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He also died from a bullet to the head and 60 years later a statement as simple as 'black lives matter' was controversial.

tptacek 9mo ago
Nonviolence was never proposed as a shield for activists against violence. He knew what he was up against.
- dripdry45 9mo ago
  not so sure he did. Both King and X were “allowed” to speak out as much as they wanted… until each of them, realize the war they were fighting was not the real war. The real war was against the rich. Once Malcolm realized this, and that he was being played, and once MLK realized that non-violence was BS he started to drift more toward Malcolm’s end of things and direct that anger toward class warfare? That’s when they were each killed.
SV_BubbleTime 9mo ago
[flagged]
- dpc050505 9mo ago
  It was a bad faith argument to shut down discourse about summary executions of black men in the streets of the USA. It's been about 10 days since they executed a white soccer mom who had not committed any crime, the people who were harping on about 'All lives matter' are still no where to be found. The whole time it was empty rhetoric, people who care about human life understand that sometimes there's a group in particular being oppressed.
  - SV_BubbleTime 9mo ago
    [flagged]
    - lovich 9mo ago
      The linked tweet > BREAKING: The ICE agent who fatally shot Renee Good on Jan. 7 in Minneapolis, Jonathan Ross, suffered internal bleeding to the torso following the incident, according to two U.S. officials briefed on his medical condition. That’s just CBS reporting hearsay from non first party sources in an admin that’s been caught directly lying about the events cutting local authorities out of the investigation. > I am not expert, but I can tell you with certainty I would have expected no different outcome in my country. Don’t know which country it is, but it sounds like a shithole country if you’d expect government agents to execute people against their own training, and accept government lies about it.
      - SV_BubbleTime 9mo ago
        Ah… so the media is all “hearsay” say when you don’t like what it says? She hit an agent with her car. She accelerated with him in front of the car BEFORE he drew his gun. Her wife yelled DRIVE BABY, DRIVE DRIVE, then complained why the cops had to use “real bullets”. I see no scenario other than these were two people playing a game and not know that reality wasn’t playing along.
        lovich 9mo ago
        No it’s hearsay when it’s this > …according to two U.S. officials briefed on his medical condition. They are reporting what someone heard and then said, it is not a primary source. Kinda sounds like you disagree with media when you don’t like what it says.
    - watwut 9mo ago
      Nah, he was unharmed and uninjured. If he had bruises a week later, it was not from interaction with good. He murdered her, said "fucking bitch" and walked away. His colleague then prevented a doctor from treating her. Nowedays ICE men reference her murder to threaten protesters.
      - SV_BubbleTime 9mo ago
- CamJN 9mo ago
  Because it was created as a reaction to the Black Lives Matter movement and was designed to imply that the existing status quo, where the USA acts like black lives don’t matter, isn’t a real problem.
  - SV_BubbleTime 9mo ago
    [flagged]
- deleted 9mo ago
  [deleted]
- nathan_compton 9mo ago
  "All Lives Matter" redirects attention away from the specific thing "Black Lives Matter" was meant to draw attention to, which is that, if you are black specifically your chance of getting killed in an interaction with police is higher. There are other racial issues surfaced by black lives matter, as a slogan, eg, having to do with health care, real estate, etc. No one things that all lives don't matter, but the statement "black lives matter" is used to highlight specific social problems in the US. It would be like if you cut your finger and asked for a bandaid for your finger, and someone kept saying, "But ALL your fingers are important."
  - SV_BubbleTime 9mo ago
    > if you are black specifically your chance of getting killed in an interaction with police is higher. Again, not an expert. But, are we talking per police interaction, or per capita, or of all police homicides? Pretty sure when I saw, far more unarmed white people were killed than unarmed black people per year, which per capita makes sense, right? But, isn’t total police interactions more inportant?
    - nathan_compton 9mo ago
      Its very hard to get a sense for this. There are a few papers which indicate that on a per interaction basis, black and latino people are a few percent more likely to end up dead than white people, but that, again, doesn't necessarily mean that police are more disposed to escalate with these two groups. "Criminality" might be higher among some groups than others, and so the context of interactions with police might be different, but, on the other hand, criminality is to some degree socially constructed and is also correlated with economic hardship, which is racialized in the US (and most other places). I'm not really interested in defending some sort of per se percentage of unjust police killings, anyway. I think there is ample enough evidence that racism is still a pretty big issue in the US that the slogan "black lives matter" is at worst harmless and at best communicates something important.
      - refulgentis 9mo ago
- lovich 9mo ago
  Only legitimate crazy people here would have a problem with the sentence “All lives matter.” People have a problem with the slogan “All Lives Matter”, which was made in reaction to “Black Lives Matter”. I don’t know if you are ESL if you aren’t American but the capitalization I used matters and it’s difficult to explain the context of hearing a sentence vs a slogan. That’s also before you get into people specifically trying to conflate them so they can do a sort of motte and bailey type argument by claiming they weren’t saying “All Lives Matter” just that “All lives matter, so they can uno reverse you as the bigot
  - SV_BubbleTime 9mo ago
    [flagged]
bigstrat2003 9mo ago
> a statement as simple as 'black lives matter' was controversial. That was never controversial. What was controversial was the unstated implication after that statement: "and people don't think they do". When your slogan is a false accusation against people in general, they aren't going to take it well. Approximately zero people in the US think black lives don't matter, so they aren't going to appreciate you coming at them with that accusation even if it is left unstated.

tptacek 9mo ago

Nonviolence was never proposed as a shield for activists against violence. He knew what he was up against.

dripdry45 9mo ago
not so sure he did. Both King and X were “allowed” to speak out as much as they wanted… until each of them, realize the war they were fighting was not the real war. The real war was against the rich. Once Malcolm realized this, and that he was being played, and once MLK realized that non-violence was BS he started to drift more toward Malcolm’s end of things and direct that anger toward class warfare? That’s when they were each killed.

