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Looking at it from an alternative angle, the Iranians are not stupid. They know leaving the internet online would be beneficial for their adversaries, perhaps

Looking at it from an alternative angle, the Iranians are not stupid. They know leaving the internet online would be beneficial for their adversaries, perhaps especially as Israel is one of them, and Israel's use of cyber is no secret. So by killing the internet, they have an instant air-gap firewall. Making the most of the levers they have fighting asymmetric warfare.

jncfhnb 7mo ago
It’s very economically harmful to be disconnected. That’s the downside
- traceroute66 7mo ago
  > It’s very economically harmful to be disconnected. That’s the downside I mean, sure. But then being at war is also economically harmful. :)
  - jncfhnb 7mo ago
    I guess. But the framing here is not “clever, innovative IRGC” so much as oppressive regime fucking over it’s people to retain control.
    - traceroute66 7mo ago
      > But the framing here is not “clever, innovative IRGC” I am not seeking to frame anything here. Nor am I interested in getting involved in the broader areas on discussion on the subject. The first few words of my original post made it clear "Looking at it from an alternative angle". An alternative way of wording that would be "devil's advocate". I am just supplying a perfectly reasonable alternative perspective, I am not asking anyone to agree or disagree with it, I am just making a "food for thought" statement.
      - jncfhnb 7mo ago
        I don’t see any alternative angle though. Nobody thinks the IRGC is doing this for fun.
        overfeed 7mo ago
        > I don’t see any alternative angle though I see it, and hadn't fully considered it. Turning off the Internet has more utility than just suppressing the populaces ability to communicate, it also blackholes that compromised mail server used to track the movement of political leaders, any online drop-boxes/Telegram/Whatsapp channels used by cultivated informants/spies are now out of order.
        jncfhnb 7mo ago
        Ehhh I suppose but I think that’s a weak point. The purpose of shutting down the internet is undeniably to prevent the people from coordinating rebellion and the help control the narrative of the war.
        ElectricalUnion 7mo ago
        From my point of view, they can't even "just turn on the Internet", even if they wanted. We know from the Ukraine side that "keeping the internet on" requires a whole bunch of personal sacrifice, and a lot of "reasonably recent" electronic equipment and infrastructure that Iran can't simply buy or repair right now.
        overfeed 7mo ago
        I'll bet you - dollars to donuts - that Iran has many countrywide IP-based networks running at this second, for things such as broadcast and telecoms. Perhaps you are underestimating the resources available to a country of 90 million. You could play a game where you estimate the number of routers and switches outside of Tehran under a hypothetical where the the capital was leveled. I don't know how many universities Iran has, but my working assumption is that any one Computer Science department from a D-Tier university is equal to the task, if the physical carrier medium for the Internet is still present and they are bringing their ancient half-rack of equipment.
  - dmix 7mo ago
    This isn't just a wealthy country like the US doing war rations. Iran's economy was already in crisis before the war, where businesses stopped selling products because their currency was fluctuating so much they couldn't set prices without losing money. It means tons of small businesses shutting down and people going hungry. Which puts even more pressure on Iran's social services which are were already in a terrible state. Now the US blockade means significantly less tax money coming into the government. Their country is very much on the edge of chaos which is why they are brutally controlling their citizens.
  - amelius 7mo ago
    > But then being at war is also economically harmful. Especially being at war with practically all the countries around you.
    - roumenguha 7mo ago
      Unless you have the backing of a much larger economic power with virtually guaranteed funding and equipment.
      - amelius 7mo ago
        But that power has its own problems these days and can't be relied upon really.
- auyez 7mo ago
  It is possible to reduce harm by introducing white listed services. Kazakhstan did it in 2022, where only local bank apps worked during few days of blackout. I think Russia is doing it now with mobile network. If you can have a kill switch that activates intranet and cuts off internet in case of emergencies, then it can really help. The biggest threat are messaging apps and social media that can quickly spread information.
payamb 7mo ago
It’s proven time and time again that Mossad always find a way to infiltrate into even most secure Iranian network. This is mostly done to control the narrative and keep the pro regime supporters morale up.
- traceroute66 7mo ago
  > It’s proven time and time again that Mossad always find a way to infiltrate into even most secure Iranian network. Sure, but why make their life easier ? Taking your line of argument, you would also need to say "well, the US are going to bomb us anyway. We might as well just post all the GPS coordinates of sensitive sites up on Twitter".
ifwinterco 7mo ago
Yep, there is no country in the world where the elites wouldn't do similar things in this situation (an existential war). It doesn't matter what your constitution says, western countries have readily adopted brutal censorship during serious wars virtually every time. Failing to do so simply allows hostile foreign powers free reign in the information space domestically and increases the chance you lose

