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No. While I don’t like Trump and never did, several of the prosecutions against him were political. By political, I mean they would not have happened if he had

No. While I don’t like Trump and never did, several of the prosecutions against him were political. By political, I mean they would not have happened if he had not become a politician, in fact, they didn’t until he became one and an unpopular one at that. And he’s doing much worse now so that’s two.

miltonlost 6mo ago
Which of the prosecutions were political hit jobs? Enumerate which of the federal and state crimes that Trump was convicted were actually politcal hit jobs. Your definition of political ("not happening if he wasn't a politician") is not what that definition is.
- wredcoll 6mo ago
  Yeah, the (untrue accusation) is the important part of the political prosecution phrase.
lambda 6mo ago
You may be right that they were political in that sense. But also, they probably should have happened were he not a politician. He's been committing fraud and other white collar crimes for quite a while. Unfortunately, we go far too easy on white collar crime in this country. And he's a master of plausible deniability, where he effectively asks other people to commit crimes on his behalf, but in a plausibly deniable way with no written trail.
rootusrootus 6mo ago
> they would not have happened if he had not become a politician That is a little vague. Some of his crimes only happened because he became a politician, so of course the prosecution would be seen as political in that sense. What I would like to know is which crimes did he commit that were only prosecuted because he was a politician, which would otherwise have been ignored?
- philipallstar 6mo ago
  The main crime seems to have been leaving the Democrat party as it raced leftwards.
  - rootusrootus 6mo ago
    Your comment seems to be a roundabout way of illustrating the concept of relativity.
- Telemakhos 6mo ago
  One seems to be New York v. Trump, which was a civil lawsuit instead of criminal. The main charge in the case was overstatement of real estate values to secure loans, yet the banks lending the money (mainly Deutsche Bank, if I remember correctly) were sophisticated lenders who were capable of assessing those estimates and the risk of lending. The banks not only did not lose money from the transactions but in fact happily made money, and they had no complaint about the deals they'd made with Trump. These were all private deals between sophisticated parties who knew what they were doing, and everyone made money. So, no bank suffered harm leading to the charge and no bank lodged any complaint against Trump—the prosecutor went looking for something with which to charge him, and this was the best she could find.
  - robot-wrangler 6mo ago
    > main charge in the case was overstatement of real estate values to secure loans > The banks not only did not lose money from the transactions but in fact happily made money, and they had no complaint about the deals The first part is either a crime, or it is not, regardless of the second? Suppose I falsely say I am worth millions, and then actually win the lottery. It being true later doesn't change whether it was lie originally.
    - Telemakhos 6mo ago
      That's exactly why my first point was that it was a civil lawsuit brought by the Attorney General, not a criminal case: the underlying overstatement of real estate values was not charged as the crime of fraud, which would have required more proof including proof of intent and actual harm—of which the former would have been hard to prove, and the latter did not exist. The District Attorney (who handles criminal matters like fraud) decided there was no criminal case, but the Attorney General took it as a civil matter despite there being no criminal case and nobody unhappy about the deals. It was purely a political prosecution.
tredre3 6mo ago
> I mean they would not have happened if he had not become a politician His wife in the 1990s accused him of rape and intended to sue him as part of the divorce proceedings. She changed her words when she obtained a generous divorce settlement, moving from outright rape to "not in the criminal sense, I just felt violated". That was over 20 years before Trump gained political relevance.
Spooky23 6mo ago
Well, yeah. When you turn public office into an ATM for your friends and family, one would expect that.

miltonlost 6mo ago

Which of the prosecutions were political hit jobs? Enumerate which of the federal and state crimes that Trump was convicted were actually politcal hit jobs. Your definition of political ("not happening if he wasn't a politician") is not what that definition is.

wredcoll 6mo ago
Yeah, the (untrue accusation) is the important part of the political prosecution phrase.

lambda 6mo ago

You may be right that they were political in that sense. But also, they probably should have happened were he not a politician. He's been committing fraud and other white collar crimes for quite a while. Unfortunately, we go far too easy on white collar crime in this country. And he's a master of plausible deniability, where he effectively asks other people to commit crimes on his behalf, but in a plausibly deniable way with no written trail.

rootusrootus 6mo ago

> they would not have happened if he had not become a politician That is a little vague. Some of his crimes only happened because he became a politician, so of course the prosecution would be seen as political in that sense. What I would like to know is which crimes did he commit that were only prosecuted because he was a politician, which would otherwise have been ignored?

philipallstar 6mo ago
The main crime seems to have been leaving the Democrat party as it raced leftwards.
- rootusrootus 6mo ago
  Your comment seems to be a roundabout way of illustrating the concept of relativity.
Telemakhos 6mo ago
One seems to be New York v. Trump, which was a civil lawsuit instead of criminal. The main charge in the case was overstatement of real estate values to secure loans, yet the banks lending the money (mainly Deutsche Bank, if I remember correctly) were sophisticated lenders who were capable of assessing those estimates and the risk of lending. The banks not only did not lose money from the transactions but in fact happily made money, and they had no complaint about the deals they'd made with Trump. These were all private deals between sophisticated parties who knew what they were doing, and everyone made money. So, no bank suffered harm leading to the charge and no bank lodged any complaint against Trump—the prosecutor went looking for something with which to charge him, and this was the best she could find.
- robot-wrangler 6mo ago
  > main charge in the case was overstatement of real estate values to secure loans > The banks not only did not lose money from the transactions but in fact happily made money, and they had no complaint about the deals The first part is either a crime, or it is not, regardless of the second? Suppose I falsely say I am worth millions, and then actually win the lottery. It being true later doesn't change whether it was lie originally.
  - Telemakhos 6mo ago
    That's exactly why my first point was that it was a civil lawsuit brought by the Attorney General, not a criminal case: the underlying overstatement of real estate values was not charged as the crime of fraud, which would have required more proof including proof of intent and actual harm—of which the former would have been hard to prove, and the latter did not exist. The District Attorney (who handles criminal matters like fraud) decided there was no criminal case, but the Attorney General took it as a civil matter despite there being no criminal case and nobody unhappy about the deals. It was purely a political prosecution.

tredre3 6mo ago

> I mean they would not have happened if he had not become a politician His wife in the 1990s accused him of rape and intended to sue him as part of the divorce proceedings. She changed her words when she obtained a generous divorce settlement, moving from outright rape to "not in the criminal sense, I just felt violated". That was over 20 years before Trump gained political relevance.

Spooky23 6mo ago

Well, yeah. When you turn public office into an ATM for your friends and family, one would expect that.