4 ms·

All I see is missed opportunities to build a bunch less nuclear power plants and call it a day, without messing up with the landscape. Am I the only one? I beli

All I see is missed opportunities to build a bunch less nuclear power plants and call it a day, without messing up with the landscape. Am I the only one? I believe if we Europeans and Americans start building nuclear power plants again we could finally compete. Renewable energy is not constant and has a storage problem

Computer0 9mo ago
At least half of people I talk to are strongly opposed to nuclear energy. How many are opposed to the current sources of energy as well? I wonder.
- hollowturtle 9mo ago
  Agree they oppose nuclear, perhaps because of the fear of the unknown radiation or whatever. Reality is all nuclear incidents combined are nothing compared to the health problems oil and gas created(not to mention political implications). To me filling a giant space with solar panels or installing giant bird killing turbines is such a moronic move when you can have unnoticeable small nuclear power plants
  - kibwen 9mo ago
    > bird killing turbines If you think wind turbines are a significant cause of bird deaths it shows that you have no clue what you're talking about. Please don't bother commenting on this topic again.
    - hollowturtle 9mo ago
      Not as many as cats I certainly know that, it obiovusly was an hyperbole used to underline that all we need is just a nuclear power plant to replace all that wind turbines
      - frm88 9mo ago
        Our study, covering 45 species across 91 countries, reveals that human-induced factors—predominantly electrocution, illegal killing, and poisoning—constitute the major threats to bird mortality, highlighting a critical issue in global biodiversity conservation. https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0006320724000867 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S000632072... and from last year, US specific, endangered species: A comparative assessment with data from the 2010 Red List reveals an increase in the proportion of threatened species recorded as being impacted by certain threats. Notably, the incidence of hunting and trapping as a documented threat has increased from 34% to 41% of threatened species. Similarly, the proportion of species assessments with fire/fire suppression, climate change, pollution, invasive alien species and energy production have each increased by 3-5 percentage points. https://datazone.birdlife.org/articles/state-of-the-worlds-birds-2025-annual-update https://datazone.birdlife.org/articles/state-of-the-worlds-b... Wind turbines are a significantly lower threat than windows, look it up!
matthewdgreen 9mo ago
If nuclear plants were as inexpensive as renewables, that would make a ton of sense.
- gregbot 9mo ago
  France decarbonized way before the rest of Europe with nuclear and it wasn't expensive. 50 reactors for $200 billion. Gernamy has spent twice that on intermittents and still relies on coal
  - dalyons 9mo ago
    Such a tired point. It’s not the 1970s anymore, and the west can build any large projects cheap. Go look at the projected costs for France’s new fleet, and that’s before the inevitable cost overruns
    - gregbot 9mo ago
      Could you post a link to those projected costs?
      - philipkglass 9mo ago
        "EDF estimates EPR2 programme cost at EUR72.8 billion" France's EDF has said its preliminary cost estimate for the project to build six EPR2 reactors at Penly, Gravelines and Bugey totals EUR72.8 billion (USD85.3 billion). https://www.world-nuclear-news.org/articles/edf-estimates-epr2-programme-costs-at-eur728-billion https://www.world-nuclear-news.org/articles/edf-estimates-ep... Each reactor outputs 1650 megawatts of electricity running at full power. Assuming they run at 92% capacity factor, that's $9.38 per real annualized watt.
        gregbot 9mo ago
        Great. So 538TWh per year is 61 GW so roughly 61 GW * $9.38 = $576 billion staggered over the 80 year life of nuclear plants is $7.2 billion per year of capital expenditure. For comparison, wind is about $5/W. Assuming a 35% capacity factor and a 30 year expected lifetime for the latest turbines that comes to $10.0 billion per year of capital expenditure with no storage or fossil backup systems or extra capacity given weather variability. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cost_of_electricity_by_source https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cost_of_electricity_by_source https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electricity_sector_in_France https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electricity_sector_in_France
anon84873628 9mo ago
I also lament the landscapes covered by solar panels. Even deserts are not dead barren ecosystems. Some of these installs are only slightly better than paving the whole area. But I get it, and tradeoffs are necessary. Another reason China may prefer this to more concentrated nuclear power is that is is much more distributed and resilient to targeted attacks.
- mrguyorama 9mo ago
  >Some of these installs are only slightly better than paving the whole area. Utter horseshit. Putting up what amounts to a bunch of shade on steel pillars just doesn't harm the environment. There are more than a few contexts where it improves the environment. There's no identified or predicted harm from large scale photovoltaic installations.
hackable_sand 9mo ago
Compete with what? Is this more American shadowboxing?

