4 ms·

I think you are reading the situation incorrectly. The US was previously the center of international collaboration for science and technology, and that took de

by hedora 5mo ago

I think you are reading the situation incorrectly. The US was previously the center of international collaboration for science and technology, and that took decades to establish. The organization has been burnt down in 12 months, but the expertise still exists. There are signs that the international community will finally start working on climate change now that the US has pulled out of the treaties. The Chinese are a decade ahead of the west when it comes to building cars. The WHO admits they screwed this outbreak handling up badly, but, by my understanding, they screwed up less than the US did in Wuhan in 2019, and they’re exhibiting the will to improve instead of shifting blame (remember all the “investigations” of the Chinese biological weapons research programs that were co-funded and co-operated by the US with federal funds?) I think we’re going to see some more dark years before a one-two punch that improves things dramatically: 1) international organizations step up to fill the vacuum the US left 2) After the 2026-2028 new Dust Bowl / Great Depression the US is heading into, voters (state and federal) in the US are going to demand progressive and populist candidates that will actually attempt to put the US back on competitive economic footing.

pjot 5mo ago
> The Chinese are a decade ahead of the west when it comes to building cars. Is this true? From years of watching Top Gear any Chinese car that was tested was laughably bad.
- m-s-y 5mo ago
  For EVs, yes, absolutely
  - somenameforme 5mo ago
    Yip, outside the US BYD cars are absolutely everywhere, pretty awesome cars, and crazy cheap - like < $15k. Apparently < $10k within China itself.
    - ShinyLeftPad 5mo ago
      The price is not the important part, it basically doesn't matter. On top of subsidies and government policy aiming to undermine manufacturing in EU and elsewhere, domestic consumption in PRC is laughably low and government policies act to transfer wealth from households to manufacturing. Locals won't buy the supply, PRC literally has to get these cars somewhere or trash them. Now if those cars are actually good, price independent, then that would be worth mentioning.
      - dirtbagskier 5mo ago
        [dead]
      - iamthemonster 5mo ago
        Do you have any references for your statements? The majority of car sales in China are EVs (which is more than the UK, the EU and the US) so locals are buying the supply right now. Reference: https://ourworldindata.org/electric-car-sales https://ourworldindata.org/electric-car-sales
        ShinyLeftPad 5mo ago
        Sure. China domestic consumption is laughably low: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_household_final_consumption_expenditure_per_capita https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_household... (lower than Kosovo, Sri Lanka, lower than world average) https://bst-europe.eu/economy-security-trade/more-and-more-why-chinese-overcapacities-are-a-significant-challenge-for-the-eu/ https://bst-europe.eu/economy-security-trade/more-and-more-w... Locals won't buy EV supply: https://asia.nikkei.com/business/automobiles/china-s-domestic-car-demand-stays-weak-but-exports-strengthen https://asia.nikkei.com/business/automobiles/china-s-domesti... https://www.bloomberg.com/features/2023-china-ev-graveyards/ https://www.bloomberg.com/features/2023-china-ev-graveyards/
        somenameforme 5mo ago
        The articles you provided were relatively light on relevant facts, but did cite two important values - 60% of all vehicles purchased in China are now EVs, and domestic sales of such are about 1.4 million per month. The data they conspicuously left out is, well how many EVs are sold elsewhere per month? In the US, ostensibly the largest consumer market in the world, the figure is 0.082 million per month. [1] Even if we scale US sales to adjust for population differences, the Chinese are picking up electric vehicles at a dramatically higher rate - and the single highest in the world. And this is almost certainly due to companies like BYD and others providing quality electric vehicles at prices below even cheap ICE vehicles. [1] - https://www.anl.gov/esia/light-duty-electric-drive-vehicles-monthly-sales-updates https://www.anl.gov/esia/light-duty-electric-drive-vehicles-...
- CamperBob2 5mo ago
  Maybe I'm dating myself, but I remember when the same was said of Japanese cars. First we laughed at them, then we fought them, then they won, then we solved the problem with protectionist tariffs.
WarmWash 5mo ago
Trump is the populist candidate elected to put the US back on competitive economic footing. His economic policy has way more overlap with Bernie's than people tend to understand. Both believe immigration lowers wages, and both believe tariffs are imperative (you have to dig back to pre-2017 talk from Bernie, he changed his website/talking points after Trump won). Edit: People struggle so hard with politics because everyone is totally blinded by there side. Here are populist things Trump has done/trying to do - remove taxes on tips - implement tariffs on foreign goods - implement strict immigration policy (note sanders wanted a pathway to citizenship, he did not want an open border, and he never addressed how he would handle millions showing up at the border) - block corporate landlords from single family home ownership - create a government funded college level education program to get free bachelor degrees. - take government ownership stake in large American companies (us steel, intel) - cap interest rates on credit cards - lower central bank interest rates - de-criminalizing drugs, reschedule marijuana - pro crypto - pro prediction markets Guys, you can hate Trump, you can accurately access he isn't intelligent or competent, criticize his brutish approach, but if you cannot recognize he is a populist, you are objectively lost-in-the-sauce.
- Groxx 5mo ago
  I sorta doubt Bernie would've been causing the insane tariff chaos that Trump is constantly doing. How it's done matters immensely.
  - WarmWash 5mo ago
    You are right, but competent populist or incompetent populist is still populist.
- throwaway5752 5mo ago
  You're finding somethere where nothing exists on the basis of semantics. Donald Trump is not a populist and he stated economic policy is simply "stated". Society just has become so trusting that someone can go about bald-faced lying about their beliefs and actions, while doing the opposite, without consequence. Donald Trump and Bernie Sanders are on polar opposite ends of ideologies. Bernie Sanders has a lifetime record of integrity, working to fairly distribute wealth, and good and transparent governance. Donald Trump has a lifetime record of bankruptcies, fraud convictions, lying about his policies for the working while governing for the richest people, using government to enrich himself, and using government to hide his misdeeds and shield himself and his business partners from accountability. Donald Trump says he is many things he is not, and simply believing the words that come out of his mouth is being gullible. I am not even a Bernie Sanders supporter.
epgui 5mo ago
> The WHO admits they screwed this outbreak handling up badly Uhhh no? How did they screw up? They were notified late, and then they did what they were supposed to do.

