abused.
  - tekchip 5mo ago
    There are still individuals, who make up the company, who have to read and try to formulate responses to said abusive behavior. It's usually the lower paid support staff not the engineers or C suite who have those duties. As one of those people I can confirm it absolutely takes a toll.
    - jeltz 5mo ago
      Nah, feel free to insult any company I have worked for or even the company that I am one of the founders of. I don't see why that should be off limits. But do not insult me as a person.
- basisword 5mo ago
  I'll come your place of work and hurl abuse at you all day. Let's see if you find it harmful or not by the end of the week.
jeroenhd 5mo ago
Probably a good thing I don't run a company, because I wouldn't put energy into responding to the kind of comments they're addressing. If you use a support channel the same way a teenager uses Reddit, you should count to ten and try again later. That said, the tone and basic grammar of AMD's support rep isn't what I would've expected either. They did answer the question, though: > AMD expectation is that the BASIC tier licensing level is used for simple, entry‑level needs. While more advanced, production-based workflows are aligned with paid tiers. In other words, they're saying hobbyists and beginners are on Windows anyway, and students can get a free version if they apply through the right channels. No more freebies. AMD wants people to pay for their software. Instead of going "why are you bullying Linux users", AMD customers should probably be going "thank god the Windows version is still free (for now)"
- robinsonb5 5mo ago
  > In other words, they're saying hobbyists and beginners are on Windows anyway I suspect they're massively underestimating how many hobbyists and students are on Linux. We're not talking about a typical demographic here, we're talking about people interested in computers and technology at precisely the level that Windows and MacOS aim to isolate from the user.
- mort96 5mo ago
  You're kind of doing the job for them here by inventing a connection between Linux and "simple, entry-level needs". Plenty of Linux users have "simple, entry-level needs"; nothing about using Windows automatically makes you needs simpler. If that is indeed their argument, they ought to have spelled it out.
matheusmoreira 5mo ago
Yeah that was hilarious, pretty much instantly closed the tab when I read that. Oh please mister, won't you please think of the little billion dollar corporation's feelings? They're only poor corporations with nothing to their names but their billion dollar businesses! Won't you think of the starving corporations?!
bborud 5mo ago
Yes, this struck me as rather odd and unprofessional too. Do you really want to depend on a company where customer facing representatives can’t handle people being upset? Especially when to company has just announced changes that limit what users can do with their products. The older I get the less I want to deal with companies that act like primadonnas and the technologies they make. This is also why I don’t do phone apps: your market access is 100% controlled by two companies that can wipe out your business overnight. Imagine having to work with these people professionally. With real money involved. While probably not as high risk as mobile development, their customer representatives seem like real primadonnas. You’ll be happier without these people in your life.
- nubinetwork 5mo ago
  > Yes, this struck me as rather odd and unprofessional too. Do you really want to depend on a company where customer facing representatives can’t handle people being upset Typical phone CSR boilover from covid days. Most places I call these days have a message saying that they will hang up on you if you act pissy.
  - Aurornis 5mo ago
    > have a message saying that they will hang up on you if you act pissy. When I had some influence over customer support at a company once I set a similar expectation. We didn’t advertise it up front but if a customer was being abusive over support channels they could be cut off. Big morale boost for customer support. Abusive customers are rare but they can think it’s their job to attack, threaten, and be uncivil. Being stuck in a position where you’re forced to placate angry man-children sucks. It’s sad that there are so many comments here trying to attack the forum moderator for moderating the forum. This person had no hand in the decision making. No reason to treat them as an outlet for anger.
    - cindyllm 5mo ago
      [dead]
    - 5mo ago
shevy-java 5mo ago
> Answering the actual question seems not a high priority This is a clear sign of propaganda and bullshitting by them. Because answering the actual question would be easy, unless you deliberately want to harass linux users. Perhaps a Barbara Streisand effect kicks in, because people are now sharpening their ears and eyes as to why they harass linux users specifically. I also have to admit that while my main operating system is linux, on my left side I have a windows computer too. I found this approach more practical, even though I think Linux is far superior to windows. This abuse by private entities to try to force everyone to use winows, is anonying to no ends though.
jmull 5mo ago
I don't know anything about this situation, but basic logic says if you want someone to give you free stuff, be nice to them. It wouldn't surprise me if AMD is scaling back their free offerings due to the impact on support.
- gilrain 5mo ago
  > It wouldn't surprise me if AMD is scaling back their free offerings due to the impact on support. They’re welcome to hamstring themselves in the market; it’s just not a smart move.
  - ThrowawayR2 5mo ago
    Who are the alternatives to Xilinx on the high end currently? Altera? Lattice and the others make comparatively small FPGAs IIRC.
jagged-chisel 5mo ago
Seems we have an awful lot of snowflakes in the corporate tech world the last couple years. Can’t take criticism, can’t handle basic questioning of their operation …
- PearlRiver 5mo ago
  [flagged]
  - NamlchakKhandro 5mo ago
    not sure why you're downvot... yes i do. You raise an important topic. Way too many people not going through initiation of adult hood, leaning into their grandiose inner thoughts.
musicale 5mo ago
You answer all the questions we do not ask. Please answer the primary question this issue is about. Why is Linux not supported in the BASIC tier? seems about right
musicale 5mo ago
"Well, some guy in marketing figured that we could make more money by charging more money, especially for things that we didn't previously charge money for. This was validated by ChatGPT as the kind of brilliant insight that qualifies someone for an MBA. You may take some solace in the fact that we somehow managed to preserve a free version for broke idiots who use Windows."

