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Apple and Google are facilitating the data sales Specifically, these big companies revenue share with app companies who in turn increase monetization via selli

Apple and Google are facilitating the data sales Specifically, these big companies revenue share with app companies who in turn increase monetization via selling your private information, esp via free apps. In exchange for Apple etc super high app store rake percentage fees, they claim to run security vetting programs and ToS that vet who they do business with and tell users & courts that things are safe, even when they know they're not. It's not rocket science for phone OS's to figure out who these companies are and, as iOS / android os users already get tracked by apple/google/etc, triangulate to which apps are participating

adrr 7mo ago
If I have a free app that hits location services on the device and I sell this data, how does Apple and Google make money from me?
- lmeyerov 7mo ago
  [dead]
quantified 7mo ago
And Facebook/Meta. Their trackers are everywhere.
- autoexec 7mo ago
  cloudflare is more everywhere than facebook
  - hedora 7mo ago
    Yeah, but unlike facebook, they weren't just caught making videos of people having sex then paying people to watch the videos. Also, unlike facebook, they also weren't just caught running a dark money lobbyist network with the goal of forcing more collection of minors' private information.
    - autoexec 7mo ago
      facebook is evil for many different reasons, but for a government looking to spy on its own citizens cloudflare is much more attractive target. That said, I have no doubt that they're collecting copious amounts of data from both companies, either by sale or by force.
- quickthoughts 7mo ago
  It's everyone. Especially google, but all the big tech companies play in the same pool. Amazon, Google, Apple, Meta etc make money selling ads, which ultimate enables the tools that result data harvesting from everyone across the internet. I wrote a little data investigation [1] (mostly finished) that show cases how every major news organization across the globe I scanned had some level of data collection integrated. This is just one industry, but its important (as it connects back to the incentives these media organizations have, which is to make money by selling ads at any cost). The eff also released an angle in how the bidding process to buy ads is itself a massive privacy nightmare[2] [1] https://quickthoughts.ca/autotracko/ https://quickthoughts.ca/autotracko/ [2] https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2026/03/targeted-advertising-gives-your-location-government-just-ask-cbp https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2026/03/targeted-advertising-g...
GeekyBear 7mo ago
Apple doesn't even allow apps to know whose device they are running on without the user's explicit opt-in permission. Just as importantly, apps aren't allowed to remove functionality if the user says no. You need additional permissions to do things like access location data or scan local networks for device fingerprinting.
cheriot 7mo ago
I'm game for throwing rocks at Apple and Google, but I don't get this one. > consumer apps embed ad SDKs → those SDKs feed location signals into RTB ad exchanges → surveillance-oriented firms sit in the RTB pipeline and harvest bid request data even without winning auctions Would you ban ad supported apps? Assuming the comment you're responding to is realistic, I'm not sure how the OS is to blame.
- lmeyerov 7mo ago
  You can trace the big players If Google & Apple & friends refused to take a rake and opened distribution, then I'd agree, net neutrality etc, not their problem But they own so much, and so deep into the pipeline, and explain their fees to courts because "security"... and then don't do investigations. They employ some of the best security analysts in the world and have $10-30B/yr revenue tied to just the app store fees, so they very much can take a big bite out of this if they wanted.
  - godelski 7mo ago
    > They employ some of the best security analysts in the world and have $10-30B/yr revenue I'll never not be impressed by how many people will defend trillion dollar organizations and say that things are too expensive. Especially when open source projects (including forks!) implement such features. I'm completely with you, they could do these things if they wanted to. They have the money. They have the manpower. It is just a matter of priority. And we need to be honest, they're spending larger amounts on slop than actual fixes or even making their products better (for the user).
    - antonvs 7mo ago
      “Priorities” is far too soft a term in this context. These are anti-priorities: not just things they choose not to work on, but things they’ll spend big money to prevent, up to and including bribing, uh I mean lobbying, lawmakers.
- autoexec 7mo ago
  > Would you ban ad supported apps? There's no need to ban ad supported apps when you can just ban the practice of using ads targeting users based on individual characteristics.
Tempest1981 7mo ago
Not Experian, TransUnion, and Equifax? Or for location, the cellular providers?
- lmeyerov 7mo ago
  There are plenty of bad actors The interesting part is Google & Apple, as part of explaining to courts why their large app store fees are legit and not proof of monopoly positions, hid behind the security argument that they need to be the clearing house of what software runs on the devices. Except... they've knowingly punted on this one for 10+ years. I would 100% agree that losing privacy through any utility-level carrier (credit cards, phone, OS provider, etc) should be default disallowed, and any opt-ins have a clear transparency mode with easy opt-out. At least two areas the US can learn from the EU on digital policy is digital marketplaces and consumer privacy protection, and this topic is at the intersection of both.

