5 ms·
Evolution of car door handles over the decades
- mcculley 9mo agoI am bemused every time I use Uber and the car has some flush-mounted door handle that I have to figure out. When exiting the car and closing the door, I end up leaving fingerprints I would not have left if the handle had been designed by someone who had been in a car before.
- jjtheblunt 9mo agoagreed on fingerprints, though i bet the rationale is coefficient of drag, not lack of experience with various door handle designs. in the article, it shows a Magna-Steyr handle on a Mercedes Gelaendewagen, which looks like those on the Ineos Grenadier, and not very different than the ones that Ford uses on various trucks. that contrasts with those on Audi and BMW evs, for examples i see often, where the CoD is a stated spec for ev shoppers, and the handles have motion to them, but are flush (but not Tesla vanishingly flush). Weirdly, some Porsches (intimately related to Audi...just read the shared parts) use flush handles and some the protruding handles with an actual handle. i admittedly pay an unusual amount of attention to car componentry, sort of a hobby really.
- AlotOfReading 9mo agoThe additional drag is negligible. People have been producing "racing doors" with handles for decades. They focus on cutting all the other features of the door like weight and mechanical complexity instead. It's an even more irrelevant consideration for consumers, who could save far more fuel by changing how they drive. Flush handles exist as brand differentiators. They're a "futuristic" feel-good feature that consumers want, like engine noise, tablets, and colorful dashboards.
- recursive 9mo ago> It's an even more irrelevant consideration for consumers, who could save far more fuel by changing how they drive. These are not in conflict. The energy you save from drag stacks with the energy you save from "learning how to drive".
- hshdhdhj4444 9mo agoYeah, but making opening doors a puzzle to solve is an incredibly terrible trade off. And that’s before we consider the other aspects of these door handle designs that make the cars a death trap.
- kube-system 9mo agoThey add a tiny bit to the efficiency and/or range, they look cool (e.g. serve a gee-whiz marketing purpose), and safety evaluations in the markets where they still exist don't penalize them -- up until now they've had very little against them. Maybe as legal and reputational backlash spreads the pros will not outweigh the cons. But someone designing a car a decade ago, marketed towards early adopter types, would have had no reason not to. And I say this as someone who hates these handles designs personally.
- recursive 9mo agoThe death trap claims come from the internal affordance, which seems to be totally independent from the exterior one. I have a car with a "novel" handle situation. (Ford Mustand Mach E) The door is operable from the inside with a dead battery. Maybe this particular one isn't as challenging as some of the other designs, but calling it a "puzzle" definitely overstates the case. I think it took me maybe 4 seconds to figure out the first time.
- kevin_thibedeau 9mo agoThe Xiaomi SU7 has notably threatened the lives of many of its occupants because rescuers couldn't open the doors from the outside after power loss from a crash or fire. This car is partly responsible for China's new safety regulation banning flush handles.
- kube-system 9mo agoAll of the things you mention are considerations that every automaker considers. Product design engineering is simply an exercise in weighting those factors, among many others.
- AlotOfReading 9mo agoI'm saying flush handles aren't about drag, not passing judgement on whether those other factors are bad.
- kube-system 9mo agoDrag is absolutely one of those factors. Yes, it only contributes a small amount to the overall drag profile of the vehicle, but a vehicle is a sum of its parts ultimately.
- AlotOfReading 9mo agoIt's not a meaningful factor in decisionmaking. Manufacturers went on an aerodynamics optimization spree in the 80s after the fuel crisis. Concepts like the Ford Probe actually dropped handles and all other protruding surfaces in favor of things like electrical touch panels. Seriously, go look at the photos. Even the pillars are flush. The production vehicles designed after these concepts often used flush pull-up handles for aerodynamics. Those handles later disappeared in favor of the more reliable pull-bar handles we're familiar with because improved CFD made it clear how minimal their benefit actually was for the tradeoffs. Of course, even if we accept that all the mechanical complexity of flush handles is necessary for aerodynamic reasons, it's not the only alternative to pull-bars. Look at the Volvo EX60 for an example. Designing a flush handle is hard. Tesla spent years working on it. It's not something undertaken for negligible aerodynamic benefits.
- jjtheblunt 9mo agoWhat tradeoff is there between pull-up and pull-out handles?
- WalterBright 9mo agoPeople who race stock cars will even dip body panels into acid to make the panels thinner. Anything to reduce weight!
