4 ms·

I got bad chronic constipation after four years as a strict carnivore. I didn't get relief just by adding back fiber, but I did by adding fermented foods like k

I got bad chronic constipation after four years as a strict carnivore. I didn't get relief just by adding back fiber, but I did by adding fermented foods like kimchi. I wonder if ferments are a more natural way than fecal transplants to repair the gut microbiome, possibly treating autism. Studies have been non conclusive, but this story makes me think it's worth pursuing.

motoboi 5mo ago
The microbiota is passed from mother to son on birth, not totally from the environment. What we currently don’t understand is why for some people they never got them (we have techniques to transport the biota from the mother during birth for non-natural procedures) or they loose them. Even with the transplant, the microbes won’t stick around on those people (not taking about autistic people here, but people in general). Diverse food really helps, just as not eating ultraprocessed (they won’t reach the end of the intestines). Fermented and other pre or probiotics will really help too. But none of those will recover the biota in some people.
- jwrallie 5mo ago
  In some countries the number of kids born through c-section are very high, more than half the kids in Brazil are born that way for example, so definitely people can be healthy without getting it from their mothers.
  - mejutoco 5mo ago
    I read it is a practice these days to do this fecal "rub" for newborns as a way to compensate for the C-section lack of it. I do not know if it happens in Brazil. Another factor to consider.
    - giarc 5mo ago
      I've never heard of moms doing fecal rubs, but I've heard of many that do vaginal "transplants". I work in a hospital and we get questions quite a bit, moms will often take moist, sterile gauze and conduct the transplant themselves (staff can't really be involved for liability issues).
      - mejutoco 5mo ago
        I just saw it in some documentary, but do not remember where. I found these, which look like what I heard described. I believe it is the same you mention: https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC11095576/ https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC11095576/ https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-024-03449-4 https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-024-03449-4
    - neves 5mo ago
      It's not
  - 47282847 5mo ago
    > can be healthy Or can they. It’s (meant to be) an emergency procedure. Benefits: life. Downsides: plenty. Maybe most relevant in the context of this thread: “In this systematic review and meta-analysis of 61 studies comprising more than 20 million deliveries, birth by cesarean delivery was significantly associated with autism spectrum disorder and attention-deficit/hyperactivity disorder.“ Zhang, T., Sidorchuk, A., Sevilla-Cermeño, L., Vilaplana-Pérez, A., Chang, Z., Larsson, H., Mataix-Cols, D., Fernández de la Cruz, L., & D’Onofrio, B. M. (2019). Association of cesarean delivery with risk of neurodevelopmental and psychiatric disorders in the offspring: A systematic review and meta-analysis. JAMA Network Open, 2(8), e1910236. https://doi.org/10.1001/jamanetworkopen.2019.10236 https://doi.org/10.1001/jamanetworkopen.2019.10236 A selection of some more: Keag, O. E., Norman, J. E., & Stock, S. J. (2018). Long-term risks and benefits associated with cesarean delivery for mother, baby, and subsequent pregnancies: Systematic review and meta-analysis. PLOS Medicine, 15(1), e1002494. https://doi.org/10.1371/journal.pmed.1002494 https://doi.org/10.1371/journal.pmed.1002494 De Mucio, B., Serruya, S., Alemán, A., Castellano, G., & Sosa, C. G. (2019). A systematic review and meta-analysis of cesarean delivery and other uterine surgery as risk factors for placenta accreta. International Journal of Gynecology & Obstetrics, 147(3), 281–291. https://doi.org/10.1002/ijgo.12948 https://doi.org/10.1002/ijgo.12948 Sandall, J., Tribe, R. M., Avery, L., Mola, G., Visser, G. H. A., Homer, C. S. E., Gibbons, D., Kelly, N. M., Kennedy, H. P., Kidanto, H., Taylor, P., & Temmerman, M. (2018). Short-term and long-term effects of caesarean section on the health of women and children. The Lancet, 392(10155), 1349–1357. https://doi.org/10.1016/S0140-6736(18)31930-5 https://doi.org/10.1016/S0140-6736(18)31930-5 Li, H.