adrr 7mo ago

If I have a free app that hits location services on the device and I sell this data, how does Apple and Google make money from me?

lmeyerov 7mo ago
[dead]

quantified 7mo ago

And Facebook/Meta. Their trackers are everywhere.

autoexec 7mo ago
cloudflare is more everywhere than facebook
- hedora 7mo ago
  Yeah, but unlike facebook, they weren't just caught making videos of people having sex then paying people to watch the videos. Also, unlike facebook, they also weren't just caught running a dark money lobbyist network with the goal of forcing more collection of minors' private information.
  - autoexec 7mo ago
    facebook is evil for many different reasons, but for a government looking to spy on its own citizens cloudflare is much more attractive target. That said, I have no doubt that they're collecting copious amounts of data from both companies, either by sale or by force.
quickthoughts 7mo ago
It's everyone. Especially google, but all the big tech companies play in the same pool. Amazon, Google, Apple, Meta etc make money selling ads, which ultimate enables the tools that result data harvesting from everyone across the internet. I wrote a little data investigation [1] (mostly finished) that show cases how every major news organization across the globe I scanned had some level of data collection integrated. This is just one industry, but its important (as it connects back to the incentives these media organizations have, which is to make money by selling ads at any cost). The eff also released an angle in how the bidding process to buy ads is itself a massive privacy nightmare[2] [1] https://quickthoughts.ca/autotracko/ https://quickthoughts.ca/autotracko/ [2] https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2026/03/targeted-advertising-gives-your-location-government-just-ask-cbp https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2026/03/targeted-advertising-g...

GeekyBear 7mo ago

Apple doesn't even allow apps to know whose device they are running on without the user's explicit opt-in permission. Just as importantly, apps aren't allowed to remove functionality if the user says no. You need additional permissions to do things like access location data or scan local networks for device fingerprinting.

cheriot 7mo ago

I'm game for throwing rocks at Apple and Google, but I don't get this one. > consumer apps embed ad SDKs → those SDKs feed location signals into RTB ad exchanges → surveillance-oriented firms sit in the RTB pipeline and harvest bid request data even without winning auctions Would you ban ad supported apps? Assuming the comment you're responding to is realistic, I'm not sure how the OS is to blame.

lmeyerov 7mo ago
You can trace the big players If Google & Apple & friends refused to take a rake and opened distribution, then I'd agree, net neutrality etc, not their problem But they own so much, and so deep into the pipeline, and explain their fees to courts because "security"... and then don't do investigations. They employ some of the best security analysts in the world and have $10-30B/yr revenue tied to just the app store fees, so they very much can take a big bite out of this if they wanted.
- godelski 7mo ago
  > They employ some of the best security analysts in the world and have $10-30B/yr revenue I'll never not be impressed by how many people will defend trillion dollar organizations and say that things are too expensive. Especially when open source projects (including forks!) implement such features. I'm completely with you, they could do these things if they wanted to. They have the money. They have the manpower. It is just a matter of priority. And we need to be honest, they're spending larger amounts on slop than actual fixes or even making their products better (for the user).
  - antonvs 7mo ago
    “Priorities” is far too soft a term in this context. These are anti-priorities: not just things they choose not to work on, but things they’ll spend big money to prevent, up to and including bribing, uh I mean lobbying, lawmakers.
autoexec 7mo ago
> Would you ban ad supported apps? There's no need to ban ad supported apps when you can just ban the practice of using ads targeting users based on individual characteristics.

Tempest1981 7mo ago

Not Experian, TransUnion, and Equifax? Or for location, the cellular providers?

lmeyerov 7mo ago
There are plenty of bad actors The interesting part is Google & Apple, as part of explaining to courts why their large app store fees are legit and not proof of monopoly positions, hid behind the security argument that they need to be the clearing house of what software runs on the devices. Except... they've knowingly punted on this one for 10+ years. I would 100% agree that losing privacy through any utility-level carrier (credit cards, phone, OS provider, etc) should be default disallowed, and any opt-ins have a clear transparency mode with easy opt-out. At least two areas the US can learn from the EU on digital policy is digital marketplaces and consumer privacy protection, and this topic is at the intersection of both.