- zamadatix 9mo agoIt's about more than just one thing alone. E.g. https://media.landrover.com/new-range-rover-sport-press-kit-performance-chapter#:~:text=These%20include%20the%20flush%20glazing%20and%20door%20handles%2C https://media.landrover.com/new-range-rover-sport-press-kit-... https://usa.infinitinews.com/en-US/releases/2025-qx80-press-kit#:~:text=result%20in%20a%20cleaner%2C%20tidier%20appearance%20and%20contribute%20to%20improvements%20in%20QX80%27s%20aerodynamic%20performance. https://usa.infinitinews.com/en-US/releases/2025-qx80-press-...
- aziaziazi 9mo agoI'm unsure manufacturer's press kits are to be taken as an honest source of information : the goal of the authors is to make people love a brand, buy a product... but not to educate, share objective information or strategic choices.
- AlotOfReading 9mo agoThey're not, but range rover actually published an aerodynamic study in SAE mobilus recently. They mention the door handles as part of the product design vision and offhandedly mention it's one of multiple changes that help ensure the flows coming off the front arches don't break up as they move down. They don't bother to single it out though, or even give numbers for the effect of the group (unlike more significant improvements).
- acdha 9mo agoThey’re also selling a massive vehicle which was designed for macho aesthetics rather than performance. Bragging about minor aerodynamic tweaks is how they convince buyers that it’s okay to spend even more money to take the edge off of that fashion decision. It’s like the places which brag about their single use plastic using some recycled material because they don’t want to say it’d be even better if you bought something which could be reused many times instead.
- zamadatix 9mo agoVery peculiarly, everyone seems to actually agree the handles are a little more aerodynamic. It's the possibility the manufacturer's teams (except marketing, apparently) could ever have also considered this as one of several benefits when choosing the design which is at such levels of doubt. Moreso, people are willing to dismiss it saying they'd want a certain type of source instead rather than just seeing whether that kind of source does also agree. To complete the loop on the latter: Tesla's 2012 handle patent https://patents.google.com/patent/US9103143B2/en https://patents.google.com/patent/US9103143B2/en > Conventional door handle designs typically have less than desirable aerodynamics due to protrusion of the exterior door handle from the surface of the door and the recessed area over which it spans. As the vehicle moves, these conventional door handles interrupt the smooth surface of the door and thereby increase the overall drag of the vehicle. Depending on the size, depth, and overall shape of the recessed area, for example, the corresponding area under the door handle further contributes to reduced aerodynamics of the vehicle. Designers have not focused on improving aerodynamics in this area as the exterior door handle seems relatively small and inconsequential. > 104 in the retracted position provides both a smooth appearance and advantageous aerodynamic qualities when the vehicle is in motion I'm starting to wonder if an interview with David Wheeler (what a name for a car patent) et al would even be believed here at this point.
- PearlRiver 9mo agoExactly it is not science but purely cosmetic. Which for some reason makes HN mad but guess what people choose cars based on how they look and how they are marketed! There has never been a rational man. Spock is not real.
- seanmcdirmid 9mo ago> Flush handles exist as brand differentiators. They're a "futuristic" feel-good feature that consumers want, like engine noise, tablets, and colorful dashboards. Incorrect. They are most definitely there to save money on production and development costs, like all the other stuff you misattribute to brand differentiators. Consumers like lower prices, car companies like more profit. Yes, it looks fancy, but it is cheaper to produce, judt like the tablet dash.
- AlotOfReading 9mo agoLiterally none of those are cost savings. Touchscreens are, relative to buttons, but not relative to small touchscreens (what I was actually comparing to). I'm not sure a flush handle is actually cheaper either. The only real difference is the metal bits that connect to the latch assembly. One goes to the interior lever, one to the exterior, and one has the lock pin. A cost-optimized flush handle gets rid of those in exchange for a motor/encoder unit. The expensive parts of the latch mechanism remain basically identical since it has to be a giant chunk of metal for safety reasons. Maybe the handle differences make up for it, but I'd want to see numbers given that it's made its way onto high end cars first.
- seanmcdirmid 9mo agoNo, really, think about it. A touch screen is literally one component plus a computer you need anyways. Buttons need scaffolding, they need to be wired, etc. If you are designing a new car today, figuring out where all those buttons go for each model is a chore, it makes production more complicated, it requires more logistics vs just a touch screen. Flush handles have to do with creating a recess in the body for normal handles. It’s just easier to cut a hole. I’m guessing you aren’t willing to consider that the car companies are just being thrifty rather than extravagant, but ya, it’s a win win for them if they can save on costs at the same time as being seen as fancy.
