6 ms·

Why are we letting tech companies in the USA do this?

mikert89 6mo ago
honestly i have no idea, in some cases, they are working weekends/are hyper focused on extremely boring, somewhat manual work. some of the systems are complicated and break constantly, so they are almost just oncall fodder for manually fixing a constantly breaking high scale service
- Ifkaluva 6mo ago
  Will these kinds of jobs survive Claude code? It sounds like exactly the job that would be easiest to automate.
  - foobarian 6mo ago
    And who gets paged when the Claude integration fails?
ang_cire 6mo ago
Because we live in a techno-oligarchy now? Because the leaders of the top tech companies (by revenue) literally sat behind the President at his inauguration? Because they can afford to buy the 'right' to do what they want, and you can't, and what they want is cheaper labor who they have more control over, and H1B workers will never rock the boat because the visa is a sword hanging over their heads. Downvote all you want, it's the truth.
- dfdsjsdklfjs 6mo ago
  [flagged]
  - deleted 6mo ago
    [deleted]
  - dozerly 6mo ago
    You can’t just write off everyone downvoting you for being conspiratorial as government plants lol
dogemaster2032 6mo ago
[dead]
layer8 6mo ago
It’s arguably consistent with the past: https://www.gilderlehrman.org/history-resources/essays/history-times-nation-immigrants https://www.gilderlehrman.org/history-resources/essays/histo...
raincole 6mo ago
To do what, attract talents from the rest of the world?
lateforwork 6mo ago
Because if we didn't we wouldn't have a tech industry? The main problem with immigrant talent in computer field is that legislators don't understand the difference between IT and Tech product development jobs. IT jobs don't need immigrant talent, so companies like Accenture, Infosys etc. should not be given H-1B visas. But tech companies like Google, Meta, Apple, OpenAI etc. absolutely need immigrant talent, or they will lose to Chinese competitors.
- shimman 6mo ago
  We had a tech industry prior to H1Bs before the 90s. What we didn't have was Silicon Valley corporatism that doesn't value American labor nor American education. It's why SV is so gun-ho on charter schools and devaluing American labor. Let's not act like we need to import 80k "high tech" workers that amount to writing react components and spring endpoints. Hardly anything hard that we couldn't force companies to train workers to do, but they don't want to ever help people they just want to suck up all the money in the room while decimating entire populations.zzzzzzz Also, as an American I don't really benefit if US corporations are doing "better." How does that help the person that can't pay for healthcare or afford to go to school, but they sure can get their serving of Zuckerberg slop? I'm supposed to care about these companies success? Really? I hope they go down in flames. The problem is that the rich and elite have captured and dictated American tech policy for far too long.
  - thesmtsolver2 6mo ago
    Do you share the same thoughts for blue collar immigrants?
    - shimman 6mo ago
      No, because blue collar immigrants aren't working for cartels that hold deeply undemocratic views.
      - munksbeer 6mo ago
        It is interesting to see the different views on immigration. Here in the UK, leading up to the brexit vote, everyone said blue collar workers were the problem, because they depressed wages for the poor and made the middle class richer because they could build cheaper houses, pick cheaper crops, etc. In Singapore, the rage is mostly against higher earner immigrants, because they take all the good jobs, making the middle class in Singapore poorer. I'm sensing a bit of a mix in your US centric argument. All in all, a lot of people just hate immigration, always have, always will. It is a topic as old as time.
Spooky23 6mo ago
It generates economic activity and taxes in the US and suppresses wages. Most of the H1 candidates are in shitty roles that are well defined low/moderate skill jobs for giant companies. Hire people whom you can’t actively exploit and those are the kind of jobs where unions can organize. The alternative is offshoring the work, not hiring Americans. The smart thing would be to just let people immigrate. Instead we have a weird tiered system with a small number of highly skilled specialists and an army of serfs facing deportation if they piss off the bosses.
- ethanwillis 6mo ago
  Offshoring isn't a given. It's simply permitted.
- Longlius 6mo ago
  Then offshore the work. Americans aren't getting the jobs anyway and the imported labor now competes for things like groceries, gas, housing, etc. which drives up prices.
  - Spooky23 6mo ago
    .
    - Longlius 6mo ago
      Keep up with that rhetoric. I'm sure it will go well for you come election season.
    - ethanwillis 6mo ago
      "listless rednecks" Yea, keep that same energy and see how it plays out.
      - ethanwillis 6mo ago
        Just so people know since the user above wanted to edit their comment away to hide how they really see things. It was this: "They also pay the social security and Medicare taxes so listless rednecks can collect SSDI for being unable to work."
bigyabai 6mo ago
Why would we stop them? Labor is a free market.
throwaway422432 6mo ago
It's not just the USA, all Western countries are on a path of mass immigration: software, engineering and health services in particular. A big factor has been diversity quotas to make organisations DSG numbers meet the requirements of institutional investors, political pressure and activists. Problem is: pushing diversity into traditional male roles didn't result in boys diversifying into non-traditional roles such as nursing and teaching, and now you have those other roles being filled with immigrants to make up for the shortfall. And those immigrants don't care for diversity.

