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Yes, but it not like before. We (as humans) are getting more strict about losing people's life. We don't allow genocide, we don't allow colonization and enslav

by aogaili 7mo ago

Yes, but it not like before. We (as humans) are getting more strict about losing people's life. We don't allow genocide, we don't allow colonization and enslavement, at least the majority of nations agree that this is not acceptable. So it is NOT like before. And the logical conclusion, as those drones get better and more widely adopted, is that war will be nothing more a video game with real economics and supply chain. So we basically made the cost of genocide or colonization too high to absorb. Previous wars, people got away with it.

ncruces 7mo ago
We don't allow? Who doesn't? And what are they going to do about it?
- aogaili 7mo ago
  The majority of nations? majority of people on earth? We are going to a multilateral world and to win a war you need secure the appeal of majority. If the majority think your war is illegal they can cut you off from the world economy. It is a distributed consensus-based algorithm, and the young people who are writing those algorithms will shape the future of governance.
  - ncruces 7mo ago
    The majority of the world thinks the Russia-Ukraine war is illegal. The majority of the world thinks the Israeli/US-Iran war is illegal.
    - aogaili 7mo ago
      You are arguing today. This is the first kind of wars we are seeing of this nature. But Iran is hitting exactly where it hurts, global supply chain, and now the US will be pressured by the global economy to either retreat or commit a genocide. And if all the war was drones and anti-drones today (which is not) we would have saved many lives. Look at UAE/Iran, UAE lost no live despite being hammered with drones/missiles, this is an example of drones/anti-drones future. The reason why we don't have this with the US, is because the US needs a defeat for the legacy system to die, and it seems they will get that defeat soon. Actually they are already defeated, Trump said he is retreating in 3 weeks while achieving nothing but destruction.
      - RiverStone 6mo ago
        Your casual usage of the word “genocide” doesn’t apply to Iran. Iranians are dramatically in favor of removing the theocratic Islamic regime. Iranian expats the world over celebrated Khamenei’s death. My Iranian mother-in-law living in Tehran has literally been saying “get the mullahs out” every time we’ve spoken for the last year. Millions of Iranians inside Iran are thankful that the US (and even Israel despite the complicated relationship) is attacking the regime. This is a regime, after all, that killed thousands of its own people. That requires girls to fully cover themselves. That doesn’t allow singing or dancing in the street. Achieved nothing? Go talk to a real Iranian, you don’t know what you’re talking about. Iranians the world over have felt hope for the first time in over 40 years that they may get their country back. And we absolutely should not stop trying to help them.
        aogaili 6mo ago
        Yeah, I grew up in Iraq, under more ruthless dictator that fought Iran. You are naive if you thank Israel/US are here to free Iran. A government won't last that long if there were to genuine supports. The fact you are outside of Iran and have some people there, doesn't make you more knowledgeable, it makes you westernized and you voted to leave with your own feet.
        RiverStone 6mo ago
        From my conversations, Iranians don’t really care if Israel/US are specifically there to “free Iran”. Iranians are pragmatic, they understand that US/Israel have their own motives. As long as the regime is being destroyed, that’s a win. And that’s happening, big time. That’s why Iranians danced in the street when Khamenei was killed.
  - lazide 7mo ago
    Hoho ho. Hardly helped anyone in Bakmut eh? And hardly how China or India are likely to work too. That future you seem to think is inevitable is very far from it:
    - aogaili 7mo ago
      What this had to with with my arguments regarding the nature of future warfare, the emerging world economical order? There is no point in history where we had such connected economies and this kind of autonomous war technology. All previous wars were fought by human bodies. We are witnessing the first generation of wars that becoming completely autonomous.
      - lazide 7mo ago
        There seems to be an assumption of ‘power to the people’, and ‘just world’, that just doesn’t seem to match reality at all. That’s what I am responding too.
        aogaili 7mo ago
        Where is the assumptions? it is not just world. It is a world ruled by constrains and for better or worse human nature. There is no people involved at all, in fact my argument is that there will be no people involved in wars..I'm just extrapolating on the what we are seeing today. Also nobody really understands reality fully not predict the future. We are just speculating here on what might happen. You surely don't understand reality and you said you can't imagine anything else. Alright, so in your mind the world and future war will stay the same, regardless of drones, robotics and AI. Frankly, I don't understand what your argument is other than saying fantasy and doesn't match the reality that somehow you know more.
        ncruces 7mo ago
        The goal of war is to subjugate others to your will through suffering. That will not change, and I'm not sure how you expect that to work with zero human involvement.
aogaili 7mo ago
[flagged]
- gambiting 7mo ago
  What made you come to that conclusion?
  - aogaili 7mo ago
    You either agree or disagree with the idea of genocide. And if you disagree with idea of genocide, then this is becoming closer to video games as more drones are deployed which is my thesis. But if you agree with the idea of genocide, then yes, wars can be won by total elimination (or major reduction) in the other people's population and loss of life. So do you think genocide is acceptable in war or not?
    - gambiting 7mo ago
      >>So do you think genocide is acceptable in war or not? Why would downvoting your comment signify supporting genocide though?
      - aogaili 7mo ago
        Well, because they reject the idea of making a war a physical video games of drones, therefore, they would be advocating keeping the current system? My point was that we are better off with abstracting away the war, so if you downvote that idea, then you want to keep the current system, and to win a war in the current system you need total surrender, which comes at a huge cost of life. You got it?
        gambiting 7mo ago
        No, I downvoted your idea that somehow we "don't allow" genocide and yet Israel killed over 20k children in Gaza and literally nothing happened to anyone as a result - the downvote is on the blatantly untrue assumption that doesn't seem to relate to the real world at all. I still don't understand why you think this implies that I support genocide, when the exact opposite is true?
Blackthorn 7mo ago
> We don't allow genocide, we don't allow colonization and enslavement, at least the majority of nations agree that this is not acceptable Literally all of these things are happening as we type this. What the majority of nations do or do not want is irrelevant.
- aogaili 7mo ago
  Think in the future, I speak about a future, and you repeat it is happening, yes of course it is happening today, this tech is just being adopted.
  - lazide 7mo ago
    So…. Fantasy?
    - aogaili 7mo ago
      So future = fantasy in your mind? you can not speculate anything beyond the present? well, that is limitation in your thinking.
      - lazide 7mo ago
        More like the first two definitions of the word - literally. https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/fantasy https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/fantasy
        aogaili 7mo ago
        Again, poor argument. You can't speculate or think of the future..so if I do what you do, I say you are retarded - literally https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/retarded https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/retarded. But that is not argument, that just us name calling each other, and I was hoping you have something of substance.
        7mo ago
watwut 7mo ago
Ukrainian invasion was attempt at genocide and colonization. Israel did anoyher genocide last year. And then there is yemen which may not be genocide, I dunno, but has super high unchecked amount of victims. Saudi made sure no one is watching. And they all get away with it.
- aogaili 7mo ago
  Today yes, unfortunately. But my argument is for the future that we are starting to get a glimpses of. I'm not negating the currently genocides, I'm hoping for a future in which we don't have war at all due to the absurdly of it. And I'm arguing that there is a path forward and it is very realistic. You missed my point, please read my other comments.
aogaili 7mo ago
It is interesting that people give downvoting, so either they enjoy having the current wars continue and people physically killed, or they basically gave up on seeing a better future. Both cases, it is sad.

