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I recovered ~$250,000 under beverly song act (California lemon law). (My principal and interest back for multiple vehicles) I repeatedly complained it was acti

I recovered ~$250,000 under beverly song act (California lemon law). (My principal and interest back for multiple vehicles) I repeatedly complained it was activating “emergency lane departure” while driving manually, even after disabling the setting. This had the effect of the vehicles swerving towards cross walks or walls. Clearly a software issue but they played dumb and forced me to book service visits and refused to provide loaners. Each time they returned the vehicle(s) with a short resolution of “expected characteristic”. I read my purchase agreement, emailed them, and simply stated they are obliged to buy back my fleet given its a hazard to public safety. They obliged without discussion. There were also other persistent issues with the vehicle beyond the software but i suspect the software put them into a double bind where if they “fix” it they create more liability via accidental disengagements.

SilverElfin 5mo ago
I’ve had this type of issue on multiple European car brands. Software issues with driver assistance features, which they keep ignoring. Things like sudden unexplained braking, not showing down due to cars stopped ahead, swerving randomly... I accepted it because getting them to cover anything, even physical things, even under warranty. They just come up with self serving guidelines and excuses. Glad you had success. Did it require lawyers?
- lokar 5mo ago
  I (also in CA) lemon returned a Mercedes EV. Same kind of thing, they could not fix repeated software issues w/ the collision avoidance features. I called them up, gave a short explanation, and they sent me to their vendor who handles the returns, no issues. Full price (including tax etc) back. AIUI, they know not to fight, since in CA when they loose, they pay your legal fees.
  - SilverElfin 5mo ago
    I just got repeated run arounds from the euro brands - like they can’t reproduce it or that it was determined to be a non issue. The dealers would just eventually give me the phone number for the corporate line if I wanted to push more. But it wasn’t even some kind of support phone number - literally just a generic corporate number. So basically they were telling me to go away. Oh and top of that they charged me for diagnostic time.
    - lokar 5mo ago
      That sucks. For me, it was clear the dealer did not really care, and was happy to call each visit a valid warranty repair attempt (and later agree it was not fixed). Once it had been in N times, the game was over.
  - njovin 5mo ago
    I'm having a similar issue with Volvo. It occasionally sees a gate track on the ground as a 'hazard' and will hard-brake when slowly backing over it. It's inconsistent but happens regularly.
    - lobf 5mo ago
      On the one hand, my 50 year old car (1976 BMW 2002) has very few safety measures, but on the other hand there’s no bullshit like this…
      - alamortsubite 5mo ago
        Your car also has a safety feature that the others upstream lack: a curb weight of only 2400 lbs. Which is already an order of magnitude more mass than necessary to move a few human beings around. Also, by having some skin in the game, my guess is you're a lot more likely to drive it responsibly, which is probably the most effective safety feature of all.
      - jimmydddd 5mo ago
        Back in the early 1980's, a high school friend from a semi-wealthy family received a money from his parents to buy his first car to drive to school. They were expecting him to buy a new Honda or Toyota, but he proudly showed up at home with an old used 2002. They were not happy, but we had a great time with that car. :-)
- walrus01 5mo ago
  At this point I want basically no driver assistance features except maybe an automatic cruise control speed adjustment to vehicle directly in the lane ahead based on forward facing radar data. Many of them seem to be much more troublesome or buggy than they're worth.
  - dmix 5mo ago
    I've heard new Toyota's sensors cause it to constantly beep and you can't turn it off. Probably due to a regulation somewhere.
    - petre 5mo ago
      Yes, it does beep a lot but you can adjust the volume to low. Source: we had a 2025 replacement Yaris. It's annoying but the older ones' seat belt alarm is even more annoying, although I use the seatbelt at all times. It also turned me off, not wanting to get a new post-2025 Toyota. Now they all have mandatory alcohol testers and speed alarms. Use hand sanitizer and you have to Uber to work. No thanx. I'll keep my old car.
      - boredishBoi 5mo ago
        Sorry new Toyotas have mandatory alcohol testers? Which locale are you in? I’ve heard of mandatory breathalysers for work vehicles or DUI drivers but all new cars?
        petre 5mo ago
        Not only Toyotas, all new cars sold in the EU need to have an interface for alcohol testers. They already have beepers and other detterents for exceeding speed limits since june 2025. https://www.ietl.net/news-details/no-more-drunk-driving.html https://www.ietl.net/news-details/no-more-drunk-driving.html
  - fc417fc802 5mo ago
    I don't have a "modern" vehicle but automated following distance is the only thing I feel like I'm missing out on. Everything else feels like I'm dodging bullets. Unfortunately not upgrading means missing out on improvements to physical safety in the event of a crash.
- boc 5mo ago
  One reason I love my mid-00s Lexus SUV. All the luxury features you want, but clean instrument cluster with no driving assistance tech to break or get in the way. Great visual clarity on the road, 300K miles on original drivetrain without issues, and a beast in the snow/inclement weather. Only downside is mileage, but I legit wouldn't trade it for a new car.
  - justinclift 5mo ago
    Which model is it? Didn't they make quite a few? :)
    - boc 5mo ago
      The GX and LX models specifically! Built off the LC platform.

