4 ms·

This is a real insight "finding the most skilled candidate but rather the most compatible candidate", thank you very much, this is the kind of feedback I am loo

by ms_sv 7mo ago

This is a real insight "finding the most skilled candidate but rather the most compatible candidate", thank you very much, this is the kind of feedback I am looking for from engineers. I never looked at it from this perspective. I talked to hiring managers and most of them say skills is good but what we want is a personality because skills can be taught and personality cannot be. Personality I have experienced that, very skilled teammate exceptional, but personality was not a fit, so the management was not happy. "The best way to determine the right candidate is to ignore the nonsense on their resume and just talk to people.", that is true and this I have tried with when I was playing the role of hiring manager trying to find a team member to work with me in the company I worked for. I imagine the peer-to-peer verification framework like this talk to people and ask them personalized questions, this is how exceptional talent will be flushed out I think. Given that, if you were to imagine a tool that helps surface those 'quietly exceptional' people—the ones who are highly skilled but won't self-identify—what would that tool look like? Does it even need to be a tool to begin with?

austin-cheney 7mo ago
> I talked to hiring managers and most of them say skills is good but what we want is a personality because skills can be taught and personality cannot be. That is correct, but its an extreme over simplification. What they mean by personality is among these: * excellent soft skills - can listen and emotionally bond with others * excellent written communication - the ability to put into writing high precision content with minimal revision that is well structured. It should not take advanced effort to turn meeting notes into a formal written recommendation. * discipline / conscientiousness - this is awareness of the space outside yourself. It is the ability to balance 6 things at once with endurance throughout the day. Yes, technical skills can be taught. Hiring managers really prefer to retain their people and not have to rehire, so teaching people is a long game of minimal continuous effort from the leader via proper assignments and continuous practice on the part of the individual contributor. If the individual contributor also does this work as a hobby outside the office that is even better, but it would be a massive ethical violation to impose this or it intermingle it with assigned tasks. I am a hiring manager, by the way. From a tooling perspective I am not sure. My organization uses a tool called GreenHouse. It contains a candidate's resume and credentials and allows HR to build out forms for interview feedback. The insight part is always a challenge. I am fully remote so I am actively watching everything a candidate does with their eyeballs as much or more than listen to the content of their answers, because I want to know what they are thinking and what they are looking at since AI prompts during interviews is now a thing. When I do look at a resume what I am only looking at: * Years of total experience * Job hopping versus loyalty/duration * Credentials like education attainment, certifications, and so forth
- ms_sv 7mo ago
  Yes absolutely, I am looking for framework that will be included in the platform to be able to asses someone and determine those accurately skills to have them in the CV it is not easy and it is a challenge, overall those skills can make a teammate be valued among others. The AI interviews part is becoming very common as well, this is the issue I wanna solve since it is very easy to fake it while remote. I have another question, have you ever faced with getting a perfect candidate during interviews this person passes fully it is great, everything matches but then after 1 or 2 months the just completely flip and are not the candidate(now employee) what you tought and everyone else tought they are?
  - austin-cheney 7mo ago
    Yes. So, I work for a defense contractor and we can hire somebody into a start date within a week, but it might take a couple of months before they can enter the office, even online. During this period is where most people fall apart. Either they cannot get their administrative requirements together, cannot get their required certifications complete, or end up with a competing job they find better. They have not even gotten to the social interaction part of the job yet, but we are already starting to get a sense of their ability to lean in and participate by the time all their roles and permissions come in. Then we have a 90 day evaluation period where I write something up and sit down with the employee. I have never had anybody fail out by this point due to performance. With on-boarding so long everybody has time to really settle in. Even after they can come into the office/online there is still a honeymoon period. From a supervisory perspective it gets real at the 6 month or 12 month evaluation based upon the volume of assignments and quality of participation. I am super chill as a supervisor so as long as the employee gets their work in at the client's timeline, keeps the client happy, and is as helpful as possible to the rest of the team everything is kosher. I have released candidates for negative performance almost never, but it has happened. I have had an Army general officer tell me in the past that to get there they just have to do the job they are assigned and don't put their boss in hot water. I heard the exact same thing once at Bank of America, and it works for me as well. The people that bubble up for promotion tend to be the people that accomplish the most from the least effort, not the harder workers, because those are the people that can be assigned their same job plus an additional job. That does not mean taking shortcuts either. Part of doing more means overwhelmingly helping people in the present for building out relationships to leverage into the future.