Computer0 9mo ago

At least half of people I talk to are strongly opposed to nuclear energy. How many are opposed to the current sources of energy as well? I wonder.

hollowturtle 9mo ago
Agree they oppose nuclear, perhaps because of the fear of the unknown radiation or whatever. Reality is all nuclear incidents combined are nothing compared to the health problems oil and gas created(not to mention political implications). To me filling a giant space with solar panels or installing giant bird killing turbines is such a moronic move when you can have unnoticeable small nuclear power plants
- kibwen 9mo ago
  > bird killing turbines If you think wind turbines are a significant cause of bird deaths it shows that you have no clue what you're talking about. Please don't bother commenting on this topic again.
  - hollowturtle 9mo ago
    Not as many as cats I certainly know that, it obiovusly was an hyperbole used to underline that all we need is just a nuclear power plant to replace all that wind turbines
    - frm88 9mo ago
      Our study, covering 45 species across 91 countries, reveals that human-induced factors—predominantly electrocution, illegal killing, and poisoning—constitute the major threats to bird mortality, highlighting a critical issue in global biodiversity conservation. https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0006320724000867 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S000632072... and from last year, US specific, endangered species: A comparative assessment with data from the 2010 Red List reveals an increase in the proportion of threatened species recorded as being impacted by certain threats. Notably, the incidence of hunting and trapping as a documented threat has increased from 34% to 41% of threatened species. Similarly, the proportion of species assessments with fire/fire suppression, climate change, pollution, invasive alien species and energy production have each increased by 3-5 percentage points. https://datazone.birdlife.org/articles/state-of-the-worlds-birds-2025-annual-update https://datazone.birdlife.org/articles/state-of-the-worlds-b... Wind turbines are a significantly lower threat than windows, look it up!

matthewdgreen 9mo ago

If nuclear plants were as inexpensive as renewables, that would make a ton of sense.

gregbot 9mo ago
France decarbonized way before the rest of Europe with nuclear and it wasn't expensive. 50 reactors for $200 billion. Gernamy has spent twice that on intermittents and still relies on coal
- dalyons 9mo ago
  Such a tired point. It’s not the 1970s anymore, and the west can build any large projects cheap. Go look at the projected costs for France’s new fleet, and that’s before the inevitable cost overruns
  - gregbot 9mo ago
    Could you post a link to those projected costs?
    - philipkglass 9mo ago
      "EDF estimates EPR2 programme cost at EUR72.8 billion" France's EDF has said its preliminary cost estimate for the project to build six EPR2 reactors at Penly, Gravelines and Bugey totals EUR72.8 billion (USD85.3 billion). https://www.world-nuclear-news.org/articles/edf-estimates-epr2-programme-costs-at-eur728-billion https://www.world-nuclear-news.org/articles/edf-estimates-ep... Each reactor outputs 1650 megawatts of electricity running at full power. Assuming they run at 92% capacity factor, that's $9.38 per real annualized watt.
      - gregbot 9mo ago
        Great. So 538TWh per year is 61 GW so roughly 61 GW * $9.38 = $576 billion staggered over the 80 year life of nuclear plants is $7.2 billion per year of capital expenditure. For comparison, wind is about $5/W. Assuming a 35% capacity factor and a 30 year expected lifetime for the latest turbines that comes to $10.0 billion per year of capital expenditure with no storage or fossil backup systems or extra capacity given weather variability. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cost_of_electricity_by_source https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cost_of_electricity_by_source https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electricity_sector_in_France https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electricity_sector_in_France

anon84873628 9mo ago

I also lament the landscapes covered by solar panels. Even deserts are not dead barren ecosystems. Some of these installs are only slightly better than paving the whole area. But I get it, and tradeoffs are necessary. Another reason China may prefer this to more concentrated nuclear power is that is is much more distributed and resilient to targeted attacks.

mrguyorama 9mo ago
>Some of these installs are only slightly better than paving the whole area. Utter horseshit. Putting up what amounts to a bunch of shade on steel pillars just doesn't harm the environment. There are more than a few contexts where it improves the environment. There's no identified or predicted harm from large scale photovoltaic installations.

hackable_sand 9mo ago

Compete with what? Is this more American shadowboxing?