-T., Zhou, Y.-B., & Liu, J.-M. (2013). The impact of cesarean section on offspring overweight and obesity: A systematic review and meta-analysis. International Journal of Obesity, 37(7), 893–899. https://doi.org/10.1038/ijo.2012.195 https://doi.org/10.1038/ijo.2012.195 S., Fleming, J., Bromley, A., Shields, M. D., & Cardwell, C. R. (2008). A meta-analysis of the association between Caesarean section and childhood asthma. Clinical & Experimental Allergy, 38(4), 629–633. https://doi.org/10.1111/j.1365-2222.2007.02780.x https://doi.org/10.1111/j.1365-2222.2007.02780.x Mascarello, K. C., Horta, B. L., & Silveira, M. F. (2017). Maternal complications and cesarean section without indication: Systematic review and meta-analysis. Revista de Saúde Pública, 51, 105. https://doi.org/10.11606/S1518-8787.2017051000389 https://doi.org/10.11606/S1518-8787.2017051000389
    - 5mo ago
fontain 5mo ago
Why did you follow a strict carnivore diet? Health? Accident? Aside from the constipation did it benefit your health?
- delichon 5mo ago
  Obesity and diabetes. It solved about half of the obesity and all of the diabetes.
  - HiPhish 5mo ago
    > and all of the diabetes. Can you elaborate please? Type 1 or type 2? If type 1, does that mean your body can now produce insulin on its own? If type 2, does that mean the insulin sensitivity of your cells is now back to normal levels and you could eat sugary food without issues?
    - toast0 5mo ago
      Not the OP, but I would guess more likely type 2, and most likely solved while on the diet; not necessarily forever (although maybe when they went away from strict carnivore they didn't return to a mainstream diet and may still be effectively moderating their blood sugar through diet)
- xeromal 5mo ago
  Dieting is calories in and calories out, but protein takes more calories to digest than fat or carbs and is often very filling so it's a good way to help someone diet who struggles with feeling hungry. You feel satiated and you're reducing your caloric intake. You can only eat so much beef jerky compared to eating a whole bag of chips before getting sick. It's helpful for people who are binge eaters.
dennis_jeeves2 5mo ago
>I got bad chronic constipation after four years as a strict carnivore. 2 questions: 1) Did your constipation start right after you did strict carnivore? Or was it after 4 years? 2) List all foods that you ate on strict carnivore. (Include salt, water etc. I presume it won't be a long list)
- idiotsecant 5mo ago
  Just all foods including salt and water consumed over a 4 year time period with some unknown offset from present, sure seems like a reasonable amount of effort in response to some random guys HN post.
  - deleted 5mo ago
    [deleted]
- delichon 5mo ago
  1) I had constipation on a very high fiber diet before starting carnivore. That was fixed in literally one day. It was the most dramatic change. Then it gradually came back after about 3.5 years. 2) beef, butter, chicken, pork, lamb, eggs, bacon, for > 95%. I do indulge in some processed meats with seasonings. Salt is the only seasoning I add, so I've become a salt snob and get the premium stuff. After that unspicy diet, full strength kimchi is an experience.
  - dennis_jeeves2 5mo ago
    Thanks. Regarding full strength kimchi - did you make it yourself or did you buy it? If you bought it, what brand?
shermantanktop 5mo ago
The lower intestinal region is guarded by a vat of acid. Not sure how much of those probiotic pills get through.
- TFNA 5mo ago
  Eating yoghurt and fresh fruit to replenish gut bacteria has long been common medical advice after severe-diarrhea illnesses. Something does indeed get through.
- PlattypusRex 5mo ago
  beneficial bacteria are tolerant of acidic environments (yogurt/pickles/kimchi), and while a bulk of them die in the stomach some do get through. we know this because eating probiotic rich foods regularly does result in a measurable difference in the populations of those specific bacteria in the gut (as long as you continue consuming them).