honestly i have no idea, in some cases, they are working weekends/are hyper focused on extremely boring, somewhat manual work. some of the systems are complicated and break constantly, so they are almost just oncall fodder for manually fixing a constantly breaking high scale service

Ifkaluva 6mo ago
Will these kinds of jobs survive Claude code? It sounds like exactly the job that would be easiest to automate.
- foobarian 6mo ago
  And who gets paged when the Claude integration fails?

ang_cire 6mo ago

Because we live in a techno-oligarchy now? Because the leaders of the top tech companies (by revenue) literally sat behind the President at his inauguration? Because they can afford to buy the 'right' to do what they want, and you can't, and what they want is cheaper labor who they have more control over, and H1B workers will never rock the boat because the visa is a sword hanging over their heads. Downvote all you want, it's the truth.

dfdsjsdklfjs 6mo ago
[flagged]
- deleted 6mo ago
  [deleted]
- dozerly 6mo ago
  You can’t just write off everyone downvoting you for being conspiratorial as government plants lol

dogemaster2032 6mo ago

[dead]

layer8 6mo ago

It’s arguably consistent with the past: https://www.gilderlehrman.org/history-resources/essays/history-times-nation-immigrants https://www.gilderlehrman.org/history-resources/essays/histo...

raincole 6mo ago

To do what, attract talents from the rest of the world?

lateforwork 6mo ago

Because if we didn't we wouldn't have a tech industry? The main problem with immigrant talent in computer field is that legislators don't understand the difference between IT and Tech product development jobs. IT jobs don't need immigrant talent, so companies like Accenture, Infosys etc. should not be given H-1B visas. But tech companies like Google, Meta, Apple, OpenAI etc. absolutely need immigrant talent, or they will lose to Chinese competitors.

shimman 6mo ago
We had a tech industry prior to H1Bs before the 90s. What we didn't have was Silicon Valley corporatism that doesn't value American labor nor American education. It's why SV is so gun-ho on charter schools and devaluing American labor. Let's not act like we need to import 80k "high tech" workers that amount to writing react components and spring endpoints. Hardly anything hard that we couldn't force companies to train workers to do, but they don't want to ever help people they just want to suck up all the money in the room while decimating entire populations.zzzzzzz Also, as an American I don't really benefit if US corporations are doing "better." How does that help the person that can't pay for healthcare or afford to go to school, but they sure can get their serving of Zuckerberg slop? I'm supposed to care about these companies success? Really? I hope they go down in flames. The problem is that the rich and elite have captured and dictated American tech policy for far too long.
- thesmtsolver2 6mo ago
  Do you share the same thoughts for blue collar immigrants?
  - shimman 6mo ago
    No, because blue collar immigrants aren't working for cartels that hold deeply undemocratic views.
    - munksbeer 6mo ago
      It is interesting to see the different views on immigration. Here in the UK, leading up to the brexit vote, everyone said blue collar workers were the problem, because they depressed wages for the poor and made the middle class richer because they could build cheaper houses, pick cheaper crops, etc. In Singapore, the rage is mostly against higher earner immigrants, because they take all the good jobs, making the middle class in Singapore poorer. I'm sensing a bit of a mix in your US centric argument. All in all, a lot of people just hate immigration, always have, always will. It is a topic as old as time.

Spooky23 6mo ago

It generates economic activity and taxes in the US and suppresses wages. Most of the H1 candidates are in shitty roles that are well defined low/moderate skill jobs for giant companies. Hire people whom you can’t actively exploit and those are the kind of jobs where unions can organize. The alternative is offshoring the work, not hiring Americans. The smart thing would be to just let people immigrate. Instead we have a weird tiered system with a small number of highly skilled specialists and an army of serfs facing deportation if they piss off the bosses.

ethanwillis 6mo ago
Offshoring isn't a given. It's simply permitted.
Longlius 6mo ago
Then offshore the work. Americans aren't getting the jobs anyway and the imported labor now competes for things like groceries, gas, housing, etc. which drives up prices.
- Spooky23 6mo ago
  .
  - Longlius 6mo ago
    Keep up with that rhetoric. I'm sure it will go well for you come election season.
  - ethanwillis 6mo ago
    "listless rednecks" Yea, keep that same energy and see how it plays out.
    - ethanwillis 6mo ago
      Just so people know since the user above wanted to edit their comment away to hide how they really see things. It was this: "They also pay the social security and Medicare taxes so listless rednecks can collect SSDI for being unable to work."

bigyabai 6mo ago

Why would we stop them? Labor is a free market.

throwaway422432 6mo ago

It's not just the USA, all Western countries are on a path of mass immigration: software, engineering and health services in particular. A big factor has been diversity quotas to make organisations DSG numbers meet the requirements of institutional investors, political pressure and activists. Problem is: pushing diversity into traditional male roles didn't result in boys diversifying into non-traditional roles such as nursing and teaching, and now you have those other roles being filled with immigrants to make up for the shortfall. And those immigrants don't care for diversity.