by mort96 5mo ago

adrian_b 5mo ago

Some people, including the management of most big corporations, claim that verbal insults, which do no actual physical harm to anyone, are "unacceptable abusive behavior", while the actions that do physical harm to others, e.g. by tricking or forcing them to pay an extra part of their hard-earned money for things that should not have been paid, because they had already been paid in another form, instead of using that money for worthy purposes, are not "unacceptable abusive behavior". Obviously, I believe that a decision like that made by AMD now is a much more "unacceptable abusive behavior" than any kind of verbal insult ever known to mankind. This kind of decision is a masked price rise of the AMD FPGAs that applies only to small businesses and individuals, while the big quasi-monopolistic companies are not affected, which will make competing with them even more difficult. What annoys me most about this kind of policies aimed to hurt small businesses and individuals and favor big companies, which have become more and more frequent, is that in most cases they do not provide any financial benefit whatsoever to the company that enacts them, because they limit competition not in the market where that company activates, but in related markets. However such policies are very beneficial for the entire class of people who are major shareholders, board members or executives in big companies, by ensuring that all markets are eventually dominated by few, which has happened especially after the end of the nineties of the past century, resulting in the current unhealthy economies of the Western countries and especially of USA. This success of the quasi-monopolies has been caused by the lack of truly adequate consumer protection laws.

Drakim 5mo ago
I agree with your point (that AMD does a lot more harm than what they are indignant about) but not the way you go there. If emotional abusive behavior is not "physical harm" because it's just emotions, then financial abusive behavior is not "physical harm" either because it's just numbers. When you consider what incredible harm being emotionally unwell can lead to, I don't think it deserves to be dismissed. AMD is clearly just putting on a performance here though, using the backlash they get as a weapon.
- mort96 5mo ago
  Yea insulting and being verbally abusive towards individuals is something that it's worth taking action against. My problem with AMD's response is simply that they take issue with "bad language or abusive behavior towards AMD".
  - OneDeuxTriSeiGo 5mo ago
    NGL that phrase reads as an "ESL-ism" where the intended phrasing is "towards AMD moderators/employees/whatever" i.e. "Don't be a dick to the people trying to help/answer questions" not "don't be mean to the company". Other quirks with their writing style seem to lend support to this being an "ESL-ism" as well.
- cumshitpiss 5mo ago
  AMD is not a person. It has no emotions. Any perceived emotional harm by humans is them projecting themselves onto the AMD entity. Whereas AMDs actions here cause real harm to individuals.
  - speff 5mo ago
    AMD and any other corpo is made of people, who do have emotions. Abuse towards these people impacts corp operations. This is an entity protecting itself from damage that it feels is not worth the benefit the offering would bring. And I question your assertion of real harm to individuals, by not offering free support, being worse than receiving verbal abuse.
    - cumshitpiss 5mo ago
      Was the abuse and response directed at a person or AMD? Even AMDs response is vague and deflects it as “Abuse towards AMD” AMD is free to change their terms of their product, but then characterizing the backlash as abuse towards AMD is laughable. Have empathy for people not corporations
    - stavros 5mo ago
makeitdouble 5mo ago
> claim that verbal insults, which do no actual physical harm to anyone, are "unacceptable abusive behavior" Which is true in a vacuum. Insulting _people_ is abusive behavior and shouldn't be accepted. The issue here is the posts aren't insulting people, they're insulting a company, and a company can't be mentally abused.
- tekchip 5mo ago
  There are still individuals, who make up the company, who have to read and try to formulate responses to said abusive behavior. It's usually the lower paid support staff not the engineers or C suite who have those duties. As one of those people I can confirm it absolutely takes a toll.
  - jeltz 5mo ago
    Nah, feel free to insult any company I have worked for or even the company that I am one of the founders of. I don't see why that should be off limits. But do not insult me as a person.
basisword 5mo ago
I'll come your place of work and hurl abuse at you all day. Let's see if you find it harmful or not by the end of the week.