SilverElfin 5mo ago

I’ve had this type of issue on multiple European car brands. Software issues with driver assistance features, which they keep ignoring. Things like sudden unexplained braking, not showing down due to cars stopped ahead, swerving randomly... I accepted it because getting them to cover anything, even physical things, even under warranty. They just come up with self serving guidelines and excuses. Glad you had success. Did it require lawyers?

lokar 5mo ago
I (also in CA) lemon returned a Mercedes EV. Same kind of thing, they could not fix repeated software issues w/ the collision avoidance features. I called them up, gave a short explanation, and they sent me to their vendor who handles the returns, no issues. Full price (including tax etc) back. AIUI, they know not to fight, since in CA when they loose, they pay your legal fees.
- SilverElfin 5mo ago
  I just got repeated run arounds from the euro brands - like they can’t reproduce it or that it was determined to be a non issue. The dealers would just eventually give me the phone number for the corporate line if I wanted to push more. But it wasn’t even some kind of support phone number - literally just a generic corporate number. So basically they were telling me to go away. Oh and top of that they charged me for diagnostic time.
  - lokar 5mo ago
    That sucks. For me, it was clear the dealer did not really care, and was happy to call each visit a valid warranty repair attempt (and later agree it was not fixed). Once it had been in N times, the game was over.
- njovin 5mo ago
  I'm having a similar issue with Volvo. It occasionally sees a gate track on the ground as a 'hazard' and will hard-brake when slowly backing over it. It's inconsistent but happens regularly.
  - lobf 5mo ago
    On the one hand, my 50 year old car (1976 BMW 2002) has very few safety measures, but on the other hand there’s no bullshit like this…
    - alamortsubite 5mo ago
      Your car also has a safety feature that the others upstream lack: a curb weight of only 2400 lbs. Which is already an order of magnitude more mass than necessary to move a few human beings around. Also, by having some skin in the game, my guess is you're a lot more likely to drive it responsibly, which is probably the most effective safety feature of all.
    - jimmydddd 5mo ago
      Back in the early 1980's, a high school friend from a semi-wealthy family received a money from his parents to buy his first car to drive to school. They were expecting him to buy a new Honda or Toyota, but he proudly showed up at home with an old used 2002. They were not happy, but we had a great time with that car. :-)
walrus01 5mo ago
At this point I want basically no driver assistance features except maybe an automatic cruise control speed adjustment to vehicle directly in the lane ahead based on forward facing radar data. Many of them seem to be much more troublesome or buggy than they're worth.
- dmix 5mo ago
  I've heard new Toyota's sensors cause it to constantly beep and you can't turn it off. Probably due to a regulation somewhere.
  - petre 5mo ago
    Yes, it does beep a lot but you can adjust the volume to low. Source: we had a 2025 replacement Yaris. It's annoying but the older ones' seat belt alarm is even more annoying, although I use the seatbelt at all times. It also turned me off, not wanting to get a new post-2025 Toyota. Now they all have mandatory alcohol testers and speed alarms. Use hand sanitizer and you have to Uber to work. No thanx. I'll keep my old car.
    - boredishBoi 5mo ago
      Sorry new Toyotas have mandatory alcohol testers? Which locale are you in? I’ve heard of mandatory breathalysers for work vehicles or DUI drivers but all new cars?
      - petre 5mo ago
        Not only Toyotas, all new cars sold in the EU need to have an interface for alcohol testers. They already have beepers and other detterents for exceeding speed limits since june 2025. https://www.ietl.net/news-details/no-more-drunk-driving.html https://www.ietl.net/news-details/no-more-drunk-driving.html
- fc417fc802 5mo ago
  I don't have a "modern" vehicle but automated following distance is the only thing I feel like I'm missing out on. Everything else feels like I'm dodging bullets. Unfortunately not upgrading means missing out on improvements to physical safety in the event of a crash.
boc 5mo ago
One reason I love my mid-00s Lexus SUV. All the luxury features you want, but clean instrument cluster with no driving assistance tech to break or get in the way. Great visual clarity on the road, 300K miles on original drivetrain without issues, and a beast in the snow/inclement weather. Only downside is mileage, but I legit wouldn't trade it for a new car.
- justinclift 5mo ago
  Which model is it? Didn't they make quite a few? :)
  - boc 5mo ago
    The GX and LX models specifically! Built off the LC platform.