- AlotOfReading 9mo agoI’m guessing you aren’t willing to consider that the car companies are just being thrifty rather than extravagant I work in the industry, I'm well aware. It's an eternal thorn in my side. A touch screen is literally one component plus a computer you need anyways. Not true, and BOM cost isn't the only consideration in manufacturing costs. As I've said in many previous HN threads, the big win for touchscreens is actually on the project scheduling side. That's neither here nor there because my original comment was about the centrally mounted, massive touchscreen a la Tesla as opposed to a smaller, integrated touchscreen. Not buttons vs. touchscreen. Flush handles have to do with creating a recess in the body for normal handles. It’s just easier to cut a hole. That part of a door is manufactured with a series of presses. Whether it's one hole or 16 doesn't make much difference because they're cut all at once.
- recursive 9mo agoThose that care about fingerprints on their car seem like they're different people from those that drive for Uber.
- chankstein38 9mo agoOr someone who had to open their own car door before lol
- lylejantzi3rd 9mo agoThis is a great video by SuperfastMatt on the engineering behind and evolution of the Tesla door handle. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bea4FS-zDzc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bea4FS-zDzc
- VladVladikoff 9mo agoEven in the new version it seems like there is no fallback method for a failure.
- rkagerer 9mo agoI'm convinced it isn't rocket science to design a flush handle that looks as clean yet has a manual operation fallback (preferably mechanical). Eg. Something like an integral hinge where you can push the short, base end in to pop the release (provided car is unlocked). IMO their handles are stupidly over-engineered. It shows when you get problems like ice, etc. in northern climates.
- adastra22 9mo agoI don't want my door handle to look clean. I want it to be something I can quickly and easily grab and pull.
- mandeepj 9mo ago> evolution of the Tesla door handle I really like Tesla's approach to door handles - it's clean, polished, and gives a fine and smooth look. But was surprised to learn that China will ban them beginning next year. Other countries might follow suit as well. https://www.cbsnews.com/news/china-hidden-door-handles-cars-ban-starting-2027-safety-concerns/ https://www.cbsnews.com/news/china-hidden-door-handles-cars-...
- napierzaza 9mo ago[dead]
- 9mo ago
- amiga386 9mo agoSee also: China bans hidden car door handles over safety concerns https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cp37g5nxe3lo https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cp37g5nxe3lo > It comes as EVs are facing scrutiny from safety watchdogs around the world after a number of deadly incidents, including two fatal crashes in China involving Xiaomi EVs in which power failures were suspected to have prevented doors from being opened. You had one job, door handles... but being made sleek and sexy and unlike normal door handles also made you a fucking liability.
- pixl97 9mo agoPeople wonder "Why is there a law for this stupid thing, it's a regulatory hassle", and yet time and time again it comes around there was at least some partially legitimate reason said rule exists. Simply put vehicles are at the point where we need a rule that says "The doors can be unlocked and open if the battery is dead" Full stop, no ifs, ands, or buts.
- cucumber3732842 9mo agoIt is not the government's job to enumerate every specific brand of stupid design that may be harmful multiplied by every class of product nor should it be. If you want to do that stuff, do it with a performance test or criteria, not with stupid whack-a-mole rules. And don't think that weasel wording the test to the same effect is any better. If you want to do this the not stupid way you need to actually do the hard work and figure out what the over-arching general case performance characteristics need to be. With better styling cues and design that make it obvious how to use the Tesla handles (and all the degrees of copycats) it wouldn't be an issue. But that isn't the kind of sleek sext angular bullshit modern car designers like so it never got made and here we are.
- csours 9mo agoGame it out - if you issue guidelines, people abuse them, then government agencies get in trouble (isn't it your job to stop this kind of thing?), so government agencies issue strict rules. Bureaucracies have many fathers, the society we have is the result of conflict and incentives.
- boatloof 9mo agoThe mechanical flush mount car door handles are because shaping that divot into the steel is much more complicated then punching a hole, and especially aluminum is many times more complicated and expensive. Audi was showing off their technical expertise with creasing aluminum with unlimited money in their bodywork before dieselgate, and that was pretty much peak for car body technology.
- cafard 9mo agoKids today miss the chagrin of damaging a protruding door handle, and the entertainment of one of their elders entirely removing one against some obstacle.
- RickJWagner 9mo agoWhen I was about 20, I had a well used AMC Spirit. Stylish, good gas mileage, decent performance, it was a great car. It had one fatal flaw, a weak linkage in the drivers door handle. The linkage included a small plastic clip that didn’t quite align properly. It would pop out of place periodically, making the door impossible to open. I became adept at taking apart the door from the inside and popping the pieces back into place. I once returned to my college dorm after a snowstorm, the car got stuck in the snow. I had another trick for this situation, I’d ease the clutch out ( leaving the back tires spinning slowly ) and would exit the car, pushing it by hand. When the wheels caught and the car started creeping forward I’d jump back in and drive off. ( Foolish, I know. I was 20. ) Well, once I had both mishaps at once. The car got stuck, so I got out to push. The door handle broke, locking me out of my car with the engine running and the wheels slowly turning! Praying fervently, I ran to my dorm room, got my spare key and went in through the passenger door to stop the engine. It was a memorable day.
