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Why wouldn't I use AI to shop for clothes? I'm not much into fashion, but I could see using AI to help me search for a winter parka that meets my needs, for exa

Why wouldn't I use AI to shop for clothes? I'm not much into fashion, but I could see using AI to help me search for a winter parka that meets my needs, for example. And I did use AI recently when shopping for a car. After doing a bunch of research on my own, I decided why not try feeding my criteria into ChatGPT and see what it recommends. And it did actually recommend a couple of models that I had not previously considered, including one that I ended up considering very seriously. I also pointed it towards some used listings and asked questions like "does this listing have ventilated rear seats" - and it was able to respond that it likely doesn't, and told me where to look for the controls in photos to verify for certain. I probably could have figured out on my own with a bit of digging, or else contact the seller, but this was a pretty quick and easy way to get the information I was looking for. Is that gross? I didn't look too closely at the Googlebook, so I don't know why I would use that instead of just an app on my MacBook. But at some point when competent models can be run on comodity hardware I think hardware and OS-level support for AI will definitely become a selling point for me. We're just not quite there yet.

eukara 5mo ago
Given how Search-Engine-Optimisation (SEO) has been gamed, what will make you think that somehow this NEW system, that's really prone to prompt hacking & already promotes sponsors' products over alternatives, won't be?
- freetime2 5mo ago
  For me it doesn't need to be a perfect, bias-free information source (no such thing exists). It doesn't need to solve all my problems. It just has to be useful in certain contexts, and I will use it while also trying to be aware of its limitations and conducting my own "sanity checks" to make sure the information can be trusted.
- Max-Limelihood 5mo ago
  Of course it will be gamed. Everything can be gamed. Like you said, search engines are also gamed; that doesn't mean I refuse to use search engines.
operatingthetan 5mo ago
Nobody is picking their laptop for the best AI integration. You can do those things just as well on every other platform. In fact, additional AI integration is universally a turnoff to most normal people.
- seanmcdirmid 5mo ago
  Uhm, the only reason I bought a refurbished laptop last year (an M3 Max with more RAM than I've ever had before) was to run models locally. If Google was launching a new laptop that was meant to run models locally I would be really excited.
  - operatingthetan 5mo ago
    By "AI integration" we are talking about UI, not running local models. See the link this thread is about.
  - jdiff 5mo ago
    The key phrase from GP is "most normal people." You are, with love, a particular kind of freak. As are we all.
    - seanmcdirmid 5mo ago
      “Nobody” is pretty universal, yet there are plenty of people now buying new computers specifically for their local AI capabilities. It’s not all Mac minis, some of us prefer laptops.
- boredpeter 5mo ago
  [dead]
Kadecgos 5mo ago
My terse answer to, 'Why not use AI to shop for [X]' is that if you are letting AI do the shopping for you at any level, you aren't actually distinguishing products by features or quality or it's ability to solve a problem. You are being fed junk that is likely paid to be moved to the top of the list. It's probably a nice feeling when you can put in a list of soft requirements to ChatGPT et al and get a list of things it recommends, but I would suggest you are a fool if you think those listings aren't bought and paid for. In an era where the gap between a 'good product' and a 'bad product' is growing ever larger and the price is not an indicator of anything, the onus to actually become knowledgeable re: "How to identify products worth buying" is becoming greater and greater. If you are using AI to do the shopping for you, not only are you not building that muscle, you are actively weakening it as a chatbot convincingly recommends something to you based on unverifiable platitudes about 'quality' and 'value' - a recommendation that was, again, bought and paid for. So yeah, that's gross and I would argue pretty strongly that it's just as brain rot adjacent as something like Tiktok. Like Tiktok though, I expect it will see at least some level of popular use, and also like Tiktok, I think it'll end up making the population dumber on average.
- tantalor 5mo ago
  > being fed junk As if the products you find in mass market brick'n'mortar stores are any different.
  - freetime2 5mo ago
    Or the information I would be fed if I walked into a car dealership and asked a dealer. Unbiased information has never been a thing, and while AI introduces a set of tools along with a new set of risks, it doesn't really change the fundamental problem of needing to vet your information against trusted sources.
  - Kadecgos 5mo ago
    They on average, are. That's kind of my point. Yes, if you engage with the 'designed marketing channels' for products, you will end up with junk. If you want to have stuff that isn't junk, you need to do some leg work. A chatbot will not do that for you.
port11 5mo ago
I guess the pragmatic answer is that you don’t need AI for that. You need good filters. I don’t like Zalando one bit, but I’ll grant them that it’s easy to find the right clothes on their website because they have very good filters. LLMs don’t ‘know’ if a pair of jeans is a tapered slim fit with a gusseted crotch, at least not by default. But if the brand uploaded them as such, the filters will find them. That’s just a quick take. I’ve tried to shop with LLMs and the results are mediocre at best. Of course search, filtering, and content tagging could always be improved, instead of “just slap AI on it”.
- freetime2 5mo ago
  It's worth pointing out that in the Googlebook video she's not asking Gemini to shop for her. She starts with a picture of herself, and asks Gemini to combine it with vintage clothing photos from a website she was browsing, to help visualize what she would look like in those clothes. This is more than just search + filtering. I've done similar things when trying to visualize home improvements, and find that it really is a useful way to help validate my ideas. So far a lot of the negative responses I've gotten have been along the lines of "only a fool would let AI do your thinking for you". But I find that it's a useful tool sharpening my thinking. Brainstorming, overcoming my own personal biases and gaps in my knowledge, idea validation, etc. Like "rubber ducking" [1], but the duck actually responds with some pretty insightful advice with surprising frequency. Do I "need" AI for shopping? No, of course not. Can it reduce friction and lead to more informed buying decisions in certain cases? In my experience, yes. Of course I've seen plenty of useless "just slap AI on it" jobs, too. Netflix put out an AI chatbot that I found particularly egregious, for example (I think maybe they've taken it down since). I didn't find Amazon's "Rufus" to be very trustworthy, either. And I know I'm coming across as pro-AI here, but in other matters I have plenty of serious concerns about AI. I'm just hoping to have a more nuanced conversation than "shopping with AI? Gross!". Or "only a fool would use a product built by greedy corporations!" [1] https://theconversation.com/stuck-on-a-problem-talking-to-a-rubber-duck-might-unlock-the-solution-261675 https://theconversation.com/stuck-on-a-problem-talking-to-a-...
  - port11 5mo ago

