7 ms·

Lost Soviet Moon Lander May Have Been Found

110 points by Brajeshwar 9mo ago

moebrowne 9mo ago
https://archive.is/pqiyD https://archive.is/pqiyD
- garyfirestorm 9mo ago
  Gift article link https://www.nytimes.com/2026/02/10/science/luna-9-moon-lander-soviet.html?unlocked_article_code=1.MlA.NVvz.Gr2Mx44cV-Ti&smid=nytcore-ios-share https://www.nytimes.com/2026/02/10/science/luna-9-moon-lande...
fireflymetavrse 9mo ago
The word "lost" is a little bit confusing in this context. It successfully landed and operated several days, but it's location was only approximated. We've seen landers in recent years that crashed unintentionally in precise known locations. Does this mean that they were not lost?
- newsclues 9mo ago
  Lost can be not knowing where something is or to no longer have it.
  - ggm 9mo ago
    "Lost at sea" and "lost with all hands" exemplifying a ship sinking, precision to place is neither denied nor supplied. It's a net loss to the fleet, the shareholders and the insurer. And of course wives and children.
    - deleted 9mo ago
      [deleted]
- clort 9mo ago
  Yes. Generally, if you know where it is, it is not lost. If you don't then it is. But, it also depends if you want to know where it is. If you don't know where something is and don't want to, its not lost its discarded.
  - ultratalk 9mo ago
    Another usage of the word "lost" is to indicate when the spacecraft has become dysfunctional. Although, that one is the verb form, not the adjective.
- bloak 9mo ago
  Yes, the word "lost" is ambiguous, but I didn't even notice the ambiguity until you pointed it out. I think the presence of the word "found" in the same sentence lead me to assume the "unknown location" sense rather than the "destroyed" sense.
- masterlee_fn 9mo ago
  [dead]
Animats 9mo ago
Someday, someone, or some robot, will find it and ship it back, for museum display.
- CobrastanJorji 9mo ago
  Assuming we have reached a point in time where it makes sense to do that, it may be that it makes more sense to put it in a museum on the moon.
  - blitzar 9mo ago
    Just past the gift shop in the amusement park.
    - pavel_lishin 9mo ago
      We're whalers on the moon... we carry a harpoon...
      - blitzar 9mo ago
        But there ain't no whales so we tell tall tales and sing a whaling tune.
  - alexey-salmin 9mo ago
    I hope for the same, but it's based on the assumption that space exploration will be human-driven. Unfortunately it's possible that it will be robot-driven instead and museums will stay on earth.
    - CableNinja 9mo ago
      I seriously doubt we will stay on earth like that. Humans have always been explorers and pioneers. You can only look at something through a screen for so long before you get the itch that you cant scratch through a screen. Humans will inevitably leave this planet. Robots on other planets is a rough process. Most planets, lacking atmosphere, have dust that gets EVERYWHERE, and its really bad for mechanical, electrical operations. The moon has a static charge that causes the regolith powder to seep into the smallest cracks. Humanoid robots will not last long, and all other forms are just a single failure from uselessness. Until they can either self-repair, or repair others (meaning n+1 minimum robots sent), it will not be useful for long exploration. And, honestly, id be pretty worried to find robots that could self-repair or repair others. Thats just a small step away from self-replication, and that leads down other scary paths.
Cthulhu_ 9mo ago
How come there's not more sattelites around the moon taking high resolution, high zoom photos to for example find this object? We can see beachball-sized objects on consumer-available photos (e.g. google maps/earth), and that's from over 100 km up through an atmosphere. I guess the answer is "nobody paid for it" but still. There's google maps for the moon (https://www.google.com/maps/space/moon https://www.google.com/maps/space/moon) but I'm not sure what resolution that is.
- eps 9mo ago
  > that's from over 100 km up through an atmosphere Could be from atmospheric fly-overs.
- thinkingemote 9mo ago
  Most high resolution "satellite" imagery on Google Maps etc is actually stitched from photographs taken from cameras attached to small aeroplanes which fly at a low altitude even compared to commercial flights let alone 100km. There are a few high resolution satellites but there frame is very small and not suited for complete coverage. If they are geostationary they cant look anywhere, or they have to look at an angle giving oblique photos. If they are moving then they are only over the part of the earth once per several days (weeks/months?) So while these images of the landers are from a satellite orbiting the moon, the satellite is orbiting with an eccentric polar orbit, and the images it takes may be perfect for it's mission but might not be good enough to identify small 1960's landers.
  - zokier 9mo ago
    > There are a few high resolution satellites but there frame is very small and not suited for complete coverage. If they are geostationary they cant look anywhere, or they have to look at an angle giving oblique photos. If they are moving then they are only over the part of the earth once per several days (weeks/months?) Pleiades Neo advertises 30cm resolution with possibility for twice a day visits for a location. They are operating on sun-synchronous orbits with afaik global coverage. They also advertise that they can capture up to 2 million km² daily. So Earth imaging satellites are pretty good these days. That being said, it is true that Google Maps etc heavily rely on aerial imagery instead of satellites. Airbus does have some sample images available on their website if you want to see what actual satellite imagery looks like: https://space-solutions.airbus.com/resources/satellite-image-gallery/?title=hd15 https://space-solutions.airbus.com/resources/satellite-image...
Jacques2Marais 9mo ago
'“One of them is wrong,” an expert said.'
- pansa2 9mo ago
  At least one of them is wrong
- dredmorbius 9mo ago
  Shades of "Industrial Disease": Two men say they're Jesus, one of them must be wrong <https://genius.com/Dire-straits-industrial-disease-lyrics https://genius.com/Dire-straits-industrial-disease-lyrics>
nasretdinov 9mo ago
Zeleniykot is a name I haven't heard in a while! From Russian it means "green cat", he used to write really good articles about spave on Habr, good job continuing the work!
wiseowise 9mo ago
Still baffles me how did Russian Empire/Soviets come from this to being a petty regional player who can barely take on a much weaker neighbor and being fully dependent on China.
- RaccoonAttack 9mo ago
  Neighbor was Soviet too.
- Luc 9mo ago
  The Soviets tried to transition from an economy focused on war and heavy industry to a consumer oriented economy, and they failed massively. See the book 'Building a ruin'.
  - ptero 9mo ago
    They never actually put a full effort into building a consumer oriented economy. The authorities would say something about a new food program or a housing program but only as motivational goals. Main players always saw getting people less economically dependent on the state as a major threat. Making people economically miserable was never a goal, but when building consumer economy would start showing promise the state would reestablish control (see for example Kosygin reforms).
    - philistine 9mo ago
      Exactly; the Soviet Union famously tried to reform its political institutions before reforming its economy. The Chinese looked at that and decided never to reform their political system.
  - Quarrel 9mo ago
    I'm not sure the Soviets ultimately ever really tried to make the transition, when confronted with the reality that the ruling dogma that they represented no longer worked, they couldn't handle the collapses in the periphery. Also see the 'lost years' of the Japanese economy, or the Chinese as they try to make the transition now. It is terribly hard, but the USSR had their heads well in the sand at that point.
metalman 9mo ago
missions to examine space craft that have been in space/moon for decades could be quite profitable, as these will provide engineering feedback as to what parts are still operable and how things failed and what might be done to effect repairs, as this is how aviation reached the level of reliability that it enjoys today, but with space bieng even less forgiving. We are getting lots of data about operations in LEO, and some from Mars, but the moon is tough, too much dust,no atmosphere, not enough gravity, and very wide temperiture/radiation swings that last for weeks,and actualy more difficult to build for than mars or leo.
sponno 9mo ago
@rainbolt