by aogaili 7mo ago

ncruces 7mo ago

We don't allow? Who doesn't? And what are they going to do about it?

aogaili 7mo ago
The majority of nations? majority of people on earth? We are going to a multilateral world and to win a war you need secure the appeal of majority. If the majority think your war is illegal they can cut you off from the world economy. It is a distributed consensus-based algorithm, and the young people who are writing those algorithms will shape the future of governance.
- ncruces 7mo ago
  The majority of the world thinks the Russia-Ukraine war is illegal. The majority of the world thinks the Israeli/US-Iran war is illegal.
  - aogaili 7mo ago
    You are arguing today. This is the first kind of wars we are seeing of this nature. But Iran is hitting exactly where it hurts, global supply chain, and now the US will be pressured by the global economy to either retreat or commit a genocide. And if all the war was drones and anti-drones today (which is not) we would have saved many lives. Look at UAE/Iran, UAE lost no live despite being hammered with drones/missiles, this is an example of drones/anti-drones future. The reason why we don't have this with the US, is because the US needs a defeat for the legacy system to die, and it seems they will get that defeat soon. Actually they are already defeated, Trump said he is retreating in 3 weeks while achieving nothing but destruction.
    - RiverStone 6mo ago
      Your casual usage of the word “genocide” doesn’t apply to Iran. Iranians are dramatically in favor of removing the theocratic Islamic regime. Iranian expats the world over celebrated Khamenei’s death. My Iranian mother-in-law living in Tehran has literally been saying “get the mullahs out” every time we’ve spoken for the last year. Millions of Iranians inside Iran are thankful that the US (and even Israel despite the complicated relationship) is attacking the regime. This is a regime, after all, that killed thousands of its own people. That requires girls to fully cover themselves. That doesn’t allow singing or dancing in the street. Achieved nothing? Go talk to a real Iranian, you don’t know what you’re talking about. Iranians the world over have felt hope for the first time in over 40 years that they may get their country back. And we absolutely should not stop trying to help them.
      - aogaili 6mo ago
        Yeah, I grew up in Iraq, under more ruthless dictator that fought Iran. You are naive if you thank Israel/US are here to free Iran. A government won't last that long if there were to genuine supports. The fact you are outside of Iran and have some people there, doesn't make you more knowledgeable, it makes you westernized and you voted to leave with your own feet.
        RiverStone 6mo ago
        From my conversations, Iranians don’t really care if Israel/US are specifically there to “free Iran”. Iranians are pragmatic, they understand that US/Israel have their own motives. As long as the regime is being destroyed, that’s a win. And that’s happening, big time. That’s why Iranians danced in the street when Khamenei was killed.
- lazide 7mo ago
  Hoho ho. Hardly helped anyone in Bakmut eh? And hardly how China or India are likely to work too. That future you seem to think is inevitable is very far from it:
  - aogaili 7mo ago
    What this had to with with my arguments regarding the nature of future warfare, the emerging world economical order? There is no point in history where we had such connected economies and this kind of autonomous war technology. All previous wars were fought by human bodies. We are witnessing the first generation of wars that becoming completely autonomous.
    - lazide 7mo ago
      There seems to be an assumption of ‘power to the people’, and ‘just world’, that just doesn’t seem to match reality at all. That’s what I am responding too.
      - aogaili 7mo ago
        Where is the assumptions? it is not just world. It is a world ruled by constrains and for better or worse human nature. There is no people involved at all, in fact my argument is that there will be no people involved in wars..I'm just extrapolating on the what we are seeing today. Also nobody really understands reality fully not predict the future. We are just speculating here on what might happen. You surely don't understand reality and you said you can't imagine anything else. Alright, so in your mind the world and future war will stay the same, regardless of drones, robotics and AI. Frankly, I don't understand what your argument is other than saying fantasy and doesn't match the reality that somehow you know more.
        ncruces 7mo ago
        The goal of war is to subjugate others to your will through suffering. That will not change, and I'm not sure how you expect that to work with zero human involvement.