SV_BubbleTime 9mo ago

[flagged]

dpc050505 9mo ago
It was a bad faith argument to shut down discourse about summary executions of black men in the streets of the USA. It's been about 10 days since they executed a white soccer mom who had not committed any crime, the people who were harping on about 'All lives matter' are still no where to be found. The whole time it was empty rhetoric, people who care about human life understand that sometimes there's a group in particular being oppressed.
- SV_BubbleTime 9mo ago
  [flagged]
  - lovich 9mo ago
    The linked tweet > BREAKING: The ICE agent who fatally shot Renee Good on Jan. 7 in Minneapolis, Jonathan Ross, suffered internal bleeding to the torso following the incident, according to two U.S. officials briefed on his medical condition. That’s just CBS reporting hearsay from non first party sources in an admin that’s been caught directly lying about the events cutting local authorities out of the investigation. > I am not expert, but I can tell you with certainty I would have expected no different outcome in my country. Don’t know which country it is, but it sounds like a shithole country if you’d expect government agents to execute people against their own training, and accept government lies about it.
    - SV_BubbleTime 9mo ago
      Ah… so the media is all “hearsay” say when you don’t like what it says? She hit an agent with her car. She accelerated with him in front of the car BEFORE he drew his gun. Her wife yelled DRIVE BABY, DRIVE DRIVE, then complained why the cops had to use “real bullets”. I see no scenario other than these were two people playing a game and not know that reality wasn’t playing along.
      - lovich 9mo ago
        No it’s hearsay when it’s this > …according to two U.S. officials briefed on his medical condition. They are reporting what someone heard and then said, it is not a primary source. Kinda sounds like you disagree with media when you don’t like what it says.
  - watwut 9mo ago
    Nah, he was unharmed and uninjured. If he had bruises a week later, it was not from interaction with good. He murdered her, said "fucking bitch" and walked away. His colleague then prevented a doctor from treating her. Nowedays ICE men reference her murder to threaten protesters.
    - SV_BubbleTime 9mo ago
CamJN 9mo ago
Because it was created as a reaction to the Black Lives Matter movement and was designed to imply that the existing status quo, where the USA acts like black lives don’t matter, isn’t a real problem.
- SV_BubbleTime 9mo ago
  [flagged]
deleted 9mo ago
[deleted]
nathan_compton 9mo ago
"All Lives Matter" redirects attention away from the specific thing "Black Lives Matter" was meant to draw attention to, which is that, if you are black specifically your chance of getting killed in an interaction with police is higher. There are other racial issues surfaced by black lives matter, as a slogan, eg, having to do with health care, real estate, etc. No one things that all lives don't matter, but the statement "black lives matter" is used to highlight specific social problems in the US. It would be like if you cut your finger and asked for a bandaid for your finger, and someone kept saying, "But ALL your fingers are important."
- SV_BubbleTime 9mo ago
  > if you are black specifically your chance of getting killed in an interaction with police is higher. Again, not an expert. But, are we talking per police interaction, or per capita, or of all police homicides? Pretty sure when I saw, far more unarmed white people were killed than unarmed black people per year, which per capita makes sense, right? But, isn’t total police interactions more inportant?
  - nathan_compton 9mo ago
    Its very hard to get a sense for this. There are a few papers which indicate that on a per interaction basis, black and latino people are a few percent more likely to end up dead than white people, but that, again, doesn't necessarily mean that police are more disposed to escalate with these two groups. "Criminality" might be higher among some groups than others, and so the context of interactions with police might be different, but, on the other hand, criminality is to some degree socially constructed and is also correlated with economic hardship, which is racialized in the US (and most other places). I'm not really interested in defending some sort of per se percentage of unjust police killings, anyway. I think there is ample enough evidence that racism is still a pretty big issue in the US that the slogan "black lives matter" is at worst harmless and at best communicates something important.
    - refulgentis 9mo ago
lovich 9mo ago
Only legitimate crazy people here would have a problem with the sentence “All lives matter.” People have a problem with the slogan “All Lives Matter”, which was made in reaction to “Black Lives Matter”. I don’t know if you are ESL if you aren’t American but the capitalization I used matters and it’s difficult to explain the context of hearing a sentence vs a slogan. That’s also before you get into people specifically trying to conflate them so they can do a sort of motte and bailey type argument by claiming they weren’t saying “All Lives Matter” just that “All lives matter, so they can uno reverse you as the bigot
- SV_BubbleTime 9mo ago
  [flagged]

bigstrat2003 9mo ago

> a statement as simple as 'black lives matter' was controversial. That was never controversial. What was controversial was the unstated implication after that statement: "and people don't think they do". When your slogan is a false accusation against people in general, they aren't going to take it well. Approximately zero people in the US think black lives don't matter, so they aren't going to appreciate you coming at them with that accusation even if it is left unstated.