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> Modernity is about not doing what your family says The flip side is that rich and modern people feel lonely and sad that they don't have strong social bonds.
by klooney 6mo ago
> Modernity is about not doing what your family says
The flip side is that rich and modern people feel lonely and sad that they don't have strong social bonds.
- teaearlgraycold 6mo agoSpeak for yourself.
- IncreasePosts 6mo agoThat is more of a self inflicted wound than an intrinsic aspect of modern society.
- sillysaurusx 6mo agoI wish it was self inflicted. Instead, it seems to be an artifact of modern society. I posted “How to Be Alone?” exploring this issue somewhat: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47296547 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47296547 690 points, 500+ comments. I’m not trying to get pity, but it would be mistaken to say that I brought it on myself. My wife didn’t bring it on me either. We simply eroded over time. But when marital bonds erode, it turns out they take family bonds with them; or at least, her side of the family. My side isn’t much, so hers was my primary source of social interaction. This is a self inflicted wound in the sense that I could have formed a lot of social bonds with people other than my wife. And I tried to, sometimes. But when you’re spending 20 years with one person, it’s hard to make time for anything else, especially if you want to do good work (in the researcher sense). So it’s more of a “pick two: family, friends, work”. I went the family and work route. I don’t regret it, but it means that now all that’s left is work, which can be a hollow existence. Luckily, modern society has a surplus of ways to help motivated people form social bonds. Once I get my car back, I’ll be going to the local therapy groups, one of which is wood crafting. Random hobbies like that with random people sounds fun. The thing to avoid seems to be dating apps. Jumping from one relationship into another is universally known as a bad idea. I’m hoping that casting a wide net (going to groups, reading clubs, DnD, or other activities) will fill the void. Honestly though, what helps the most is that I have a daughter. She’s almost 3. I’m very happy we had her, and just remembering that she’ll have a nice life helps me appreciate my own. Modern society makes it easier than ever to isolate yourself. I spend my days sitting in a house alone, having Amazon drop off USB-C cables, with my biggest social interaction of the week being the door to door salesman (who, ironically, is trying to sell me a door) that’s coming by tomorrow. That’s the default state; you have to push back against it, and that’s hard. But it’s probably mistaken to say that those who go with the flow are suffering from self inflicted wounds. Societal flow used to be towards social groups (church being the most obvious example) instead of paths that end in loneliness.
- Hnrobert42 6mo agoHello friend. I responded to your post and have thought about you since. Yet had you not referenced your post, I would not have made the connection. It's too bad there's not a way to more easily recognize people on this site, a way to build more community.
- sillysaurusx 6mo agoThank you! That’s so kind of you. I’m pleased to report that the advice I got directly helped me feel optimistic about life again. The community is here, and I continue to be amazed by it. I’m grateful for you and everybody else who helped dig me out. Feel free to shoot me an email. I was buried in dozens of emails last time (apologies if I missed anyone) but things are much slower now. Happy to hear from you or anyone else who wants to chat.
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- stavros 6mo agoThere's a happy medium between the "everyone in the family shares absolutely everything" that less individualistic societies have and the "everyone in the family is alone" that more individualistic societies tend to have. The US, in particular, is on the far end of that spectrum, because of the cultural emphasis on work and self-reliance. The happy medium, in my opinion, is trading off some work for some friends. In many cases within US culture, at least, you might be trading off an amount of time that yields a marginal reward at work but a much larger reward in friendship, simply because that's how diminishing returns tend to work.
- kakacik 6mo ago> pick two: family, friends, work That should be always supremely easy and never contain work, unless you are maybe working in medical care or education. Given education path normally leaves a lot of free time then just the former. I would maybe add fourth - oneself, unless one is a proper exreovert. Requires least of the time, but its most important for long term mental health.
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- bobanrocky 6mo agoOk, so better to be poor and backward, eh ?
- dfee 6mo agoperhaps.
- margalabargala 6mo agoHard to say. There are so many options that aren't just those two.
- JumpCrisscross 6mo ago> flip side is that rich and modern people feel lonely and sad The happiest countries in the world are also rich [1]. I'm not saying you can't fuck up being rich. But it's a lot harder to be fulfilled if you're poor. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Happiness_Report#2025_report https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Happiness_Report#2025_re...
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- komali2 6mo agoLots of valid criticisms of the oft touted "happiness index." Off the top of my head from something I read a while back: Finland is listed as one of the happiest countries, but also has a higher rate than normal of prescribed anti psychotics and anti depressants, and also has high rates of alcoholism and suicide. Something isn't lining up there. My own anecdotal experience as well conflicts. When I travel through Scandinavia, people seem... Fine. Friends I have there say you're basically not allowed to talk to strangers, at all, everyone is meant to just quietly ignore each other. Meanwhile the deeper I go into Vietnam, even deep into where people still live on stilt houses made by hand tools, the happier and more sociable people are. My friends say the same of various countries in Africa.
- yongjik 6mo agoThe flip side of the flip side is that poor people in traditional societies are often trapped in toxic interpersonal dynamics from which there's no escape, because they live in the same household. Like, in Korea, "mother-in-law vs daughter-in-law relationship issues" used to be so common that there's a single word for that. Nowadays they're getting harder to witness, unless you're a fan of weekend k-dramas.
- nntwozz 6mo agoIf you're lonely when you're alone, you're in bad company. — Jean-Paul Sartre
- JumpCrisscross 6mo agoLoneliness and aloneness are almost separate phenomenon. I've felt my loneliest in the middle of Manhattan and completely fulfilled when on a solo hike in the Grand Tetons.
- internet_points 6mo agoor just an extrovert, but nuance doesn't make for pithy quotes
- whimsicalism 6mo agomaybe. personally i would definitely not trade places
- kakacik 6mo agoThats what people on one side of the argument like to think, patting themselves on their back for their own decisions. I am old enough to have seen it many many times. There is no simple win - each person is different, each family is different, where one thrives the other has absolutely miserable time imprisoned with no way out. world is not black and white and neither are people, dont dumb it down like that since you miss what reality looks like.
- renewiltord 6mo agoI don’t actually think so. I think if you apply rigor to those results you find that they don’t stand up. The field of sociology applies rigor selectively. Few of its results actually hold up. I don’t even think the loneliness epidemic is real. The science is really not that strong.