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>So many projects now walk on eggshells so as not to disrupt sponsor flow or employment prospects. In my experience, open-source maintainers tend to be very ag

>So many projects now walk on eggshells so as not to disrupt sponsor flow or employment prospects. In my experience, open-source maintainers tend to be very agreeable, conflict-avoidant people. It has nothing to do with corporate interests. Well, not all of them, of course, we all know some very notable exceptions. Unfortunately, some people see this welcoming attitude as an invite to be abusive.

mixologic 8mo ago
Yes, Linus Torvalds is famously agreeable.
- zero_shift 8mo ago
  That's why he succeeded
- cortesoft 8mo ago
  > Well, not all of them, of course, we all know some very notable exceptions.
doctorpangloss 8mo ago
the venn diagram of people who love the abuse of maintaining an open source project and people who will write sincere text back to something called an OpenClaw Agent: it's the same circle. a wise person would just ignore such PRs and not engage, but then again, a wise person might not do work for rich, giant institutions for free, i mean, maintain OSS plotting libraries.
- nativeit 8mo ago
  So what’s the alternative to OSS libraries, Captain Wisdom?
  - doctorpangloss 8mo ago
    we live in a crazy time where 9 of every 10 new repos being posted to github have some sort of newly authored solutions without importing dependencies to nearly everything. i don't think those are good solutions, but nonetheless, it's happening. this is a very interesting conversation actually, i think LLMs satisfy the actual demand that OSS satisfies, which is software that costs nothing, and if you think about that deeply there's all sorts of interesting ways that you could spend less time maintaining libraries for other people to not pay you for them.
co_king_3 8mo ago
Nothing has convinced me that Linus Torvalds' approach is justified like the contemporary onslaught of AI spam and idiocy has. AI users should fear verbal abuse and shame.
- CoastalCoder 8mo ago
  Perhaps a more effective approach would be for their users to face the exact same legal liabilities as if they had hand-written such messages? (Note that I'm only talking about messages that cross the line into legally actionable defamation, threats, etc. I don't mean anything that's merely rude or unpleasant.)
  - eshaham78 8mo ago
    [dead]
    - pixl97 8mo ago
      >which would be a tragedy for anonymity. Yea, in this world the cryptography people will be the first with their backs against the wall when the authoritarians of this age decide that us peons no longer need to keep secrets.
  - fl0ki 8mo ago
    This is the only way, because anything less would create a loophole where any abuse or slander can be blamed on an agent, without being able to conclusively prove that it was actually written by an agent. (Its operator has access to the same account keys, etc)
  - chasd00 8mo ago
    just put no agent produced code in the Code of Conduct document. People are use to getting shot into space for violating that thing little file. Point to the violation and ban the contributor forever and that will be that.
  - intended 8mo ago
    I’d hazard that the legal system is going to grind to a halt. Nothing can bridge the gap between content generating capability and verification effort.

mixologic 8mo ago

Yes, Linus Torvalds is famously agreeable.

zero_shift 8mo ago
That's why he succeeded
cortesoft 8mo ago
> Well, not all of them, of course, we all know some very notable exceptions.

doctorpangloss 8mo ago

the venn diagram of people who love the abuse of maintaining an open source project and people who will write sincere text back to something called an OpenClaw Agent: it's the same circle. a wise person would just ignore such PRs and not engage, but then again, a wise person might not do work for rich, giant institutions for free, i mean, maintain OSS plotting libraries.

nativeit 8mo ago
So what’s the alternative to OSS libraries, Captain Wisdom?
- doctorpangloss 8mo ago
  we live in a crazy time where 9 of every 10 new repos being posted to github have some sort of newly authored solutions without importing dependencies to nearly everything. i don't think those are good solutions, but nonetheless, it's happening. this is a very interesting conversation actually, i think LLMs satisfy the actual demand that OSS satisfies, which is software that costs nothing, and if you think about that deeply there's all sorts of interesting ways that you could spend less time maintaining libraries for other people to not pay you for them.

co_king_3 8mo ago

Nothing has convinced me that Linus Torvalds' approach is justified like the contemporary onslaught of AI spam and idiocy has. AI users should fear verbal abuse and shame.

CoastalCoder 8mo ago
Perhaps a more effective approach would be for their users to face the exact same legal liabilities as if they had hand-written such messages? (Note that I'm only talking about messages that cross the line into legally actionable defamation, threats, etc. I don't mean anything that's merely rude or unpleasant.)
- eshaham78 8mo ago
  [dead]
  - pixl97 8mo ago
    >which would be a tragedy for anonymity. Yea, in this world the cryptography people will be the first with their backs against the wall when the authoritarians of this age decide that us peons no longer need to keep secrets.
- fl0ki 8mo ago
  This is the only way, because anything less would create a loophole where any abuse or slander can be blamed on an agent, without being able to conclusively prove that it was actually written by an agent. (Its operator has access to the same account keys, etc)
- chasd00 8mo ago
  just put no agent produced code in the Code of Conduct document. People are use to getting shot into space for violating that thing little file. Point to the violation and ban the contributor forever and that will be that.
- intended 8mo ago
  I’d hazard that the legal system is going to grind to a halt. Nothing can bridge the gap between content generating capability and verification effort.