4 ms·

I don't think Minecraft would be considered a cornerstone of optimal programming.

by tosti 7mo ago

kulahan 7mo ago
The entire program doesn't need to be a cornerstone of optimal programming for this one example to hold true.
helterskelter 7mo ago
The 4 bit stuff is a hangover from Mojang having to squeeze every bit of perf from their Java based engine that they could. Their original sound engine was so sketchy that C418's (music composer) minimalist sound is partly because it really couldn't handle much more than what got released. MS has been loosening up on the 4 bits limit and have created a CPP variant of Minecraft which performs better, but they've also introduced their unified login garbage that has almost made me give up Minecraft completely.
- Pannoniae 7mo ago
  Hey, this isn't entirely accurate! The 4-bit stuff is a hangover from Notch doing this (I'd maybe even say a similar-calibre programmer to Chris Sawyer...). The sound has nothing to do with technical limits, that's a post-facto rationalisation. The game never played midi samples, it was always playing "real" audio. The style was an artistic choice, many similar retro-looking games were using chiptune and the sorts. It's a deliberate juxtaposition... The CPP variant doesn't really perform better anymore either.
  - helterskelter 7mo ago
    Fair enough, I mostly meant to point out some of those design decisions predate MS, as much as I love to hate on them. The music was just an interesting bit of trivia I read the other day.
    - Pannoniae 7mo ago
      Yeah, 100% :) Ironically, the design constraints are one of the big things which made it work so much! If it was designed in a "traditional" way, it would have been much less ambitious.
  - imtringued 7mo ago
    Bedrock Edition has a smaller simulation distance, which is kind of the opposite you'd expect from the more "optimized" version.
mort96 7mo ago
Minecraft is, and always has been, handling vast amounts of data at pretty good performance. It's not an impossibly difficult task, many other people have made voxel game engines which are better, but it's something you can't do without paying attention to these things. Every voxel engine with remotely reasonable performance needs to carefully count bits used per block.
nitwit005 7mo ago
You can find other people discussing implementing similar games on YouTube, and the need to cram the representation of blocks into as small a size as possible always comes up. Information about blocks is the overwhelmingly dominant thing being stored in memory for those games, so naturally reducing the size of that data becomes important.

I don't think Minecraft would be considered a cornerstone of optimal programming.

by tosti 7mo ago

I don't think Minecraft would be considered a cornerstone of optimal programming.

kulahan 7mo ago

The entire program doesn't need to be a cornerstone of optimal programming for this one example to hold true.

helterskelter 7mo ago

The 4 bit stuff is a hangover from Mojang having to squeeze every bit of perf from their Java based engine that they could. Their original sound engine was so sketchy that C418's (music composer) minimalist sound is partly because it really couldn't handle much more than what got released. MS has been loosening up on the 4 bits limit and have created a CPP variant of Minecraft which performs better, but they've also introduced their unified login garbage that has almost made me give up Minecraft completely.

Pannoniae 7mo ago
Hey, this isn't entirely accurate! The 4-bit stuff is a hangover from Notch doing this (I'd maybe even say a similar-calibre programmer to Chris Sawyer...). The sound has nothing to do with technical limits, that's a post-facto rationalisation. The game never played midi samples, it was always playing "real" audio. The style was an artistic choice, many similar retro-looking games were using chiptune and the sorts. It's a deliberate juxtaposition... The CPP variant doesn't really perform better anymore either.
- helterskelter 7mo ago
  Fair enough, I mostly meant to point out some of those design decisions predate MS, as much as I love to hate on them. The music was just an interesting bit of trivia I read the other day.
  - Pannoniae 7mo ago
    Yeah, 100% :) Ironically, the design constraints are one of the big things which made it work so much! If it was designed in a "traditional" way, it would have been much less ambitious.
- imtringued 7mo ago
  Bedrock Edition has a smaller simulation distance, which is kind of the opposite you'd expect from the more "optimized" version.

mort96 7mo ago

Minecraft is, and always has been, handling vast amounts of data at pretty good performance. It's not an impossibly difficult task, many other people have made voxel game engines which are better, but it's something you can't do without paying attention to these things. Every voxel engine with remotely reasonable performance needs to carefully count bits used per block.

nitwit005 7mo ago

You can find other people discussing implementing similar games on YouTube, and the need to cram the representation of blocks into as small a size as possible always comes up. Information about blocks is the overwhelmingly dominant thing being stored in memory for those games, so naturally reducing the size of that data becomes important.