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I have such mixed feelings about the EU right now. This battery initiative is definitely a good idea, but I am not onboard with their constant attempts at censo

I have such mixed feelings about the EU right now. This battery initiative is definitely a good idea, but I am not onboard with their constant attempts at censorship.

peterfirefly 9mo ago
The problem is the member states -- and the voters in the member states. The EU is only a coordination mechanism for those states. It's nothing like the federal layer of the US, or the federal layer of Germany for that matter. Many member states want censorship. Many MEPs want censorship.
- nephihaha 8mo ago
  The political class is a law unto itself wherever they are. Of course they want censorship... They can't have people exposing their stupidity and corruption.
progfix 9mo ago
What do you mean exactly with censorship?
- peterfirefly 9mo ago
  [flagged]
  - misnome 9mo ago
    Lol why is it always such a predictable list of gripes
    - peterfirefly 9mo ago
      So I am not wrong but you don't like it?
      - tolerance 9mo ago
        If I were to tell you that the examples you selected depict you as a bigot how would you react?
        peterfirefly 9mo ago
        [flagged]
        tolerance 9mo ago
        Hit the showers!
        gruez 9mo ago
        Freedom of speech is exactly for unpopular (or "bigot") opinions. You don't need freedom of speech to protect you from saying that puppies are cute.
        tolerance 9mo ago
        And how is popularity determined?
        gruez 9mo ago
        Where is this going?
        tolerance 9mo ago
        I can’t help but feel like you’re drawing this freedom along arbitrary limits. If something is subject to whether it’s popular shouldn’t there be forces who influence that?
        gruez 9mo ago
        >I can’t help but feel like you’re drawing this freedom along arbitrary limits I'm not. Saying that freedom of speech is for unpopular opinions doesn't imply it only protects unpopular opinions, any more than saying that wheelchair ramps are for wheelchairs doesn't imply only wheelchair people can use it.
    - deaux 9mo ago
      Yeah, quite predictable for someone to give actual examples when asked for examples. If you have other examples, go on and share them!
  - deleted 9mo ago
    [deleted]
- Hendrikto 9mo ago
  We punish people for saying the truth. In Germany we fined a man for calling a fat politician fat. Which she definitely is, morbidly so. Stuff like that.
  - V__ 9mo ago
    Because insults can be fined. That is a German law though, not an EU thing.
    - peterfirefly 9mo ago
      A bigger issue than the fine (which Much didn't have to pay because he won in court) is that the police thought it was a swell idea to search his house. The fine was wrong, too, and the amount (6000€!) was absurd. https://brusselssignal.eu/2024/03/german-businessman-cleared-in-mocking-politicians-case/ https://brusselssignal.eu/2024/03/german-businessman-cleared... She should have challenged him to a duel instead. That would have been a lot more fair than mobilizing the state to fight battles that should never have been fought AND it would have put the risk where it should have been, namely on her shoulders (and stomach and thighs) instead of on his. Another insulcident happened in January 2024: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Ricarda_Lang&oldid=1313825234#2024_online_fat-shaming_investigation https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Ricarda_Lang&oldi... The German police thought it was within its rights to demand that a foreign social media platform hand over identifying information on a user that apparently called her "well-rounded" in a less polite manner. I don't think the German police should search citizen's houses or demand identifying information about people who say things that aren't nice (but true).
- nephihaha 9mo ago
  I should be able to disagree publicly with the authorities on most issues without fear of prosecution or having my views suppressed online. That is a basic principle of democracy. We also shouldn't have to use personal ID to get online, but that is all being emplaced as we speak.

I have such mixed feelings about the EU right now. This battery initiative is definitely a good idea, but I am not onboard with their constant attempts at censorship.

peterfirefly 9mo ago

The problem is the member states -- and the voters in the member states. The EU is only a coordination mechanism for those states. It's nothing like the federal layer of the US, or the federal layer of Germany for that matter. Many member states want censorship. Many MEPs want censorship.

nephihaha 8mo ago
The political class is a law unto itself wherever they are. Of course they want censorship... They can't have people exposing their stupidity and corruption.

progfix 9mo ago

What do you mean exactly with censorship?

peterfirefly 9mo ago
[flagged]
- misnome 9mo ago
  Lol why is it always such a predictable list of gripes
  - peterfirefly 9mo ago
    So I am not wrong but you don't like it?
    - tolerance 9mo ago
      If I were to tell you that the examples you selected depict you as a bigot how would you react?
      - peterfirefly 9mo ago
        [flagged]
        tolerance 9mo ago
        Hit the showers!
      - gruez 9mo ago
        Freedom of speech is exactly for unpopular (or "bigot") opinions. You don't need freedom of speech to protect you from saying that puppies are cute.
        tolerance 9mo ago
        And how is popularity determined?
        gruez 9mo ago
        Where is this going?
        tolerance 9mo ago
        I can’t help but feel like you’re drawing this freedom along arbitrary limits. If something is subject to whether it’s popular shouldn’t there be forces who influence that?
        gruez 9mo ago
        >I can’t help but feel like you’re drawing this freedom along arbitrary limits I'm not. Saying that freedom of speech is for unpopular opinions doesn't imply it only protects unpopular opinions, any more than saying that wheelchair ramps are for wheelchairs doesn't imply only wheelchair people can use it.
  - deaux 9mo ago
    Yeah, quite predictable for someone to give actual examples when asked for examples. If you have other examples, go on and share them!
- deleted 9mo ago
  [deleted]
Hendrikto 9mo ago
We punish people for saying the truth. In Germany we fined a man for calling a fat politician fat. Which she definitely is, morbidly so. Stuff like that.
- V__ 9mo ago
  Because insults can be fined. That is a German law though, not an EU thing.
  - peterfirefly 9mo ago
    A bigger issue than the fine (which Much didn't have to pay because he won in court) is that the police thought it was a swell idea to search his house. The fine was wrong, too, and the amount (6000€!) was absurd. https://brusselssignal.eu/2024/03/german-businessman-cleared-in-mocking-politicians-case/ https://brusselssignal.eu/2024/03/german-businessman-cleared... She should have challenged him to a duel instead. That would have been a lot more fair than mobilizing the state to fight battles that should never have been fought AND it would have put the risk where it should have been, namely on her shoulders (and stomach and thighs) instead of on his. Another insulcident happened in January 2024: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Ricarda_Lang&oldid=1313825234#2024_online_fat-shaming_investigation https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Ricarda_Lang&oldi... The German police thought it was within its rights to demand that a foreign social media platform hand over identifying information on a user that apparently called her "well-rounded" in a less polite manner. I don't think the German police should search citizen's houses or demand identifying information about people who say things that aren't nice (but true).
nephihaha 9mo ago
I should be able to disagree publicly with the authorities on most issues without fear of prosecution or having my views suppressed online. That is a basic principle of democracy. We also shouldn't have to use personal ID to get online, but that is all being emplaced as we speak.