4 ms·

Only logical result is Transgender Olympics

by nilslindemann 7mo ago

koolba 7mo ago
Already in the works: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enhanced_Games https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enhanced_Games
- space_fountain 7mo ago
  But trans women aren't in anyway enhanced in their ability to compete?
  - undersuit 7mo ago
    And from the linked Wiki: "According to D'Souza, athletes should also be categorised based on their chromosomal sex."
bertylicious 7mo ago
Why not Human Olympics?
- cm2187 7mo ago
  Already exists, it's what people refer to as "male olympics". As far as I know, females aren't banned from competing. It is just that they don't stand a chance in most disciplines. The whole point of female olympics is to keep males out.
  - xeonmc 7mo ago
    Can trans male who transitioned before puberty compete in male olympics while being pumped full of steroids legally?
    - mikkupikku 7mo ago
      Maybe they should accept that they simply aren't competitive if they can't compete against their own sex. There's no shame in it, most people aren't competitive, certainly so at this level.
  - UncleMeat 7mo ago
    That’s not true. Men’s gymnastics and women’s gymnastics are totally different sets of events and men would get trounced in a women’s event.
    - deleted 7mo ago
      [deleted]
    - zahlman 7mo ago
      Putting aside that you argue entirely by assertion, that is one discipline, which therefore does not contradict the claim about "most disciplines". Meanwhile the gap is well known to be massive in typical events, e.g.: * Compare https://worldpowerlifting.com/records/womens-world-records/ https://worldpowerlifting.com/records/womens-world-records/ vs https://worldpowerlifting.com/records/mens-world-records/ https://worldpowerlifting.com/records/mens-world-records/ (or for that matter, browse through https://exrx.net/Testing/WeightLifting/StrengthStandards https://exrx.net/Testing/WeightLifting/StrengthStandards) * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women's_100_metres_world_record_progression https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women's_100_metres_world_recor... plateaued at numbers seen in men's competition over a century ago; a "sub-elite" female competitor sprints barely ahead of "intermediate recreational" men per https://marathonhandbook.com/average-100-meter-time/ https://marathonhandbook.com/average-100-meter-time/ . Griffith-Joyner's record-setting time would not have even qualified her to run with men since at least 2000: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/100_metres_at_the_Olympics https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/100_metres_at_the_Olympics * I often hear it suggested that women show an advantage in longer races, but even at standard marathon length this is not borne out in results: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2025_Boston_Marathon https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2025_Boston_Marathon * National and international level competitive women's sports teams regularly get trounced by teenaged boys in exhibition e.g. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EDH_r7-GN4o https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EDH_r7-GN4o widely reported on last year and https://www.cbssports.com/soccer/news/a-dallas-fc-under-15-boys-squad-beat-the-u-s-womens-national-team-in-a-scrimmage/ https://www.cbssports.com/soccer/news/a-dallas-fc-under-15-b... from 2017 * The entire history of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Sexes_(tennis) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Sexes_(tennis) requires quite a bit of creative interpretation to put women's tennis anywhere near the level of men's That's just off the top of my head of anecdotes and examples I can recall being casually thrown around in these sorts of discussions.
- krunck 7mo ago
  Why not ignore gender labels and go by chromosomal configuration? There could be XY and XX [1] olympics. And then there should be X, XYY, XXX, XXXY, XXYY, and all the other possibilities [2]. There is more complexity than the binary in the expression of sex in humans. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexual_differentiation_in_humans https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexual_differentiation_in_huma... [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intersex https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intersex
  - badc0ffee 7mo ago
    I agree with you in general, but I think it would be fair to let XY individuals with CAIS compete on the female side - their bodies do not respond to testosterone.
  - appreciatorBus 7mo ago
    All biological categories are fuzzy around the edges. Those fuzzy edges do not invalidate the category. The existence of small #'s of people with actual physical intersex conditions (not "I feel like <x>") in no way conflicts with humans being sexually dimorphic.
  - RansomStark 7mo ago
    That is what they do. Male, female, man, woman, boy, girl are sex categories, not gender categories, that is they predate the very idea of gender as distinct from sex. Sports categories never had anything to do with gender. The other difference of sexual development are different sexes
  - madaxe_again 7mo ago
    Really, there should be separate categories for people with more than the regular amount of arm hair. Also separate categories for short people, tall people, lazy people, people who wear glasses, people with blue trousers, and of course, for sketch artists and quantitative traders.
  - space_fountain 7mo ago
    Because then trans men will dominate the "women"'s category. What's frustrating about this entire subject is that many of these things were tried. After finding that too many cis athletes were being disqualified they switched to the current rules that in most cases split things based on testerone levels. You can choose to do it some other way, but all of them come with some problems that people won't like
nslsm 7mo ago
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Games_Done_Quick https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Games_Done_Quick
- sillysaurusx 7mo ago
  [flagged]
  - Dylan16807 7mo ago
    Being inclusive seems to be a big part of their mission.
    - sillysaurusx 7mo ago
      [flagged]
      - Dylan16807 7mo ago
        They don't seem to have a page directly talking about goals, but look at their front page. Specifically the section at the bottom talking about community stuff, which also has prominent links in the top bar.
  - mbStavola 7mo ago
    Would it? It's the most popular event for speedrunning and has raised millions of dollars each year for over a decade. Sounds like they're doing just fine as is and, perhaps, fostering an inclusive environment which explicitly protects people demonized by society at large has only helped, not hurt.
    - sillysaurusx 7mo ago
      [flagged]