110 points by Brajeshwar 9mo ago

moebrowne 9mo ago

https://archive.is/pqiyD https://archive.is/pqiyD

garyfirestorm 9mo ago
Gift article link https://www.nytimes.com/2026/02/10/science/luna-9-moon-lander-soviet.html?unlocked_article_code=1.MlA.NVvz.Gr2Mx44cV-Ti&smid=nytcore-ios-share https://www.nytimes.com/2026/02/10/science/luna-9-moon-lande...

fireflymetavrse 9mo ago

The word "lost" is a little bit confusing in this context. It successfully landed and operated several days, but it's location was only approximated. We've seen landers in recent years that crashed unintentionally in precise known locations. Does this mean that they were not lost?

newsclues 9mo ago
Lost can be not knowing where something is or to no longer have it.
- ggm 9mo ago
  "Lost at sea" and "lost with all hands" exemplifying a ship sinking, precision to place is neither denied nor supplied. It's a net loss to the fleet, the shareholders and the insurer. And of course wives and children.
  - deleted 9mo ago
    [deleted]
clort 9mo ago
Yes. Generally, if you know where it is, it is not lost. If you don't then it is. But, it also depends if you want to know where it is. If you don't know where something is and don't want to, its not lost its discarded.
- ultratalk 9mo ago
  Another usage of the word "lost" is to indicate when the spacecraft has become dysfunctional. Although, that one is the verb form, not the adjective.
bloak 9mo ago
Yes, the word "lost" is ambiguous, but I didn't even notice the ambiguity until you pointed it out. I think the presence of the word "found" in the same sentence lead me to assume the "unknown location" sense rather than the "destroyed" sense.
masterlee_fn 9mo ago
[dead]

Animats 9mo ago

Someday, someone, or some robot, will find it and ship it back, for museum display.