aogaili 7mo ago

[flagged]

gambiting 7mo ago
What made you come to that conclusion?
- aogaili 7mo ago
  You either agree or disagree with the idea of genocide. And if you disagree with idea of genocide, then this is becoming closer to video games as more drones are deployed which is my thesis. But if you agree with the idea of genocide, then yes, wars can be won by total elimination (or major reduction) in the other people's population and loss of life. So do you think genocide is acceptable in war or not?
  - gambiting 7mo ago
    >>So do you think genocide is acceptable in war or not? Why would downvoting your comment signify supporting genocide though?
    - aogaili 7mo ago
      Well, because they reject the idea of making a war a physical video games of drones, therefore, they would be advocating keeping the current system? My point was that we are better off with abstracting away the war, so if you downvote that idea, then you want to keep the current system, and to win a war in the current system you need total surrender, which comes at a huge cost of life. You got it?
      - gambiting 7mo ago
        No, I downvoted your idea that somehow we "don't allow" genocide and yet Israel killed over 20k children in Gaza and literally nothing happened to anyone as a result - the downvote is on the blatantly untrue assumption that doesn't seem to relate to the real world at all. I still don't understand why you think this implies that I support genocide, when the exact opposite is true?

Blackthorn 7mo ago

> We don't allow genocide, we don't allow colonization and enslavement, at least the majority of nations agree that this is not acceptable Literally all of these things are happening as we type this. What the majority of nations do or do not want is irrelevant.

aogaili 7mo ago
Think in the future, I speak about a future, and you repeat it is happening, yes of course it is happening today, this tech is just being adopted.
- lazide 7mo ago
  So…. Fantasy?
  - aogaili 7mo ago
    So future = fantasy in your mind? you can not speculate anything beyond the present? well, that is limitation in your thinking.
    - lazide 7mo ago
      More like the first two definitions of the word - literally. https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/fantasy https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/fantasy
      - aogaili 7mo ago
        Again, poor argument. You can't speculate or think of the future..so if I do what you do, I say you are retarded - literally https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/retarded https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/retarded. But that is not argument, that just us name calling each other, and I was hoping you have something of substance.
        7mo ago

watwut 7mo ago

Ukrainian invasion was attempt at genocide and colonization. Israel did anoyher genocide last year. And then there is yemen which may not be genocide, I dunno, but has super high unchecked amount of victims. Saudi made sure no one is watching. And they all get away with it.

aogaili 7mo ago
Today yes, unfortunately. But my argument is for the future that we are starting to get a glimpses of. I'm not negating the currently genocides, I'm hoping for a future in which we don't have war at all due to the absurdly of it. And I'm arguing that there is a path forward and it is very realistic. You missed my point, please read my other comments.

aogaili 7mo ago

It is interesting that people give downvoting, so either they enjoy having the current wars continue and people physically killed, or they basically gave up on seeing a better future. Both cases, it is sad.