- VladVladikoff 9mo agoWebsite crashes mobile safari? Edit: correction it seems to be crashing on my adblock.
- jiehong 9mo agoNice, but it would have been better with more pictures to match the description IMO
- garciansmith 9mo agoThis article contains a nice chart of different types: https://www.theautopian.com/what-is-the-goat-door-handle-design/ https://www.theautopian.com/what-is-the-goat-door-handle-des...
- jacobgkau 9mo agoI was expecting some mention of the Dutch Reach (internal handles that are sort of backwards to force car users to look in the direction of possible approaching pedestrians or bicycles behind them while opening their door), but I guess the article's focus wasn't quite on that type of detail.
- eth0up 9mo agoI've a bone to pick with the title, which euphemises degradation. If they evolved, one might assume they'd survive more than a few years. My last two vehicles have been Toyota and Hyundai, both of them having multiple broken and malfunctioning door handles. Every time I get into a commercial* or antique vehicle, I long for the solidity, surety and hardness of the dark ages when things were built to last. Driving semis, I'm well acquainted with automobile 'evolution', and all but a few are hardly worth entering. UPS trucks, Mac, some others still make stuff for adults, but International, Peterbilt, even Kenworth are using sillyputty for parts. Consumer vehicles, to me, are the antithesis of evolution. And for all the wondrous eco tech, their merit is contested by landfills, downtime and piles of repair receipts. Not that eco couldn't work, but the way it's been introduced, in the US, has been replete with cut corners and outright scams. An old truck pre-DEF still runs far more reliably than anything new on the road. Volvo has done reasonably well with trucks, but no new truck can stand to the old ones. CAT! Door handles are symptomatic of the disposable infrastructure we've built our new country on, and come hard times, when folks can no longer afford a new HVAC system every 8 years at 12 grand, coupled with everything else falling apart around us, we'll be longing for the dark ages again. Thankfully it's not everything. I just bought a pair of Knipex pliers, which should make it well through the century. For the young, or majority I presume, if you can suspend your contempt of a less fuel efficient steel monstrosity, hop into an old vehicle from the 70s or earlier. Close your eyes if needed, but just feel around a bit. You'll feel honest engineering. Not as safe, but there's something obnoxious anyway about being too safe and cozy trundling around in a big bulbous plastic bubble. We didn't always drive unaffordable fluorescent pillows.
- napierzaza 9mo ago[dead]
- pss314 9mo agoBloomberg Originals had recently published a video "The Dangerous Feature in Tesla's Doors" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2lFzqBt3z0w https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2lFzqBt3z0w
- b00ty4breakfast 9mo agopurely a matter of aesthetic preference, but I miss when the handle was literally just a handle and a big old chunky button is what operated the latching mechanism
- TacticalCoder 9mo agoFun fact: a great many key fobs have --and many owners have zero idea about it-- a physical backup key. The problem is that the key is so well "hidden" inside the key fob that most simply don't know it. For example on many Porsche models, it's impossible to access the physical key inside the key fob without first removing the key ring (a very smart design btw: you cannot accidentally lose the spare key for it's "held" by the key ring): most owners literally don't know they have a spare physical key. BMW owners often find out they have a spare key when the key fob separate, for no reason, from the physical key (those keyfobs tend to be extremely badly designed, where the plastic knobs holding the physical key tend to become loose with age). A spare physical key of course means that the door handle has a lock that can be opened with the key. Wife is stuck under pouring rain with the battery of her BMW's keyfob that died (because she didn't pay attention to the message on the dashboard saying it needs replacing): "Please come pick me up" / "Babe, take the physical key, open the door, start your car with the physical key, come back home and I'll go buy a new battery and place it into your keyfob". > More recently, there's been a trend of “suck-in” handles that are flush with the body. As noted earlier, flush handles come in two basic varieties. Handles flush with the body are nothing new that said. I've got a car from 1992 (model came out in 1989) with flush handles.
- anarticle 9mo agoSince we're on door handle memory lane, I was a huge fan of used Volvos when I was in my 20s, had a 740 and an 850. I loved the trigger 740 handle and the 850s whole handle pull. I'm sure they were complex and expensive to replace, but if it's made right the first time you won't have to. I had over 200k on the Volvo before I sold it which it felt like the same car I bought 6y ago.
- egberts1 9mo agoUmmm, hidden door handle, nope. Bring back window-opener crank handles. And ditch the touch-surface of the LCD screen too.