5 ms·
Zeroing out the gas tax aside, the EV tax makes _some_ sense. Gas taxes provide the revenue that help pay for road maintenance and the rest of the infrastructu
by jaredwiener 5mo ago
Zeroing out the gas tax aside, the EV tax makes _some_ sense.
Gas taxes provide the revenue that help pay for road maintenance and the rest of the infrastructure that cars use. Gas taxes made sense -- the more you drive, the more you chip in to keep the road system going.
That infrastructure still needs to exist, and will still cost money to maintain -- but if fewer people are buying gas, then the funds will dry up, even as usage stays relatively the same.
- turtlebits 5mo agoStates already charge EV registration fees for lost gas tax revenue.
- stavros 5mo agoAre EVs that widespread in the US already that you're at the stage where you need to move from incentivising EV purchases to normalising their taxation?
- bediger4000 5mo agoNo, but the oil companies don't want EVs, so Republicans don't want EVs.
- seanmcdirmid 5mo agoYes, and they have been for a few years now. I don’t know of a state that doesn’t charge higher tab fees for EVs in 2026. Maybe Alaska?
- stavros 5mo ago> Are EVs that widespread in the US already > Yes, and they have been for a few years now. Apparently they're 1.9% of all vehicles currently on the road, do you consider that to be "that widespread"? I was aiming for 51%. > I don’t know of a state that doesn’t charge higher tab fees for EVs in 2026 That doesn't mean EVs are widespread, it just means states want to favor ICEs more than EVs.
- seanmcdirmid 5mo agoI’m pretty sure the “every other car is a Tesla” phenomena is localized, but still widespread in the sense that it was 0% not too long ago.
- angoragoats 5mo agoI own an EV in Massachusetts and I’m not aware of any extra EV fees of any sort here. The only EV-specific thing the DMV even offers is an EV-only license plate, and the bi-annual registration fee for that plate is the same as a standard passenger vehicle plate ($60). There’s a map here: https://www.ncsl.org/transportation/special-registration-fees-for-electric-and-hybrid-vehicles https://www.ncsl.org/transportation/special-registration-fee... Looks like most of the northeast, plus AK, FL, AZ, NM, and NV are in the same boat.
- Steltek 5mo agoAbsolutely not. I'm in a deep blue state, in a dense urban area well served by charging infra. EV registration is like 10% here.
- BobaFloutist 5mo agoI think future proofing taxation now rather than waiting until enough people have EVs to try to resist it isn't a bad call, and can easily live in parallel with wanting to subsidize broader adoption.
- stavros 5mo agoBut then if it's that, why isn't it a general road tax per vehicle weight/class, and an extra EV subsidy on top?
- mjevans 5mo agoOffhand, the maintenance costs are something similar to a scalar that is the square of a vehicle's weight. Rather than indirectly taxing via fuel it would be more proper to do so by said maintenance scalar (weight based) and the distance driven as the inputs. Presumably paid at the time of registration renewal or at vehicle inspections. That sounds like a lot of infra change to setup, so there should be plenty of planning and cutover time.
- delichon 5mo agoThat shifts the costs onto shipping companies, a more concentrated and coordinated interest with better lobbyists than the general public.
- entropicdrifter 5mo agoSounds like it's a fairer system that would be harder to corrupt. You're right, it'll never be implemented because we're totally infested by regulatory capture.
- back7co 5mo agoThis unfortunately is flawed logic if it's intended to tax EV's as it would target semi trucks and heavy duty trucks more than EV's. https://ctr.utk.edu/electric-vehicles-damage-roads/ https://ctr.utk.edu/electric-vehicles-damage-roads/
- marssaxman 5mo agoWhy shouldn't the vehicles which do the most damage pay the most tax?
- nayuki 5mo agoIt's not flawed logic though. If, say, a mile of highway costs $1 million and it needs some expensive repaving/reconstruction every 20 years, who should bear the cost? The current model is roughly that all of society shoulders the cost roughly equally per person, regardless of how much they use that road or how much they drive in general. But clearly, some people derive more benefit from the road than others. The guy who doesn't drive derives 0 units of benefit. The gal who drives on it once a year derives 1 unit of benefit. The daily commuter gets 100 units of benefit. For the trucker moving $10M of goods a year on that road, their company gets 3000 units of benefit. So in a sense, the people who drive less are subsidizing the people who drive more - kind of like going to a fixed-price buffet dinner (people who eat more are subsidized by people who eat less). Targeting more of the cost burden on heavy goods vehicles isn't an issue in my opinion. The thing is, that highway costs $1M no matter what. The only thing we can decide as a society is how to split that cost among the people. In the current way, I think the truck is underpriced and is doing more than its fair share of damage. If we change the prices so that car drivers pay less (not zero) and the truck driver pays more, that's okay. The truck's costs get passed onto consumer, such that people who buy more goods pay more road tax - exactly as intended. Taking a step back, I think a lot of (not all) problems in society are a result of mispricing - often for political, special-interest, and/or "feel-good" reasons. When people pay less than the true cost, they over-consume. When people pay more than the true cost, they under-consume.
- onesociety2022 5mo agoMost of the states already have an EV tax. For instance, WA charges $225/yr for registering an EV. The issue is unlike gas tax, it’s not based on actual usage. And the flat fee they’re charging is way higher than the gas tax anyone driving a gas car with avg fuel consumption would pay for driving the national average of annual mileage.
- quickthrowman 5mo agoThe math doesn’t work out very well for Washington, and I’m leaving out federal gas tax in the math below. Washington has a gas tax of 55.6 cents per gallon. The tax on 405 gallons of gas in Washington is $225 Average mileage driven in US looks to be around 14,000 miles (plus or minus 500 miles), which means you’d need a car that averages 34.5 miles per gallon to pay less in gasoline tax than you’d pay in EV tax.
- seanmcdirmid 5mo agoI drive around 5000 miles a year and still pay $225/year for my EV. However, Washington is moving to a mileage based system for EVs, hybrids, and high economy cars. They are just going to go by odometer readings, which is about the only way it will work in the USA.
- tedd4u 5mo agoDo you know how they plan to get the odometer data? Thanks.
- cwmoore 5mo agoSome states require annual vehicle inspections.
- seanmcdirmid 5mo agoThe honor system I think, Washington doesn’t require annual inspections.
- jerlam 5mo agoThe EV tax was only implemented because it's easy to implement both politically and practically, not because it's the best solution. A better tax like others are suggesting based on mileage, weight, or usage (tolls) would have to apply to all road users, and require more rules and enforcement and be more difficult.
- cherry_tree 5mo agoWhy not tax tires?
- TurdF3rguson 5mo agoA disincentive to replace your tires? What could go wrong.
- dzhiurgis 5mo agoCan't save them all.
- xethos 5mo agoWe're discussing a country that bases "Safety ratings" by how well they protect the driver, and ignore every other person outside the vehicle - meaning the people least likely to be hurt here are the ones trying to cheat the tax
- cherry_tree 5mo agoYeah because today tires are free for anyone with a tread depth of less 3mm, of course. Realistically tires and brakes are already subject to sales taxes and are not subject to review at annual vehicle inspections. We probably should enforce that cars on the roads have working brakes and tires but that’s seemingly beside the point of how we pay for the maintenance of the roads.