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People who complain about “processed foods” generally have a basic misunderstanding of chemical/biochemical processes and energy gradients or activation energie

People who complain about “processed foods” generally have a basic misunderstanding of chemical/biochemical processes and energy gradients or activation energies. Ultimately, everything is highly processed or we’d be eating rocks. The magnificent manufacturing line in animal or even plant cells is one of the most processed things at the finest molecular level that we know!

lm28469 9mo ago
That's not really what we're talking about here though. An apple isn't the same as an apple juice which isn't the same as an apple flavored candy, even you can appreciate the difference of processing in these simple examples. A slab of beef isn't the same as a "burger patty*" where the meat is coming from 54 different pigs, including cartilages, tendons, skin &co and contains 12 additives coming from the petrochemical industry. The same applies to vegetarians/vegan stuff, you can make a patty from beans at home with like 3 ingredients, or buy ready made patties containing hydrogenated trans fats, bad additives, food coloring, &c.
- forgotusername6 9mo ago
  Is there anything really wrong with cartilage, skin, tendons etc? Is that actually unhealthy or is that squeamishness? Also is there anything wrong with it coming from multiple animals? I.e. homogenisation of the product.
  - nonethewiser 9mo ago
    Doesnt really matter to his point. It could be the healthiest thing the world but still more processed than a whole steak. Remember, he's arguing against the claim that everything is processed to the point where distinguishing between degree doesnt matter. Not that tendon/cartilage are necessarily bad.
- frutiger 9mo ago
  Yes I understand bioavailability etc. My point is that it’s nothing to do with how processed something is.
  - nonethewiser 9mo ago
    He never mentions bioavailability. It seems you are projecting some conflation of bioavailability/processed which he's not doing.
nonethewiser 9mo ago
In what sense is an ear of corn highly processed? Is the same sense in which a hot dog is highly processed?
maerF0x0 9mo ago
And yet we find that the foods that most people can intuitively label as "processed" come with lower satiety per calorie, unfavorable effects on blood sugar, and lower micro nutrient density per calorie. There are definitely outliers, but obvious ones are Wonderbread vs Whole grain high fiber breads (like Daves 21 grain or ezekiel bread), American cheese vs Sliced medium cheddar, even things like Sweetened apple sauce vs an Apple, White rice versus brown or "wild rice"
escapedmoose 9mo ago
You can argue the semantics all you want, but “highly processed foods”, despite the difficulty/ambiguity in defining them, tend to have both a higher calorie density and are proven to nudge people to consume more, vs. “whole foods” (i.e. minimally modified fruits, veggies, cooked whole meats, etc.). When you treat the “highly processed” label as a rule of thumb allowing for some ambiguity in the definition, and you compare people who eat processed vs. whole foods, you find that the whole foods group is overwhelmingly fitter.

lm28469 9mo ago

That's not really what we're talking about here though. An apple isn't the same as an apple juice which isn't the same as an apple flavored candy, even you can appreciate the difference of processing in these simple examples. A slab of beef isn't the same as a "burger patty*" where the meat is coming from 54 different pigs, including cartilages, tendons, skin &co and contains 12 additives coming from the petrochemical industry. The same applies to vegetarians/vegan stuff, you can make a patty from beans at home with like 3 ingredients, or buy ready made patties containing hydrogenated trans fats, bad additives, food coloring, &c.

forgotusername6 9mo ago
Is there anything really wrong with cartilage, skin, tendons etc? Is that actually unhealthy or is that squeamishness? Also is there anything wrong with it coming from multiple animals? I.e. homogenisation of the product.
- nonethewiser 9mo ago
  Doesnt really matter to his point. It could be the healthiest thing the world but still more processed than a whole steak. Remember, he's arguing against the claim that everything is processed to the point where distinguishing between degree doesnt matter. Not that tendon/cartilage are necessarily bad.
frutiger 9mo ago
Yes I understand bioavailability etc. My point is that it’s nothing to do with how processed something is.
- nonethewiser 9mo ago
  He never mentions bioavailability. It seems you are projecting some conflation of bioavailability/processed which he's not doing.

nonethewiser 9mo ago

In what sense is an ear of corn highly processed? Is the same sense in which a hot dog is highly processed?

maerF0x0 9mo ago

And yet we find that the foods that most people can intuitively label as "processed" come with lower satiety per calorie, unfavorable effects on blood sugar, and lower micro nutrient density per calorie. There are definitely outliers, but obvious ones are Wonderbread vs Whole grain high fiber breads (like Daves 21 grain or ezekiel bread), American cheese vs Sliced medium cheddar, even things like Sweetened apple sauce vs an Apple, White rice versus brown or "wild rice"

escapedmoose 9mo ago

You can argue the semantics all you want, but “highly processed foods”, despite the difficulty/ambiguity in defining them, tend to have both a higher calorie density and are proven to nudge people to consume more, vs. “whole foods” (i.e. minimally modified fruits, veggies, cooked whole meats, etc.). When you treat the “highly processed” label as a rule of thumb allowing for some ambiguity in the definition, and you compare people who eat processed vs. whole foods, you find that the whole foods group is overwhelmingly fitter.