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I don't know what the US thinks it will gain by targeting civil servants. They are not the ones with the power to decide what happens, and retaliation would mea

by Eridrus 5mo ago

I don't know what the US thinks it will gain by targeting civil servants. They are not the ones with the power to decide what happens, and retaliation would mean more anti-US people selecting themselves into these projects.

jgalt212 5mo ago
Yes, civil servants should be allowed to ply their trade without scrutiny.
- icfly2 5mo ago
  Yes, Dutch civil servants must not be supervised oder subjected to scrutiny of American law makers. That is sort of self evident.
- vrganj 5mo ago
  Foreign authoritarians have no business scrutinizing our public servants.
emilfihlman 5mo ago
>They are not the ones with the power to decide what happens This is a very naive interpretation. Bureaucrats have MASSIVE amount of power and control, and in actuality decide many things and how the law is written.
- phatfish 5mo ago
  [flagged]
miohtama 5mo ago
These civil servants are effectively trying to bypass the US court. These civil servants yield considerable power what comes to the censorship, and the Whitehouse really really hates the idea that the EU can decide, not them, what is allowed. This will send a message that the US stands behind its companies and is not push around. If you want to push non-domestic enforcement, you need to be willing to stand behind the principles and be publicly ready to defend the censorship rulings you set forward.
- pjc50 5mo ago
  > Whitehouse really really hates the idea that the EU can decide, not them, what is allowed .. in the Netherlands. Where the EU and the Dutch government get to decide what happens. That's what national sovereignty means.
  - skippyboxedhero 5mo ago
    I would read the links in the article. The problem is that social media companies worked with civil servants in European countries to remove posts being made people outside Europe. This also happened in the UK where there were parts of the government that were able to make requests directly to social media companies to remove posts on their platform, regardless of where the poster was from. For obvious reasons, the linked article does not explain that fully. It is kind of weird to see the turnaround on here from people who complain about the US government being too powerful but, for some reason, are quite okay with an unelected EU bureaucrat being able to govern their internet usage. There are no principles at play here.
    - phatfish 5mo ago
      Honestly, rather a "unelected EU bureaucrat" (What does this even mean? Are we going to individually elect the entire civil service, or require elected officials to delegate nothing and personally review every decision?) than an American tech-bro governing my internet usage.
      - skippyboxedhero 5mo ago
        [flagged]
      - graemep 5mo ago
        The problem with that argument is that you do not get bureaucrats instead of tech-bros, you get both
    - vrganj 5mo ago
      Posts being distributed to people in the Netherlands that is. Magic mushroom truffles are decriminalized here in NL, you can sell them openly in shops. Doesn't mean you won't get in trouble if you send them to the US.
bob001 5mo ago
> retaliation would mean more anti-US people selecting themselves into these projects. Very few people are martyrs or want to become martyrs. Even fewer in places where life is generally fine and for a cause that isn't dire to their loved ones.
- j_maffe 5mo ago
  The curve of willingness to oppose aggressive action rises significantly before it drops off at some safety threshold. I believe US-Europe relations are still well below that threshold and the rise in level of aggression is only stirring up more resistance, not less.
  - bob001 5mo ago
    I think you highlighted something without meaning to. The core problem is that short of literally nuking Brussels I don't think the EU will ever think the threshold was crossed. Even then I'm not sure. The US has threatened to invade sovereign EU territory multiple times this week alone and we're still having this chat here. The US will keep pushing because the EU does basically nothing when it's literally threatened with invasion.
tjpnz 5mo ago
Wasn't this one of the factors leading to the EU's new payments network?
RenThraysk 5mo ago
They are not civil servants. Similarly UK OfCom is a non governmental organisation, so not civil servants either.
joquarky 5mo ago
We are currently in the process of exploiting all short term gains at the cost of long term stability.

by Eridrus 5mo ago

jgalt212 5mo ago

Yes, civil servants should be allowed to ply their trade without scrutiny.

icfly2 5mo ago
Yes, Dutch civil servants must not be supervised oder subjected to scrutiny of American law makers. That is sort of self evident.
vrganj 5mo ago
Foreign authoritarians have no business scrutinizing our public servants.

emilfihlman 5mo ago

>They are not the ones with the power to decide what happens This is a very naive interpretation. Bureaucrats have MASSIVE amount of power and control, and in actuality decide many things and how the law is written.

phatfish 5mo ago
[flagged]

miohtama 5mo ago

These civil servants are effectively trying to bypass the US court. These civil servants yield considerable power what comes to the censorship, and the Whitehouse really really hates the idea that the EU can decide, not them, what is allowed. This will send a message that the US stands behind its companies and is not push around. If you want to push non-domestic enforcement, you need to be willing to stand behind the principles and be publicly ready to defend the censorship rulings you set forward.

pjc50 5mo ago
> Whitehouse really really hates the idea that the EU can decide, not them, what is allowed .. in the Netherlands. Where the EU and the Dutch government get to decide what happens. That's what national sovereignty means.
- skippyboxedhero 5mo ago
  I would read the links in the article. The problem is that social media companies worked with civil servants in European countries to remove posts being made people outside Europe. This also happened in the UK where there were parts of the government that were able to make requests directly to social media companies to remove posts on their platform, regardless of where the poster was from. For obvious reasons, the linked article does not explain that fully. It is kind of weird to see the turnaround on here from people who complain about the US government being too powerful but, for some reason, are quite okay with an unelected EU bureaucrat being able to govern their internet usage. There are no principles at play here.
  - phatfish 5mo ago
    Honestly, rather a "unelected EU bureaucrat" (What does this even mean? Are we going to individually elect the entire civil service, or require elected officials to delegate nothing and personally review every decision?) than an American tech-bro governing my internet usage.
    - skippyboxedhero 5mo ago
      [flagged]
    - graemep 5mo ago
      The problem with that argument is that you do not get bureaucrats instead of tech-bros, you get both
  - vrganj 5mo ago
    Posts being distributed to people in the Netherlands that is. Magic mushroom truffles are decriminalized here in NL, you can sell them openly in shops. Doesn't mean you won't get in trouble if you send them to the US.

bob001 5mo ago

> retaliation would mean more anti-US people selecting themselves into these projects. Very few people are martyrs or want to become martyrs. Even fewer in places where life is generally fine and for a cause that isn't dire to their loved ones.

j_maffe 5mo ago
The curve of willingness to oppose aggressive action rises significantly before it drops off at some safety threshold. I believe US-Europe relations are still well below that threshold and the rise in level of aggression is only stirring up more resistance, not less.
- bob001 5mo ago
  I think you highlighted something without meaning to. The core problem is that short of literally nuking Brussels I don't think the EU will ever think the threshold was crossed. Even then I'm not sure. The US has threatened to invade sovereign EU territory multiple times this week alone and we're still having this chat here. The US will keep pushing because the EU does basically nothing when it's literally threatened with invasion.

tjpnz 5mo ago

Wasn't this one of the factors leading to the EU's new payments network?

RenThraysk 5mo ago

They are not civil servants. Similarly UK OfCom is a non governmental organisation, so not civil servants either.

joquarky 5mo ago

We are currently in the process of exploiting all short term gains at the cost of long term stability.