jeroenhd 5mo ago

Probably a good thing I don't run a company, because I wouldn't put energy into responding to the kind of comments they're addressing. If you use a support channel the same way a teenager uses Reddit, you should count to ten and try again later. That said, the tone and basic grammar of AMD's support rep isn't what I would've expected either. They did answer the question, though: > AMD expectation is that the BASIC tier licensing level is used for simple, entry‑level needs. While more advanced, production-based workflows are aligned with paid tiers. In other words, they're saying hobbyists and beginners are on Windows anyway, and students can get a free version if they apply through the right channels. No more freebies. AMD wants people to pay for their software. Instead of going "why are you bullying Linux users", AMD customers should probably be going "thank god the Windows version is still free (for now)"

robinsonb5 5mo ago
> In other words, they're saying hobbyists and beginners are on Windows anyway I suspect they're massively underestimating how many hobbyists and students are on Linux. We're not talking about a typical demographic here, we're talking about people interested in computers and technology at precisely the level that Windows and MacOS aim to isolate from the user.
mort96 5mo ago
You're kind of doing the job for them here by inventing a connection between Linux and "simple, entry-level needs". Plenty of Linux users have "simple, entry-level needs"; nothing about using Windows automatically makes you needs simpler. If that is indeed their argument, they ought to have spelled it out.

matheusmoreira 5mo ago

Yeah that was hilarious, pretty much instantly closed the tab when I read that. Oh please mister, won't you please think of the little billion dollar corporation's feelings? They're only poor corporations with nothing to their names but their billion dollar businesses! Won't you think of the starving corporations?!

bborud 5mo ago

Yes, this struck me as rather odd and unprofessional too. Do you really want to depend on a company where customer facing representatives can’t handle people being upset? Especially when to company has just announced changes that limit what users can do with their products. The older I get the less I want to deal with companies that act like primadonnas and the technologies they make. This is also why I don’t do phone apps: your market access is 100% controlled by two companies that can wipe out your business overnight. Imagine having to work with these people professionally. With real money involved. While probably not as high risk as mobile development, their customer representatives seem like real primadonnas. You’ll be happier without these people in your life.

nubinetwork 5mo ago
> Yes, this struck me as rather odd and unprofessional too. Do you really want to depend on a company where customer facing representatives can’t handle people being upset Typical phone CSR boilover from covid days. Most places I call these days have a message saying that they will hang up on you if you act pissy.
- Aurornis 5mo ago
  > have a message saying that they will hang up on you if you act pissy. When I had some influence over customer support at a company once I set a similar expectation. We didn’t advertise it up front but if a customer was being abusive over support channels they could be cut off. Big morale boost for customer support. Abusive customers are rare but they can think it’s their job to attack, threaten, and be uncivil. Being stuck in a position where you’re forced to placate angry man-children sucks. It’s sad that there are so many comments here trying to attack the forum moderator for moderating the forum. This person had no hand in the decision making. No reason to treat them as an outlet for anger.
  - cindyllm 5mo ago
    [dead]
  - 5mo ago

shevy-java 5mo ago

> Answering the actual question seems not a high priority This is a clear sign of propaganda and bullshitting by them. Because answering the actual question would be easy, unless you deliberately want to harass linux users. Perhaps a Barbara Streisand effect kicks in, because people are now sharpening their ears and eyes as to why they harass linux users specifically. I also have to admit that while my main operating system is linux, on my left side I have a windows computer too. I found this approach more practical, even though I think Linux is far superior to windows. This abuse by private entities to try to force everyone to use winows, is anonying to no ends though.

jmull 5mo ago

I don't know anything about this situation, but basic logic says if you want someone to give you free stuff, be nice to them. It wouldn't surprise me if AMD is scaling back their free offerings due to the impact on support.

gilrain 5mo ago
> It wouldn't surprise me if AMD is scaling back their free offerings due to the impact on support. They’re welcome to hamstring themselves in the market; it’s just not a smart move.
- ThrowawayR2 5mo ago
  Who are the alternatives to Xilinx on the high end currently? Altera? Lattice and the others make comparatively small FPGAs IIRC.

jagged-chisel 5mo ago

Seems we have an awful lot of snowflakes in the corporate tech world the last couple years. Can’t take criticism, can’t handle basic questioning of their operation …

PearlRiver 5mo ago
[flagged]
- NamlchakKhandro 5mo ago
  not sure why you're downvot... yes i do. You raise an important topic. Way too many people not going through initiation of adult hood, leaning into their grandiose inner thoughts.

musicale 5mo ago

You answer all the questions we do not ask. Please answer the primary question this issue is about. Why is Linux not supported in the BASIC tier? seems about right

musicale 5mo ago

"Well, some guy in marketing figured that we could make more money by charging more money, especially for things that we didn't previously charge money for. This was validated by ChatGPT as the kind of brilliant insight that qualifies someone for an MBA. You may take some solace in the fact that we somehow managed to preserve a free version for broke idiots who use Windows."