CobrastanJorji 9mo ago
Assuming we have reached a point in time where it makes sense to do that, it may be that it makes more sense to put it in a museum on the moon.
- blitzar 9mo ago
  Just past the gift shop in the amusement park.
  - pavel_lishin 9mo ago
    We're whalers on the moon... we carry a harpoon...
    - blitzar 9mo ago
      But there ain't no whales so we tell tall tales and sing a whaling tune.
- alexey-salmin 9mo ago
  I hope for the same, but it's based on the assumption that space exploration will be human-driven. Unfortunately it's possible that it will be robot-driven instead and museums will stay on earth.
  - CableNinja 9mo ago
    I seriously doubt we will stay on earth like that. Humans have always been explorers and pioneers. You can only look at something through a screen for so long before you get the itch that you cant scratch through a screen. Humans will inevitably leave this planet. Robots on other planets is a rough process. Most planets, lacking atmosphere, have dust that gets EVERYWHERE, and its really bad for mechanical, electrical operations. The moon has a static charge that causes the regolith powder to seep into the smallest cracks. Humanoid robots will not last long, and all other forms are just a single failure from uselessness. Until they can either self-repair, or repair others (meaning n+1 minimum robots sent), it will not be useful for long exploration. And, honestly, id be pretty worried to find robots that could self-repair or repair others. Thats just a small step away from self-replication, and that leads down other scary paths.

Cthulhu_ 9mo ago

How come there's not more sattelites around the moon taking high resolution, high zoom photos to for example find this object? We can see beachball-sized objects on consumer-available photos (e.g. google maps/earth), and that's from over 100 km up through an atmosphere. I guess the answer is "nobody paid for it" but still. There's google maps for the moon (https://www.google.com/maps/space/moon https://www.google.com/maps/space/moon) but I'm not sure what resolution that is.

eps 9mo ago
> that's from over 100 km up through an atmosphere Could be from atmospheric fly-overs.
thinkingemote 9mo ago
Most high resolution "satellite" imagery on Google Maps etc is actually stitched from photographs taken from cameras attached to small aeroplanes which fly at a low altitude even compared to commercial flights let alone 100km. There are a few high resolution satellites but there frame is very small and not suited for complete coverage. If they are geostationary they cant look anywhere, or they have to look at an angle giving oblique photos. If they are moving then they are only over the part of the earth once per several days (weeks/months?) So while these images of the landers are from a satellite orbiting the moon, the satellite is orbiting with an eccentric polar orbit, and the images it takes may be perfect for it's mission but might not be good enough to identify small 1960's landers.
- zokier 9mo ago
  > There are a few high resolution satellites but there frame is very small and not suited for complete coverage. If they are geostationary they cant look anywhere, or they have to look at an angle giving oblique photos. If they are moving then they are only over the part of the earth once per several days (weeks/months?) Pleiades Neo advertises 30cm resolution with possibility for twice a day visits for a location. They are operating on sun-synchronous orbits with afaik global coverage. They also advertise that they can capture up to 2 million km² daily. So Earth imaging satellites are pretty good these days. That being said, it is true that Google Maps etc heavily rely on aerial imagery instead of satellites. Airbus does have some sample images available on their website if you want to see what actual satellite imagery looks like: https://space-solutions.airbus.com/resources/satellite-image-gallery/?title=hd15 https://space-solutions.airbus.com/resources/satellite-image...

Jacques2Marais 9mo ago

'“One of them is wrong,” an expert said.'

pansa2 9mo ago
At least one of them is wrong
dredmorbius 9mo ago
Shades of "Industrial Disease": Two men say they're Jesus, one of them must be wrong <https://genius.com/Dire-straits-industrial-disease-lyrics https://genius.com/Dire-straits-industrial-disease-lyrics>

nasretdinov 9mo ago

Zeleniykot is a name I haven't heard in a while! From Russian it means "green cat", he used to write really good articles about spave on Habr, good job continuing the work!

wiseowise 9mo ago

Still baffles me how did Russian Empire/Soviets come from this to being a petty regional player who can barely take on a much weaker neighbor and being fully dependent on China.

RaccoonAttack 9mo ago
Neighbor was Soviet too.
Luc 9mo ago
The Soviets tried to transition from an economy focused on war and heavy industry to a consumer oriented economy, and they failed massively. See the book 'Building a ruin'.
- ptero 9mo ago
  They never actually put a full effort into building a consumer oriented economy. The authorities would say something about a new food program or a housing program but only as motivational goals. Main players always saw getting people less economically dependent on the state as a major threat. Making people economically miserable was never a goal, but when building consumer economy would start showing promise the state would reestablish control (see for example Kosygin reforms).
  - philistine 9mo ago
    Exactly; the Soviet Union famously tried to reform its political institutions before reforming its economy. The Chinese looked at that and decided never to reform their political system.
- Quarrel 9mo ago
  I'm not sure the Soviets ultimately ever really tried to make the transition, when confronted with the reality that the ruling dogma that they represented no longer worked, they couldn't handle the collapses in the periphery. Also see the 'lost years' of the Japanese economy, or the Chinese as they try to make the transition now. It is terribly hard, but the USSR had their heads well in the sand at that point.

metalman 9mo ago

missions to examine space craft that have been in space/moon for decades could be quite profitable, as these will provide engineering feedback as to what parts are still operable and how things failed and what might be done to effect repairs, as this is how aviation reached the level of reliability that it enjoys today, but with space bieng even less forgiving. We are getting lots of data about operations in LEO, and some from Mars, but the moon is tough, too much dust,no atmosphere, not enough gravity, and very wide temperiture/radiation swings that last for weeks,and actualy more difficult to build for than mars or leo.

sponno 9mo ago

@rainbolt