by hedora 5mo ago

pjot 5mo ago

> The Chinese are a decade ahead of the west when it comes to building cars. Is this true? From years of watching Top Gear any Chinese car that was tested was laughably bad.

m-s-y 5mo ago
For EVs, yes, absolutely
- somenameforme 5mo ago
  Yip, outside the US BYD cars are absolutely everywhere, pretty awesome cars, and crazy cheap - like < $15k. Apparently < $10k within China itself.
  - ShinyLeftPad 5mo ago
    The price is not the important part, it basically doesn't matter. On top of subsidies and government policy aiming to undermine manufacturing in EU and elsewhere, domestic consumption in PRC is laughably low and government policies act to transfer wealth from households to manufacturing. Locals won't buy the supply, PRC literally has to get these cars somewhere or trash them. Now if those cars are actually good, price independent, then that would be worth mentioning.
    - dirtbagskier 5mo ago
      [dead]
    - iamthemonster 5mo ago
      Do you have any references for your statements? The majority of car sales in China are EVs (which is more than the UK, the EU and the US) so locals are buying the supply right now. Reference: https://ourworldindata.org/electric-car-sales https://ourworldindata.org/electric-car-sales
      - ShinyLeftPad 5mo ago
        Sure. China domestic consumption is laughably low: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_household_final_consumption_expenditure_per_capita https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_household... (lower than Kosovo, Sri Lanka, lower than world average) https://bst-europe.eu/economy-security-trade/more-and-more-why-chinese-overcapacities-are-a-significant-challenge-for-the-eu/ https://bst-europe.eu/economy-security-trade/more-and-more-w... Locals won't buy EV supply: https://asia.nikkei.com/business/automobiles/china-s-domestic-car-demand-stays-weak-but-exports-strengthen https://asia.nikkei.com/business/automobiles/china-s-domesti... https://www.bloomberg.com/features/2023-china-ev-graveyards/ https://www.bloomberg.com/features/2023-china-ev-graveyards/
        somenameforme 5mo ago
        The articles you provided were relatively light on relevant facts, but did cite two important values - 60% of all vehicles purchased in China are now EVs, and domestic sales of such are about 1.4 million per month. The data they conspicuously left out is, well how many EVs are sold elsewhere per month? In the US, ostensibly the largest consumer market in the world, the figure is 0.082 million per month. [1] Even if we scale US sales to adjust for population differences, the Chinese are picking up electric vehicles at a dramatically higher rate - and the single highest in the world. And this is almost certainly due to companies like BYD and others providing quality electric vehicles at prices below even cheap ICE vehicles. [1] - https://www.anl.gov/esia/light-duty-electric-drive-vehicles-monthly-sales-updates https://www.anl.gov/esia/light-duty-electric-drive-vehicles-...
CamperBob2 5mo ago
Maybe I'm dating myself, but I remember when the same was said of Japanese cars. First we laughed at them, then we fought them, then they won, then we solved the problem with protectionist tariffs.

WarmWash 5mo ago

Trump is the populist candidate elected to put the US back on competitive economic footing. His economic policy has way more overlap with Bernie's than people tend to understand. Both believe immigration lowers wages, and both believe tariffs are imperative (you have to dig back to pre-2017 talk from Bernie, he changed his website/talking points after Trump won). Edit: People struggle so hard with politics because everyone is totally blinded by there side. Here are populist things Trump has done/trying to do - remove taxes on tips - implement tariffs on foreign goods - implement strict immigration policy (note sanders wanted a pathway to citizenship, he did not want an open border, and he never addressed how he would handle millions showing up at the border) - block corporate landlords from single family home ownership - create a government funded college level education program to get free bachelor degrees. - take government ownership stake in large American companies (us steel, intel) - cap interest rates on credit cards - lower central bank interest rates - de-criminalizing drugs, reschedule marijuana - pro crypto - pro prediction markets Guys, you can hate Trump, you can accurately access he isn't intelligent or competent, criticize his brutish approach, but if you cannot recognize he is a populist, you are objectively lost-in-the-sauce.

Groxx 5mo ago
I sorta doubt Bernie would've been causing the insane tariff chaos that Trump is constantly doing. How it's done matters immensely.
- WarmWash 5mo ago
  You are right, but competent populist or incompetent populist is still populist.
throwaway5752 5mo ago
You're finding somethere where nothing exists on the basis of semantics. Donald Trump is not a populist and he stated economic policy is simply "stated". Society just has become so trusting that someone can go about bald-faced lying about their beliefs and actions, while doing the opposite, without consequence. Donald Trump and Bernie Sanders are on polar opposite ends of ideologies. Bernie Sanders has a lifetime record of integrity, working to fairly distribute wealth, and good and transparent governance. Donald Trump has a lifetime record of bankruptcies, fraud convictions, lying about his policies for the working while governing for the richest people, using government to enrich himself, and using government to hide his misdeeds and shield himself and his business partners from accountability. Donald Trump says he is many things he is not, and simply believing the words that come out of his mouth is being gullible. I am not even a Bernie Sanders supporter.

epgui 5mo ago

> The WHO admits they screwed this outbreak handling up badly Uhhh no? How did they screw up? They were notified late, and then they did what they were supposed to do.