6 ms·

HardenedBSD Is Now Officially on Radicle

160 points by lftherios 5mo ago

chungy 5mo ago
Is Radicle an alternative to Fossil?
- balou23 5mo ago
  It seems to have similar ideas, but two big differences seem to be that 1. it's based on git 2. more focus on a truly decentralized p2p architecture
ramon156 5mo ago
In this scenario, how does p2p compare to ATProto? The downside of both is that you still need high available servers
- fc417fc802 5mo ago
  I don't think so? In the case of p2p (including radicle) you can run multiple not-so-reliable nodes. Of course that won't work for serving up a web frontend but that's distinct from the git repo itself.
- Skinney 5mo ago
  Radicle is local-first, so you can create issues and patches (pull requests) even when offline. It will sync when you're back online. Also, my understanding is that ATProto is relatively centralized in practice, wheras in radicle every node is sort of equal.
jgtrosh 5mo ago
I was not aware of Radicle; it's a truly peer-to-peer Git forge which aims to guarantee commits are signed by current maintainers (among, I suppose, other goals). The article mentions an us and a you, but I feel like it would have been an useful occasion to explain why move (from where?) and why Radicle. Maybe this was already discussed elsewhere? I suppose similar discussions regarding GitHub are happening today and could explain why this was posted to HN.
- dmos62 5mo ago
  Radicle is pretty cool. > Radicle’s Collaborative Objects (COBs) provide Radicle’s social primitive. This enables features such as issues, discussions and code review to be implemented as Git objects. Developers can extend Radicle’s capabilities to build any kind of collaboration flow they see fit.
  - donatj 5mo ago
    I know I'm not supposed to make jokes, this is not reddit, but you might even say it's pretty radical.
    - dmos62 5mo ago
      I think apologetic jokes are very on point for HN, so no worries!
  - bombcar 5mo ago
    I was just wondering in another thread how much you could do storing things in git itself.
- lorenzleutgeb 5mo ago
  For the reason of hbsd moving, see https://bsd.network/@HardenedBSD/116437657126172879 https://bsd.network/@HardenedBSD/116437657126172879
  - hobofan 5mo ago
    So instead of their self-hosted Gitlab instance being hammered, now their self-hosted Radicle instance will be hammered (and if they are lucky some of the other seeders will tank some of the load)? I'm not sure that this will actually solve the problem. This seems more like a facade for a move they wanted to do anyways.
    - sunshine-o 5mo ago
      Yes they have been looking into decentralized technologies like mesh networking, reticulum, etc. for a while now. My guess is the model is let the Github mirror repo be hit by bots and just do the dev work on the Radicle node. - [0] https://hardenedbsd.org/article/shawn-webb/2024-09-23/hardenedbsd-and-protectli-collaborates-censorship-and-surveillance https://hardenedbsd.org/article/shawn-webb/2024-09-23/harden...
csomar 5mo ago
This is what I am getting > Could not connect to rad.hardenedbsd.org The node may be offline or the address may be incorrect. Select a different node to continue.
- h4kunamata 5mo ago
  That is a bad architecture then, it should be able to identify the node is offline on its own, and connect to the next node available, either by region or speed.
LuckyBuddy 5mo ago
[flagged]
sunshine-o 5mo ago
Radicle is a legit project that has been around for at least 5 years trying to solve a pretty hard problem. With the awareness of the dangers of Github growing they could really start gaining traction but from what I understand they still have a big problem: you can host a node, the web UI and create repos, link it to your website but it will be hard for people to find your project and code. You are on the internet, but not on the visible one. Radicle do have a search engine [0] but it won't return anything if you look for HardenedBSD. And maybe it is not Radicle role to provide the front door and code search infrastructure (I am pretty sure they to not have the money to support it). So my guess is key to decentralized code forges, whether it is Radicle, Gitea or Forgego instances, really miss the search infrastructure today. I am pretty sure HardenedBSD will keep mirrors on Github and Gitlab to stay "visible" to the broader Internet but what happen the day they have to leave because of some incompatibility with those corporations user agreement? - [0] https://search.radicle.xyz/ https://search.radicle.xyz/
- Skinney 5mo ago
  Wouldn't people discover HardenedBSD via google and then find the link to the code via the website? I've personally never discovered projects through Github.
  - 0x6c6f6c 5mo ago
    Many people do use GitHub for this. There are even Android app stores hinged around searching and installing release APKs. The social connectivity and discoverability in github is a big reason many people use it. Can't say how many, but it is.
    - SoftTalker 5mo ago
      I don't think I've ever searched for anything on github. I always follow a link.
      - fhn 5mo ago
        that's something you tell your interviewer
mkl 5mo ago
> Radicle is an open source, peer-to-peer code collaboration stack built on Git. Unlike centralized code hosting platforms, there is no single entity controlling the network. Repositories are replicated across peers in a decentralized manner, and users are in full control of their data and workflow. - https://radicle.dev/ https://radicle.dev/ There seems to be no way to get this kind of information from the radicle.network link in this article. Clicking the logo in the top left takes you to a page that just says "A public node run by the Radicle team", which is totally uninformative.
- deleted 5mo ago
  [deleted]
h4kunamata 5mo ago
Why hate yourself when you have Codeberg or its self hosted Forgejo?? In today's society, there is no much if anything trully peer-to-peer. They are either trying to make AI PRs harder to happen or idk
kernalix7 5mo ago
Codeberg / Forgejo are also out there as less radical alternatives, so the choice space isn't binary. But the discoverability gap is real, and so is the loss of all the surrounding infrastructure people don't always think about. CI runners, release hosting, container registry, security advisories. You can replace each of those individually, but doing it all at once is a significant maintenance burden for projects with limited maintainer time.