eukara 5mo ago

Given how Search-Engine-Optimisation (SEO) has been gamed, what will make you think that somehow this NEW system, that's really prone to prompt hacking & already promotes sponsors' products over alternatives, won't be?

freetime2 5mo ago
For me it doesn't need to be a perfect, bias-free information source (no such thing exists). It doesn't need to solve all my problems. It just has to be useful in certain contexts, and I will use it while also trying to be aware of its limitations and conducting my own "sanity checks" to make sure the information can be trusted.
Max-Limelihood 5mo ago
Of course it will be gamed. Everything can be gamed. Like you said, search engines are also gamed; that doesn't mean I refuse to use search engines.

operatingthetan 5mo ago

Nobody is picking their laptop for the best AI integration. You can do those things just as well on every other platform. In fact, additional AI integration is universally a turnoff to most normal people.

seanmcdirmid 5mo ago
Uhm, the only reason I bought a refurbished laptop last year (an M3 Max with more RAM than I've ever had before) was to run models locally. If Google was launching a new laptop that was meant to run models locally I would be really excited.
- operatingthetan 5mo ago
  By "AI integration" we are talking about UI, not running local models. See the link this thread is about.
- jdiff 5mo ago
  The key phrase from GP is "most normal people." You are, with love, a particular kind of freak. As are we all.
  - seanmcdirmid 5mo ago
    “Nobody” is pretty universal, yet there are plenty of people now buying new computers specifically for their local AI capabilities. It’s not all Mac minis, some of us prefer laptops.
boredpeter 5mo ago
[dead]

