6 ms·

Knowing what numbers are real through an official publication is very good, but it only allows you to place trust in calls you make, not calls you receive, beca

Knowing what numbers are real through an official publication is very good, but it only allows you to place trust in calls you make, not calls you receive, because making calls doesn't involve caller ID, receiving calls does, and caller ID is spoofable.

bdavbdav 5mo ago
That would take nothing to implement. Services like Truecaller already do live caller ID against databases on iOS / Android. All it would take is a sensible register of verified numbers
- Abishek_Muthian 5mo ago
  Several of the bank scammers had their profile verified as the bank in the Truecaller[1]. [1] https://xcancel.com/Abishek_Muthian/status/1806348022290211321 https://xcancel.com/Abishek_Muthian/status/18063480222902113...
  - l23k4 5mo ago
    Truecaller can tell you about who a phone number belongs to. Truecaller cannot accurately tell you whether or not the person calling you from a phone number is actually in control of that phone number.
    - TeMPOraL 5mo ago
      Won't stop people from trying to make Truecaller, et al. prove that, though. The problem here is that the correct security posture of the bank against third-party scams also protects the customers from first-party scams. Telling people the bank will never call them for anything, and even if, they're to always hang up and call the number on the back of their card, works equally well against criminals and telemarketers.
      - l23k4 5mo ago
        I feel like this is kind-of a solved problem in the jurisdictions where banks are liable for customer losses not arising from gross negligence. If a bank calls their customers directly and trains them to get phished, the bank does not get to claim gross negligence when this happens and has to refund the customer. If a bank tells their customers that they'll never call them (and actually doesn't), they have much better chances of claiming gross negligence on the part of the customer.
4ndrewl 5mo ago
That's the number one rule though. If someone calls you claiming to be your bank, just say "I'll call you back"
- smcin 5mo ago
  Ask them their name/ last initial, employee ID or unique identifier for the conversation, direct phone number, job title and what location they're based at. Scammers will pretty much always refuse/argue/hang up on this (once I had one start insulting my mother in Hindi when I asked him this). Then call your bank's proper number and verify all of these details. (But in any case your bank will never call outwards to you, unless you've specifically requested that, which you almost never do.)
  - DamonHD 5mo ago
    Unfortunately my UK banks (and others) DO regularly make calls to me unannounced and demand my ID to 'prove who I am'. They are not scam calls and the callers cannot understand what they are doing wrong. If I'd had more strength in the last round of this stupidity I'd have done a number on them with the regulator. (I used to work in finance and was the director of a regulated financial entity, so I think I'd have a head start.)
    - Cider9986 5mo ago
      Yeah and people call crypto a scam. It mostly is, but Monero is pretty good.
    - cuteboy19 5mo ago
      it is time we have a good industry standard for this stuff
      - lostlogin 5mo ago
        I dream of a time I don’t have a bank, or not in any traditional sense. I’d been hunting for ways to use a Wisecard standoff a bank but got a bit wary of what would happen if they went bust. Government backed guarantee do not exist for Wise.

bdavbdav 5mo ago

That would take nothing to implement. Services like Truecaller already do live caller ID against databases on iOS / Android. All it would take is a sensible register of verified numbers

Abishek_Muthian 5mo ago
Several of the bank scammers had their profile verified as the bank in the Truecaller[1]. [1] https://xcancel.com/Abishek_Muthian/status/1806348022290211321 https://xcancel.com/Abishek_Muthian/status/18063480222902113...
- l23k4 5mo ago
  Truecaller can tell you about who a phone number belongs to. Truecaller cannot accurately tell you whether or not the person calling you from a phone number is actually in control of that phone number.
  - TeMPOraL 5mo ago
    Won't stop people from trying to make Truecaller, et al. prove that, though. The problem here is that the correct security posture of the bank against third-party scams also protects the customers from first-party scams. Telling people the bank will never call them for anything, and even if, they're to always hang up and call the number on the back of their card, works equally well against criminals and telemarketers.
    - l23k4 5mo ago
      I feel like this is kind-of a solved problem in the jurisdictions where banks are liable for customer losses not arising from gross negligence. If a bank calls their customers directly and trains them to get phished, the bank does not get to claim gross negligence when this happens and has to refund the customer. If a bank tells their customers that they'll never call them (and actually doesn't), they have much better chances of claiming gross negligence on the part of the customer.

4ndrewl 5mo ago

That's the number one rule though. If someone calls you claiming to be your bank, just say "I'll call you back"

smcin 5mo ago
Ask them their name/ last initial, employee ID or unique identifier for the conversation, direct phone number, job title and what location they're based at. Scammers will pretty much always refuse/argue/hang up on this (once I had one start insulting my mother in Hindi when I asked him this). Then call your bank's proper number and verify all of these details. (But in any case your bank will never call outwards to you, unless you've specifically requested that, which you almost never do.)
- DamonHD 5mo ago
  Unfortunately my UK banks (and others) DO regularly make calls to me unannounced and demand my ID to 'prove who I am'. They are not scam calls and the callers cannot understand what they are doing wrong. If I'd had more strength in the last round of this stupidity I'd have done a number on them with the regulator. (I used to work in finance and was the director of a regulated financial entity, so I think I'd have a head start.)
  - Cider9986 5mo ago
    Yeah and people call crypto a scam. It mostly is, but Monero is pretty good.
  - cuteboy19 5mo ago
    it is time we have a good industry standard for this stuff
    - lostlogin 5mo ago
      I dream of a time I don’t have a bank, or not in any traditional sense. I’d been hunting for ways to use a Wisecard standoff a bank but got a bit wary of what would happen if they went bust. Government backed guarantee do not exist for Wise.