by ms_sv 7mo ago

austin-cheney 7mo ago

> I talked to hiring managers and most of them say skills is good but what we want is a personality because skills can be taught and personality cannot be. That is correct, but its an extreme over simplification. What they mean by personality is among these: * excellent soft skills - can listen and emotionally bond with others * excellent written communication - the ability to put into writing high precision content with minimal revision that is well structured. It should not take advanced effort to turn meeting notes into a formal written recommendation. * discipline / conscientiousness - this is awareness of the space outside yourself. It is the ability to balance 6 things at once with endurance throughout the day. Yes, technical skills can be taught. Hiring managers really prefer to retain their people and not have to rehire, so teaching people is a long game of minimal continuous effort from the leader via proper assignments and continuous practice on the part of the individual contributor. If the individual contributor also does this work as a hobby outside the office that is even better, but it would be a massive ethical violation to impose this or it intermingle it with assigned tasks. I am a hiring manager, by the way. From a tooling perspective I am not sure. My organization uses a tool called GreenHouse. It contains a candidate's resume and credentials and allows HR to build out forms for interview feedback. The insight part is always a challenge. I am fully remote so I am actively watching everything a candidate does with their eyeballs as much or more than listen to the content of their answers, because I want to know what they are thinking and what they are looking at since AI prompts during interviews is now a thing. When I do look at a resume what I am only looking at: * Years of total experience * Job hopping versus loyalty/duration * Credentials like education attainment, certifications, and so forth

ms_sv 7mo ago
Yes absolutely, I am looking for framework that will be included in the platform to be able to asses someone and determine those accurately skills to have them in the CV it is not easy and it is a challenge, overall those skills can make a teammate be valued among others. The AI interviews part is becoming very common as well, this is the issue I wanna solve since it is very easy to fake it while remote. I have another question, have you ever faced with getting a perfect candidate during interviews this person passes fully it is great, everything matches but then after 1 or 2 months the just completely flip and are not the candidate(now employee) what you tought and everyone else tought they are?
- austin-cheney 7mo ago
  Yes. So, I work for a defense contractor and we can hire somebody into a start date within a week, but it might take a couple of months before they can enter the office, even online. During this period is where most people fall apart. Either they cannot get their administrative requirements together, cannot get their required certifications complete, or end up with a competing job they find better. They have not even gotten to the social interaction part of the job yet, but we are already starting to get a sense of their ability to lean in and participate by the time all their roles and permissions come in. Then we have a 90 day evaluation period where I write something up and sit down with the employee. I have never had anybody fail out by this point due to performance. With on-boarding so long everybody has time to really settle in. Even after they can come into the office/online there is still a honeymoon period. From a supervisory perspective it gets real at the 6 month or 12 month evaluation based upon the volume of assignments and quality of participation. I am super chill as a supervisor so as long as the employee gets their work in at the client's timeline, keeps the client happy, and is as helpful as possible to the rest of the team everything is kosher. I have released candidates for negative performance almost never, but it has happened. I have had an Army general officer tell me in the past that to get there they just have to do the job they are assigned and don't put their boss in hot water. I heard the exact same thing once at Bank of America, and it works for me as well. The people that bubble up for promotion tend to be the people that accomplish the most from the least effort, not the harder workers, because those are the people that can be assigned their same job plus an additional job. That does not mean taking shortcuts either. Part of doing more means overwhelmingly helping people in the present for building out relationships to leverage into the future.