Only logical result is Transgender Olympics

koolba 7mo ago

Already in the works: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enhanced_Games https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enhanced_Games

space_fountain 7mo ago
But trans women aren't in anyway enhanced in their ability to compete?
- undersuit 7mo ago
  And from the linked Wiki: "According to D'Souza, athletes should also be categorised based on their chromosomal sex."

bertylicious 7mo ago

Why not Human Olympics?

cm2187 7mo ago
Already exists, it's what people refer to as "male olympics". As far as I know, females aren't banned from competing. It is just that they don't stand a chance in most disciplines. The whole point of female olympics is to keep males out.
- xeonmc 7mo ago
  Can trans male who transitioned before puberty compete in male olympics while being pumped full of steroids legally?
  - mikkupikku 7mo ago
    Maybe they should accept that they simply aren't competitive if they can't compete against their own sex. There's no shame in it, most people aren't competitive, certainly so at this level.
- UncleMeat 7mo ago
  That’s not true. Men’s gymnastics and women’s gymnastics are totally different sets of events and men would get trounced in a women’s event.
  - deleted 7mo ago
    [deleted]
  - zahlman 7mo ago
    Putting aside that you argue entirely by assertion, that is one discipline, which therefore does not contradict the claim about "most disciplines". Meanwhile the gap is well known to be massive in typical events, e.g.: * Compare https://worldpowerlifting.com/records/womens-world-records/ https://worldpowerlifting.com/records/womens-world-records/ vs https://worldpowerlifting.com/records/mens-world-records/ https://worldpowerlifting.com/records/mens-world-records/ (or for that matter, browse through https://exrx.net/Testing/WeightLifting/StrengthStandards https://exrx.net/Testing/WeightLifting/StrengthStandards) * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women's_100_metres_world_record_progression https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women's_100_metres_world_recor... plateaued at numbers seen in men's competition over a century ago; a "sub-elite" female competitor sprints barely ahead of "intermediate recreational" men per https://marathonhandbook.com/average-100-meter-time/ https://marathonhandbook.com/average-100-meter-time/ . Griffith-Joyner's record-setting time would not have even qualified her to run with men since at least 2000: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/100_metres_at_the_Olympics https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/100_metres_at_the_Olympics * I often hear it suggested that women show an advantage in longer races, but even at standard marathon length this is not borne out in results: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2025_Boston_Marathon https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2025_Boston_Marathon * National and international level competitive women's sports teams regularly get trounced by teenaged boys in exhibition e.g. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EDH_r7-GN4o https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EDH_r7-GN4o widely reported on last year and https://www.cbssports.com/soccer/news/a-dallas-fc-under-15-boys-squad-beat-the-u-s-womens-national-team-in-a-scrimmage/ https://www.cbssports.com/soccer/news/a-dallas-fc-under-15-b... from 2017 * The entire history of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Sexes_(tennis) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Sexes_(tennis) requires quite a bit of creative interpretation to put women's tennis anywhere near the level of men's That's just off the top of my head of anecdotes and examples I can recall being casually thrown around in these sorts of discussions.
krunck 7mo ago
Why not ignore gender labels and go by chromosomal configuration? There could be XY and XX [1] olympics. And then there should be X, XYY, XXX, XXXY, XXYY, and all the other possibilities [2]. There is more complexity than the binary in the expression of sex in humans. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexual_differentiation_in_humans https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexual_differentiation_in_huma... [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intersex https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intersex
- badc0ffee 7mo ago
  I agree with you in general, but I think it would be fair to let XY individuals with CAIS compete on the female side - their bodies do not respond to testosterone.
- appreciatorBus 7mo ago
  All biological categories are fuzzy around the edges. Those fuzzy edges do not invalidate the category. The existence of small #'s of people with actual physical intersex conditions (not "I feel like <x>") in no way conflicts with humans being sexually dimorphic.
- RansomStark 7mo ago
  That is what they do. Male, female, man, woman, boy, girl are sex categories, not gender categories, that is they predate the very idea of gender as distinct from sex. Sports categories never had anything to do with gender. The other difference of sexual development are different sexes
- madaxe_again 7mo ago
  Really, there should be separate categories for people with more than the regular amount of arm hair. Also separate categories for short people, tall people, lazy people, people who wear glasses, people with blue trousers, and of course, for sketch artists and quantitative traders.
- space_fountain 7mo ago
  Because then trans men will dominate the "women"'s category. What's frustrating about this entire subject is that many of these things were tried. After finding that too many cis athletes were being disqualified they switched to the current rules that in most cases split things based on testerone levels. You can choose to do it some other way, but all of them come with some problems that people won't like

nslsm 7mo ago

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Games_Done_Quick https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Games_Done_Quick

sillysaurusx 7mo ago
[flagged]
- Dylan16807 7mo ago
  Being inclusive seems to be a big part of their mission.
  - sillysaurusx 7mo ago
    [flagged]
    - Dylan16807 7mo ago
      They don't seem to have a page directly talking about goals, but look at their front page. Specifically the section at the bottom talking about community stuff, which also has prominent links in the top bar.
- mbStavola 7mo ago
  Would it? It's the most popular event for speedrunning and has raised millions of dollars each year for over a decade. Sounds like they're doing just fine as is and, perhaps, fostering an inclusive environment which explicitly protects people demonized by society at large has only helped, not hurt.
  - sillysaurusx 7mo ago
    [flagged]