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I don't agree that EVs are worse for the environment than ICE cars. But I don't want to digress. My point isn't about a specific policy (carbon tax sounds reaso

I don't agree that EVs are worse for the environment than ICE cars. But I don't want to digress. My point isn't about a specific policy (carbon tax sounds reasonable to me, and I agree that it is/was a conservative idea). My point is about how to accomplish the goal. If we care about climate change, how do we get political agreement? The only way is to find a deal that persuadable liberals and persuadable conservatives can agree on. I still believe that if the West had built proportionally as many nuclear power plants as France, we would be in much better shape. But environmental activists fought them and here we are. I think Elon going to the Trump side was another tragedy, mostly because of what it did to EV adoption, but also because it empowered the Republicans who deny climate change and reject solutions. I don't think you can claim that Elon's turn was good for liberals or for climate action. These are two examples of climate action advocates pushing for policies that made the climate worse.

scoofy 8mo ago
>My point is about how to accomplish the goal. If we care about climate change, how do we get political agreement? The only way is to find a deal that persuadable liberals and persuadable conservatives can agree on. You can't. Liberals aren't going to kowtow to the American right (I don't even want to use small "c" conservative here because fighting climate change is a conservative position). At every point along the way it's made sense -- long term -- to fight climate change, and at every point the right has veto power Look, I've always defended Elon Musk, even after he aligned himself with the hard right. By making EV's "acceptable" to the right, he changed the political alignment on the carbon issue, and he deserves credit there. Even in blue states, with people assert that they are concerned about climate change we have much of the left states doubling down on sprawl as housing policy. We have people doing everything they can to signal that they care about climate, without being willing to give up their gas stove when given subsidies. We're not even winning the argument very well with our allies. Politics is hard, even when people are open to being reasonable.
- GMoromisato 8mo ago
  100% agree. But that's why I'm trying to convince liberals (I'm in California, FWIW) that they need a new strategy to stop climate change.
scoofy 8mo ago
Oh look what happened today: https://www.nytimes.com/2026/02/12/climate/trump-epa-greenhouse-gases-climate-change.html https://www.nytimes.com/2026/02/12/climate/trump-epa-greenho... Saying this is our fault for not being "nicer" is an absurdity. This is being done intentionally.
- GMoromisato 8mo ago
  My point isn't about blame, it's about what should we do differently. And I'm focusing on the left because the left is the side that cares most about climate change. I'm suggesting that the things the left has done to fight climate change have not only not worked but have made things worse (in the sense that the electorate is so polarized). If blaming Elon or Trump or conservatives in general could solve climate change, then it would have been solved. That's why I'm not interested in blame--not because they don't deserve it but because it's not going to help.

scoofy 8mo ago

>My point is about how to accomplish the goal. If we care about climate change, how do we get political agreement? The only way is to find a deal that persuadable liberals and persuadable conservatives can agree on. You can't. Liberals aren't going to kowtow to the American right (I don't even want to use small "c" conservative here because fighting climate change is a conservative position). At every point along the way it's made sense -- long term -- to fight climate change, and at every point the right has veto power Look, I've always defended Elon Musk, even after he aligned himself with the hard right. By making EV's "acceptable" to the right, he changed the political alignment on the carbon issue, and he deserves credit there. Even in blue states, with people assert that they are concerned about climate change we have much of the left states doubling down on sprawl as housing policy. We have people doing everything they can to signal that they care about climate, without being willing to give up their gas stove when given subsidies. We're not even winning the argument very well with our allies. Politics is hard, even when people are open to being reasonable.

GMoromisato 8mo ago
100% agree. But that's why I'm trying to convince liberals (I'm in California, FWIW) that they need a new strategy to stop climate change.

scoofy 8mo ago

Oh look what happened today: https://www.nytimes.com/2026/02/12/climate/trump-epa-greenhouse-gases-climate-change.html https://www.nytimes.com/2026/02/12/climate/trump-epa-greenho... Saying this is our fault for not being "nicer" is an absurdity. This is being done intentionally.

GMoromisato 8mo ago
My point isn't about blame, it's about what should we do differently. And I'm focusing on the left because the left is the side that cares most about climate change. I'm suggesting that the things the left has done to fight climate change have not only not worked but have made things worse (in the sense that the electorate is so polarized). If blaming Elon or Trump or conservatives in general could solve climate change, then it would have been solved. That's why I'm not interested in blame--not because they don't deserve it but because it's not going to help.