160 points by lftherios 5mo ago

chungy 5mo ago

Is Radicle an alternative to Fossil?

balou23 5mo ago
It seems to have similar ideas, but two big differences seem to be that 1. it's based on git 2. more focus on a truly decentralized p2p architecture

ramon156 5mo ago

In this scenario, how does p2p compare to ATProto? The downside of both is that you still need high available servers

fc417fc802 5mo ago
I don't think so? In the case of p2p (including radicle) you can run multiple not-so-reliable nodes. Of course that won't work for serving up a web frontend but that's distinct from the git repo itself.
Skinney 5mo ago
Radicle is local-first, so you can create issues and patches (pull requests) even when offline. It will sync when you're back online. Also, my understanding is that ATProto is relatively centralized in practice, wheras in radicle every node is sort of equal.

jgtrosh 5mo ago

I was not aware of Radicle; it's a truly peer-to-peer Git forge which aims to guarantee commits are signed by current maintainers (among, I suppose, other goals). The article mentions an us and a you, but I feel like it would have been an useful occasion to explain why move (from where?) and why Radicle. Maybe this was already discussed elsewhere? I suppose similar discussions regarding GitHub are happening today and could explain why this was posted to HN.

dmos62 5mo ago
Radicle is pretty cool. > Radicle’s Collaborative Objects (COBs) provide Radicle’s social primitive. This enables features such as issues, discussions and code review to be implemented as Git objects. Developers can extend Radicle’s capabilities to build any kind of collaboration flow they see fit.
- donatj 5mo ago
  I know I'm not supposed to make jokes, this is not reddit, but you might even say it's pretty radical.
  - dmos62 5mo ago
    I think apologetic jokes are very on point for HN, so no worries!
- bombcar 5mo ago
  I was just wondering in another thread how much you could do storing things in git itself.
lorenzleutgeb 5mo ago
For the reason of hbsd moving, see https://bsd.network/@HardenedBSD/116437657126172879 https://bsd.network/@HardenedBSD/116437657126172879
- hobofan 5mo ago
  So instead of their self-hosted Gitlab instance being hammered, now their self-hosted Radicle instance will be hammered (and if they are lucky some of the other seeders will tank some of the load)? I'm not sure that this will actually solve the problem. This seems more like a facade for a move they wanted to do anyways.
  - sunshine-o 5mo ago
    Yes they have been looking into decentralized technologies like mesh networking, reticulum, etc. for a while now. My guess is the model is let the Github mirror repo be hit by bots and just do the dev work on the Radicle node. - [0] https://hardenedbsd.org/article/shawn-webb/2024-09-23/hardenedbsd-and-protectli-collaborates-censorship-and-surveillance https://hardenedbsd.org/article/shawn-webb/2024-09-23/harden...

csomar 5mo ago

This is what I am getting > Could not connect to rad.hardenedbsd.org The node may be offline or the address may be incorrect. Select a different node to continue.

h4kunamata 5mo ago
That is a bad architecture then, it should be able to identify the node is offline on its own, and connect to the next node available, either by region or speed.

LuckyBuddy 5mo ago

[flagged]

sunshine-o 5mo ago

Radicle is a legit project that has been around for at least 5 years trying to solve a pretty hard problem. With the awareness of the dangers of Github growing they could really start gaining traction but from what I understand they still have a big problem: you can host a node, the web UI and create repos, link it to your website but it will be hard for people to find your project and code. You are on the internet, but not on the visible one. Radicle do have a search engine [0] but it won't return anything if you look for HardenedBSD. And maybe it is not Radicle role to provide the front door and code search infrastructure (I am pretty sure they to not have the money to support it). So my guess is key to decentralized code forges, whether it is Radicle, Gitea or Forgego instances, really miss the search infrastructure today. I am pretty sure HardenedBSD will keep mirrors on Github and Gitlab to stay "visible" to the broader Internet but what happen the day they have to leave because of some incompatibility with those corporations user agreement? - [0] https://search.radicle.xyz/ https://search.radicle.xyz/

Skinney 5mo ago
Wouldn't people discover HardenedBSD via google and then find the link to the code via the website? I've personally never discovered projects through Github.
- 0x6c6f6c 5mo ago
  Many people do use GitHub for this. There are even Android app stores hinged around searching and installing release APKs. The social connectivity and discoverability in github is a big reason many people use it. Can't say how many, but it is.
  - SoftTalker 5mo ago
    I don't think I've ever searched for anything on github. I always follow a link.
    - fhn 5mo ago
      that's something you tell your interviewer

mkl 5mo ago

> Radicle is an open source, peer-to-peer code collaboration stack built on Git. Unlike centralized code hosting platforms, there is no single entity controlling the network. Repositories are replicated across peers in a decentralized manner, and users are in full control of their data and workflow. - https://radicle.dev/ https://radicle.dev/ There seems to be no way to get this kind of information from the radicle.network link in this article. Clicking the logo in the top left takes you to a page that just says "A public node run by the Radicle team", which is totally uninformative.

deleted 5mo ago
[deleted]

h4kunamata 5mo ago

Why hate yourself when you have Codeberg or its self hosted Forgejo?? In today's society, there is no much if anything trully peer-to-peer. They are either trying to make AI PRs harder to happen or idk

kernalix7 5mo ago

Codeberg / Forgejo are also out there as less radical alternatives, so the choice space isn't binary. But the discoverability gap is real, and so is the loss of all the surrounding infrastructure people don't always think about. CI runners, release hosting, container registry, security advisories. You can replace each of those individually, but doing it all at once is a significant maintenance burden for projects with limited maintainer time.