motoboi 5mo ago

The microbiota is passed from mother to son on birth, not totally from the environment. What we currently don’t understand is why for some people they never got them (we have techniques to transport the biota from the mother during birth for non-natural procedures) or they loose them. Even with the transplant, the microbes won’t stick around on those people (not taking about autistic people here, but people in general). Diverse food really helps, just as not eating ultraprocessed (they won’t reach the end of the intestines). Fermented and other pre or probiotics will really help too. But none of those will recover the biota in some people.

jwrallie 5mo ago
In some countries the number of kids born through c-section are very high, more than half the kids in Brazil are born that way for example, so definitely people can be healthy without getting it from their mothers.
- mejutoco 5mo ago
  I read it is a practice these days to do this fecal "rub" for newborns as a way to compensate for the C-section lack of it. I do not know if it happens in Brazil. Another factor to consider.
  - giarc 5mo ago
    I've never heard of moms doing fecal rubs, but I've heard of many that do vaginal "transplants". I work in a hospital and we get questions quite a bit, moms will often take moist, sterile gauze and conduct the transplant themselves (staff can't really be involved for liability issues).
    - mejutoco 5mo ago
      I just saw it in some documentary, but do not remember where. I found these, which look like what I heard described. I believe it is the same you mention: https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC11095576/ https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC11095576/ https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-024-03449-4 https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-024-03449-4
  - neves 5mo ago
    It's not
- 47282847 5mo ago
  > can be healthy Or can they. It’s (meant to be) an emergency procedure. Benefits: life. Downsides: plenty. Maybe most relevant in the context of this thread: “In this systematic review and meta-analysis of 61 studies comprising more than 20 million deliveries, birth by cesarean delivery was significantly associated with autism spectrum disorder and attention-deficit/hyperactivity disorder.“ Zhang, T., Sidorchuk, A., Sevilla-Cermeño, L., Vilaplana-Pérez, A., Chang, Z., Larsson, H., Mataix-Cols, D., Fernández de la Cruz, L., & D’Onofrio, B. M. (2019). Association of cesarean delivery with risk of neurodevelopmental and psychiatric disorders in the offspring: A systematic review and meta-analysis. JAMA Network Open, 2(8), e1910236. https://doi.org/10.1001/jamanetworkopen.2019.10236 https://doi.org/10.1001/jamanetworkopen.2019.10236 A selection of some more: Keag, O. E., Norman, J. E., & Stock, S. J. (2018). Long-term risks and benefits associated with cesarean delivery for mother, baby, and subsequent pregnancies: Systematic review and meta-analysis. PLOS Medicine, 15(1), e1002494. https://doi.org/10.1371/journal.pmed.1002494 https://doi.org/10.1371/journal.pmed.1002494 De Mucio, B., Serruya, S., Alemán, A., Castellano, G., & Sosa, C. G. (2019). A systematic review and meta-analysis of cesarean delivery and other uterine surgery as risk factors for placenta accreta. International Journal of Gynecology & Obstetrics, 147(3), 281–291. https://doi.org/10.1002/ijgo.12948 https://doi.org/10.1002/ijgo.12948 Sandall, J., Tribe, R. M., Avery, L., Mola, G., Visser, G. H. A., Homer, C. S. E., Gibbons, D., Kelly, N. M., Kennedy, H. P., Kidanto, H., Taylor, P., & Temmerman, M. (2018). Short-term and long-term effects of caesarean section on the health of women and children. The Lancet, 392(10155), 1349–1357. https://doi.org/10.1016/S0140-6736(18)31930-5 https://doi.org/10.1016/S0140-6736(18)31930-5 Li, H.-T., Zhou, Y.-B., & Liu, J.-M. (2013). The impact of cesarean section on offspring overweight and obesity: A systematic review and meta-analysis. International Journal of Obesity, 37(7), 893–899. https://doi.org/10.1038/ijo.2012.195 https://doi.org/10.1038/ijo.2012.195 S., Fleming, J., Bromley, A., Shields, M. D., & Cardwell, C. R. (2008). A meta-analysis of the association between Caesarean section and childhood asthma. Clinical & Experimental Allergy, 38(4), 629–633. https://doi.org/10.1111/j.1365-2222.2007.02780.x https://doi.org/10.1111/j.1365-2222.2007.02780.x Mascarello, K. C., Horta, B. L., & Silveira, M. F. (2017). Maternal complications and cesarean section without indication: Systematic review and meta-analysis. Revista de Saúde Pública, 51, 105. https://doi.org/10.11606/S1518-8787.2017051000389 https://doi.org/10.11606/S1518-8787.2017051000389
  - 5mo ago

fontain 5mo ago

Why did you follow a strict carnivore diet? Health? Accident? Aside from the constipation did it benefit your health?

delichon 5mo ago
Obesity and diabetes. It solved about half of the obesity and all of the diabetes.
- HiPhish 5mo ago
  > and all of the diabetes. Can you elaborate please? Type 1 or type 2? If type 1, does that mean your body can now produce insulin on its own? If type 2, does that mean the insulin sensitivity of your cells is now back to normal levels and you could eat sugary food without issues?
  - toast0 5mo ago
    Not the OP, but I would guess more likely type 2, and most likely solved while on the diet; not necessarily forever (although maybe when they went away from strict carnivore they didn't return to a mainstream diet and may still be effectively moderating their blood sugar through diet)
xeromal 5mo ago
Dieting is calories in and calories out, but protein takes more calories to digest than fat or carbs and is often very filling so it's a good way to help someone diet who struggles with feeling hungry. You feel satiated and you're reducing your caloric intake. You can only eat so much beef jerky compared to eating a whole bag of chips before getting sick. It's helpful for people who are binge eaters.

dennis_jeeves2 5mo ago

>I got bad chronic constipation after four years as a strict carnivore. 2 questions: 1) Did your constipation start right after you did strict carnivore? Or was it after 4 years? 2) List all foods that you ate on strict carnivore. (Include salt, water etc. I presume it won't be a long list)

idiotsecant 5mo ago
Just all foods including salt and water consumed over a 4 year time period with some unknown offset from present, sure seems like a reasonable amount of effort in response to some random guys HN post.
- deleted 5mo ago
  [deleted]
delichon 5mo ago
1) I had constipation on a very high fiber diet before starting carnivore. That was fixed in literally one day. It was the most dramatic change. Then it gradually came back after about 3.5 years. 2) beef, butter, chicken, pork, lamb, eggs, bacon, for > 95%. I do indulge in some processed meats with seasonings. Salt is the only seasoning I add, so I've become a salt snob and get the premium stuff. After that unspicy diet, full strength kimchi is an experience.
- dennis_jeeves2 5mo ago
  Thanks. Regarding full strength kimchi - did you make it yourself or did you buy it? If you bought it, what brand?

shermantanktop 5mo ago

The lower intestinal region is guarded by a vat of acid. Not sure how much of those probiotic pills get through.

TFNA 5mo ago
Eating yoghurt and fresh fruit to replenish gut bacteria has long been common medical advice after severe-diarrhea illnesses. Something does indeed get through.
PlattypusRex 5mo ago
beneficial bacteria are tolerant of acidic environments (yogurt/pickles/kimchi), and while a bulk of them die in the stomach some do get through. we know this because eating probiotic rich foods regularly does result in a measurable difference in the populations of those specific bacteria in the gut (as long as you continue consuming them).