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Can you provide some support for your moral position? You’ve also put “insane horror” in scare quotes, which honestly I find troubling. Does your moral account

Can you provide some support for your moral position? You’ve also put “insane horror” in scare quotes, which honestly I find troubling. Does your moral account provide some justificatory, non-antisemitic framework based on colonialism or oppression that allows us to sidestep the issues with Gazans’ support of Jihad, other extremist doctrines, and the extermination of Jews? It’s kind of a rhetorical question, but it’s the least I would expect for someone to argue credibly about the morality of the conflict.

albedoa 8mo ago
They're not "scare quotes", they're quotes.
- vehemenz 8mo ago
  Huh? In English orthography, quotes can serve multiple purposes. Most native English speakers wouldn’t see the parent’s use of quotes (quotation marks) as merely mention.
  - albedoa 8mo ago
    This isn't the least bit confusing man. The author confirms the purpose of the quotes, which is effortlessly understandable by native and non-native speakers alike. They were used to quote and comment on a direct phrase from the parent comment. You absolutely do not need to double down on whatever it is you are doing here lol. Say you were wrong and move on.
JasonADrury 8mo ago
Yeah, they're just quotes. It's a quote. >Can you provide some support for your moral position? Yes, of course. A bunch of people from Europe decided to move to Palestine and start a religious ethnostate there. In doing so they expelled and murdered lots of local residents. The surviving locals are understandably less than happy about this, and have continued to fight to defend their lands to this day. Since then, the those people have caused far more harm to non-jewish Palestinians than non-jewish Palestinians have caused to the those people. >allows us to sidestep the issues with Gazans’ support of Jihad, other extremist doctrines, and the extermination of Jews? It's perfectly natural that Gazans would support the extermination of jews. In the extreme environment that Israeli jews force Palestinians to live in, it's fundamentally ridiculous to even describe it as an extremist position. In a comfortable European context it's certainly extreme, but that's a fundamentally dishonest way of portraying it.
- dijit 8mo ago
  "It's perfectly natural that Gazans would support the extermination of Jews." That's not a point about colonialism or occupation; that's a justification for ethnic extermination based on the conditions of the people holding the position. By that logic there is no floor: any atrocity becomes "perfectly natural" if the grievance is large enough. In your broader argument you're describing a blood debt with no statute of limitations and no mechanism for resolution. Skåne (where I live) was Danish. Alsace was German. Most of Europe was Roman. At some point borders exist, people live within them, and the only available direction is forward. You haven't described a political framework- you've described a permanent state of war with no exit condition except one side's disappearance. You just said it's perfectly natural to want to exterminate an ethnic group. Read that back.
  - JasonADrury 8mo ago
    >By that logic there is no floor: any atrocity becomes "perfectly natural" if the grievance is large enough. This is mostly true, yeah. Do you not believe that humans act like that? >In your broader argument you're describing a blood debt with no statute of limitations and no mechanism for resolution Nonsense. >Skåne (where I live) was Danish. Alsace was German. Most of Europe was Roman. At some point borders exist, people live within them, and the only available direction is forward. Except Israel does not want Palestine to move forward. There are approximately zero living people that give a shit about the things you mentioned, there are millions of living Palestinians who do care and suffer at the hands of Israeli state every single day. How did you intend for this comparison to be even vaguely relevant? >you've described a permanent state of war with no exit condition except one side's disappearance. This is deliberately obtuse, Israel has had a plenty of ways to largely exit this conflict. At the very least they could've given all Palestinians Israeli citizenship and equal rights decades ago. Of course, that's not really compatible with the ideals of the jewish ethnostate. I'm sure the Palestinians wouldn't seriously object though. >You just said it's perfectly natural to want to exterminate an ethnic group. Read that back. I'll repeat it if you want me to. We've seen it over and over again in history, it's hardly a new thing. Considering how the jewish people choose to treat the Palestinians, it is not surprising that Palestinians want to exterminate the jewish people. It is a perfectly predictable reaction, and not some special quirk of the Palestinians.

albedoa 8mo ago

They're not "scare quotes", they're quotes.

vehemenz 8mo ago
Huh? In English orthography, quotes can serve multiple purposes. Most native English speakers wouldn’t see the parent’s use of quotes (quotation marks) as merely mention.
- albedoa 8mo ago
  This isn't the least bit confusing man. The author confirms the purpose of the quotes, which is effortlessly understandable by native and non-native speakers alike. They were used to quote and comment on a direct phrase from the parent comment. You absolutely do not need to double down on whatever it is you are doing here lol. Say you were wrong and move on.

JasonADrury 8mo ago

Yeah, they're just quotes. It's a quote. >Can you provide some support for your moral position? Yes, of course. A bunch of people from Europe decided to move to Palestine and start a religious ethnostate there. In doing so they expelled and murdered lots of local residents. The surviving locals are understandably less than happy about this, and have continued to fight to defend their lands to this day. Since then, the those people have caused far more harm to non-jewish Palestinians than non-jewish Palestinians have caused to the those people. >allows us to sidestep the issues with Gazans’ support of Jihad, other extremist doctrines, and the extermination of Jews? It's perfectly natural that Gazans would support the extermination of jews. In the extreme environment that Israeli jews force Palestinians to live in, it's fundamentally ridiculous to even describe it as an extremist position. In a comfortable European context it's certainly extreme, but that's a fundamentally dishonest way of portraying it.

dijit 8mo ago
"It's perfectly natural that Gazans would support the extermination of Jews." That's not a point about colonialism or occupation; that's a justification for ethnic extermination based on the conditions of the people holding the position. By that logic there is no floor: any atrocity becomes "perfectly natural" if the grievance is large enough. In your broader argument you're describing a blood debt with no statute of limitations and no mechanism for resolution. Skåne (where I live) was Danish. Alsace was German. Most of Europe was Roman. At some point borders exist, people live within them, and the only available direction is forward. You haven't described a political framework- you've described a permanent state of war with no exit condition except one side's disappearance. You just said it's perfectly natural to want to exterminate an ethnic group. Read that back.
- JasonADrury 8mo ago
  >By that logic there is no floor: any atrocity becomes "perfectly natural" if the grievance is large enough. This is mostly true, yeah. Do you not believe that humans act like that? >In your broader argument you're describing a blood debt with no statute of limitations and no mechanism for resolution Nonsense. >Skåne (where I live) was Danish. Alsace was German. Most of Europe was Roman. At some point borders exist, people live within them, and the only available direction is forward. Except Israel does not want Palestine to move forward. There are approximately zero living people that give a shit about the things you mentioned, there are millions of living Palestinians who do care and suffer at the hands of Israeli state every single day. How did you intend for this comparison to be even vaguely relevant? >you've described a permanent state of war with no exit condition except one side's disappearance. This is deliberately obtuse, Israel has had a plenty of ways to largely exit this conflict. At the very least they could've given all Palestinians Israeli citizenship and equal rights decades ago. Of course, that's not really compatible with the ideals of the jewish ethnostate. I'm sure the Palestinians wouldn't seriously object though. >You just said it's perfectly natural to want to exterminate an ethnic group. Read that back. I'll repeat it if you want me to. We've seen it over and over again in history, it's hardly a new thing. Considering how the jewish people choose to treat the Palestinians, it is not surprising that Palestinians want to exterminate the jewish people. It is a perfectly predictable reaction, and not some special quirk of the Palestinians.