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I tell them the number up front. Because I'm not spending a week in their interview loop to find out they're going to offer me 30% less than my current job. Ben

I tell them the number up front. Because I'm not spending a week in their interview loop to find out they're going to offer me 30% less than my current job. Benefits are never a decider, and equity is a lottery ticket.

gertlex 8mo ago
I assume the mention of benefits was mostly a polite way to decline giving a number... It might also be more applicable in other industries/roles where benefits are more varied.
- joezydeco 8mo ago
  In either case, it never amounts to more than a $10K swing in comp. Same for vacation time. Yes, it's a polite way to brush off the question. But the end result is the same. A job offer way lower than what you're making, and now they have $20K in a bucket to go a little higher when you try to negotiate.
  - adregan 8mo ago
    Last 2 positions I’ve had haven’t had 401k matching and the health insurance costs are eye watering. I might consider an improvement in both to be worth a fair bit.
    - joezydeco 8mo ago
      In my experience, those are the two things that are impossible to move. They're built into company HR structures and they don't bend them for individuals unless you're C-suite.
crystal_revenge 8mo ago
> and equity is a lottery ticket. What's surprised me is that most of the younger coworkers I've had, having grown up largely through boom times, absolutely believe that this equity has tremendous value. I've had multiple younger coworkers talk about how excited they are to have so much equity in companies that have no visible path to a liquidity event.
- joezydeco 8mo ago
  There's a mythology in this business and it's highly seductive. You need to get burned once or twice by the reality before you learn.
onionisafruit 8mo ago
I’ve been surprised by too many low ball job offers to spend much time in an interviews without a good idea the salary will work for me. Usually I find out through back channels or levels.fyi though.
danbrooks 8mo ago
Yes. I pre-screen job postings to make sure that the compensation is workable before applying.
- joezydeco 8mo ago
  I don't trust the ranges put into job listings. It may give you a ballpark idea of the range, but anything that looks even slightly attractive or above market is usually put there to attract resumes. The real number is worse.
  - danbrooks 8mo ago
    Interesting - I've never had that experience. In my experience the most variable part is the amount of stock/bonus on top of base salary.
SamuelAdams 8mo ago
Benefits are rarely a decider IMO. Unless you need certain health care or there is something terribly unusual. The only time in my career I considered a benefits package was for a University that offered 12% 401k matching up to 100% of your contributions. The argument is “we have a competitive benefits package”. Yeah, so does everyone else.

gertlex 8mo ago

I assume the mention of benefits was mostly a polite way to decline giving a number... It might also be more applicable in other industries/roles where benefits are more varied.

joezydeco 8mo ago
In either case, it never amounts to more than a $10K swing in comp. Same for vacation time. Yes, it's a polite way to brush off the question. But the end result is the same. A job offer way lower than what you're making, and now they have $20K in a bucket to go a little higher when you try to negotiate.
- adregan 8mo ago
  Last 2 positions I’ve had haven’t had 401k matching and the health insurance costs are eye watering. I might consider an improvement in both to be worth a fair bit.
  - joezydeco 8mo ago
    In my experience, those are the two things that are impossible to move. They're built into company HR structures and they don't bend them for individuals unless you're C-suite.

crystal_revenge 8mo ago

> and equity is a lottery ticket. What's surprised me is that most of the younger coworkers I've had, having grown up largely through boom times, absolutely believe that this equity has tremendous value. I've had multiple younger coworkers talk about how excited they are to have so much equity in companies that have no visible path to a liquidity event.

joezydeco 8mo ago
There's a mythology in this business and it's highly seductive. You need to get burned once or twice by the reality before you learn.

onionisafruit 8mo ago

I’ve been surprised by too many low ball job offers to spend much time in an interviews without a good idea the salary will work for me. Usually I find out through back channels or levels.fyi though.

danbrooks 8mo ago

Yes. I pre-screen job postings to make sure that the compensation is workable before applying.

joezydeco 8mo ago
I don't trust the ranges put into job listings. It may give you a ballpark idea of the range, but anything that looks even slightly attractive or above market is usually put there to attract resumes. The real number is worse.
- danbrooks 8mo ago
  Interesting - I've never had that experience. In my experience the most variable part is the amount of stock/bonus on top of base salary.

SamuelAdams 8mo ago

Benefits are rarely a decider IMO. Unless you need certain health care or there is something terribly unusual. The only time in my career I considered a benefits package was for a University that offered 12% 401k matching up to 100% of your contributions. The argument is “we have a competitive benefits package”. Yeah, so does everyone else.