jncfhnb 7mo ago

It’s very economically harmful to be disconnected. That’s the downside

traceroute66 7mo ago
> It’s very economically harmful to be disconnected. That’s the downside I mean, sure. But then being at war is also economically harmful. :)
- jncfhnb 7mo ago
  I guess. But the framing here is not “clever, innovative IRGC” so much as oppressive regime fucking over it’s people to retain control.
  - traceroute66 7mo ago
    > But the framing here is not “clever, innovative IRGC” I am not seeking to frame anything here. Nor am I interested in getting involved in the broader areas on discussion on the subject. The first few words of my original post made it clear "Looking at it from an alternative angle". An alternative way of wording that would be "devil's advocate". I am just supplying a perfectly reasonable alternative perspective, I am not asking anyone to agree or disagree with it, I am just making a "food for thought" statement.
    - jncfhnb 7mo ago
      I don’t see any alternative angle though. Nobody thinks the IRGC is doing this for fun.
      - overfeed 7mo ago
        > I don’t see any alternative angle though I see it, and hadn't fully considered it. Turning off the Internet has more utility than just suppressing the populaces ability to communicate, it also blackholes that compromised mail server used to track the movement of political leaders, any online drop-boxes/Telegram/Whatsapp channels used by cultivated informants/spies are now out of order.
        jncfhnb 7mo ago
        Ehhh I suppose but I think that’s a weak point. The purpose of shutting down the internet is undeniably to prevent the people from coordinating rebellion and the help control the narrative of the war.
        ElectricalUnion 7mo ago
        From my point of view, they can't even "just turn on the Internet", even if they wanted. We know from the Ukraine side that "keeping the internet on" requires a whole bunch of personal sacrifice, and a lot of "reasonably recent" electronic equipment and infrastructure that Iran can't simply buy or repair right now.
        overfeed 7mo ago
        I'll bet you - dollars to donuts - that Iran has many countrywide IP-based networks running at this second, for things such as broadcast and telecoms. Perhaps you are underestimating the resources available to a country of 90 million. You could play a game where you estimate the number of routers and switches outside of Tehran under a hypothetical where the the capital was leveled. I don't know how many universities Iran has, but my working assumption is that any one Computer Science department from a D-Tier university is equal to the task, if the physical carrier medium for the Internet is still present and they are bringing their ancient half-rack of equipment.
- dmix 7mo ago
  This isn't just a wealthy country like the US doing war rations. Iran's economy was already in crisis before the war, where businesses stopped selling products because their currency was fluctuating so much they couldn't set prices without losing money. It means tons of small businesses shutting down and people going hungry. Which puts even more pressure on Iran's social services which are were already in a terrible state. Now the US blockade means significantly less tax money coming into the government. Their country is very much on the edge of chaos which is why they are brutally controlling their citizens.
- amelius 7mo ago
  > But then being at war is also economically harmful. Especially being at war with practically all the countries around you.
  - roumenguha 7mo ago
    Unless you have the backing of a much larger economic power with virtually guaranteed funding and equipment.
    - amelius 7mo ago
      But that power has its own problems these days and can't be relied upon really.
auyez 7mo ago
It is possible to reduce harm by introducing white listed services. Kazakhstan did it in 2022, where only local bank apps worked during few days of blackout. I think Russia is doing it now with mobile network. If you can have a kill switch that activates intranet and cuts off internet in case of emergencies, then it can really help. The biggest threat are messaging apps and social media that can quickly spread information.

payamb 7mo ago

It’s proven time and time again that Mossad always find a way to infiltrate into even most secure Iranian network. This is mostly done to control the narrative and keep the pro regime supporters morale up.

traceroute66 7mo ago
> It’s proven time and time again that Mossad always find a way to infiltrate into even most secure Iranian network. Sure, but why make their life easier ? Taking your line of argument, you would also need to say "well, the US are going to bomb us anyway. We might as well just post all the GPS coordinates of sensitive sites up on Twitter".

ifwinterco 7mo ago

Yep, there is no country in the world where the elites wouldn't do similar things in this situation (an existential war). It doesn't matter what your constitution says, western countries have readily adopted brutal censorship during serious wars virtually every time. Failing to do so simply allows hostile foreign powers free reign in the information space domestically and increases the chance you lose