Kadecgos 5mo ago

My terse answer to, 'Why not use AI to shop for [X]' is that if you are letting AI do the shopping for you at any level, you aren't actually distinguishing products by features or quality or it's ability to solve a problem. You are being fed junk that is likely paid to be moved to the top of the list. It's probably a nice feeling when you can put in a list of soft requirements to ChatGPT et al and get a list of things it recommends, but I would suggest you are a fool if you think those listings aren't bought and paid for. In an era where the gap between a 'good product' and a 'bad product' is growing ever larger and the price is not an indicator of anything, the onus to actually become knowledgeable re: "How to identify products worth buying" is becoming greater and greater. If you are using AI to do the shopping for you, not only are you not building that muscle, you are actively weakening it as a chatbot convincingly recommends something to you based on unverifiable platitudes about 'quality' and 'value' - a recommendation that was, again, bought and paid for. So yeah, that's gross and I would argue pretty strongly that it's just as brain rot adjacent as something like Tiktok. Like Tiktok though, I expect it will see at least some level of popular use, and also like Tiktok, I think it'll end up making the population dumber on average.

tantalor 5mo ago
> being fed junk As if the products you find in mass market brick'n'mortar stores are any different.
- freetime2 5mo ago
  Or the information I would be fed if I walked into a car dealership and asked a dealer. Unbiased information has never been a thing, and while AI introduces a set of tools along with a new set of risks, it doesn't really change the fundamental problem of needing to vet your information against trusted sources.
- Kadecgos 5mo ago
  They on average, are. That's kind of my point. Yes, if you engage with the 'designed marketing channels' for products, you will end up with junk. If you want to have stuff that isn't junk, you need to do some leg work. A chatbot will not do that for you.

port11 5mo ago

I guess the pragmatic answer is that you don’t need AI for that. You need good filters. I don’t like Zalando one bit, but I’ll grant them that it’s easy to find the right clothes on their website because they have very good filters. LLMs don’t ‘know’ if a pair of jeans is a tapered slim fit with a gusseted crotch, at least not by default. But if the brand uploaded them as such, the filters will find them. That’s just a quick take. I’ve tried to shop with LLMs and the results are mediocre at best. Of course search, filtering, and content tagging could always be improved, instead of “just slap AI on it”.

freetime2 5mo ago
It's worth pointing out that in the Googlebook video she's not asking Gemini to shop for her. She starts with a picture of herself, and asks Gemini to combine it with vintage clothing photos from a website she was browsing, to help visualize what she would look like in those clothes. This is more than just search + filtering. I've done similar things when trying to visualize home improvements, and find that it really is a useful way to help validate my ideas. So far a lot of the negative responses I've gotten have been along the lines of "only a fool would let AI do your thinking for you". But I find that it's a useful tool sharpening my thinking. Brainstorming, overcoming my own personal biases and gaps in my knowledge, idea validation, etc. Like "rubber ducking" [1], but the duck actually responds with some pretty insightful advice with surprising frequency. Do I "need" AI for shopping? No, of course not. Can it reduce friction and lead to more informed buying decisions in certain cases? In my experience, yes. Of course I've seen plenty of useless "just slap AI on it" jobs, too. Netflix put out an AI chatbot that I found particularly egregious, for example (I think maybe they've taken it down since). I didn't find Amazon's "Rufus" to be very trustworthy, either. And I know I'm coming across as pro-AI here, but in other matters I have plenty of serious concerns about AI. I'm just hoping to have a more nuanced conversation than "shopping with AI? Gross!". Or "only a fool would use a product built by greedy corporations!" [1] https://theconversation.com/stuck-on-a-problem-talking-to-a-rubber-duck-might-unlock-the-solution-261675 https://theconversation.com/stuck-on-a-problem-talking-to-a-...
- port11 5mo ago