4 ms·

lentils carb/protein ratio isn't great. you still need to supplement it with protein (whey or pea). i eat a fair amount of lentils, but mostly as a carb source

lentils carb/protein ratio isn't great. you still need to supplement it with protein (whey or pea). i eat a fair amount of lentils, but mostly as a carb source (like white rice). even tofu's ratio isn't good enough. i do eat a lot of tofu though, because i like it back of the hand math suggests id have to eat a kg of dry lentils a day to reach my protein requirements. that's gotta be what, 2800 cal? edit: 800g of lentils for 200g of protein, 2500 cal. im just thinking out loud here, but lentils alone wouldn't be adequate for me.

teiferer 9mo ago
Depends on "adequate". The average western diet over-consumes protein.
- parl_match 9mo ago
  okay? i said "adequate for me", not "adequate for the average western person".
- com2kid 9mo ago
  I started tracking everything I ate, every single bite. The average western diet may over consume meat, but I have to work my butt off to hit my protein goals for strength training. A slice of bacon has 3g of protein. 150 calories though. Eating enough protein through bacon isn't the best of ideas, even if someone is doing a ketogenic diet! 60-80g of protein is about right for a man who has a moderately physical job or who exercises some small amount. 100g is the minimum for putting on muscle and getting stronger. The average western diet over consumes everything, it could do with less sugar, less processed foods (which are hyper palatable and don't satiate hunger), and more pure protein.
  - NewJazz 9mo ago
    Why are you quoting raw protein grams instead of using a g/kg of body weight metric?
    - com2kid 9mo ago
      Because American men average around five nine and given the average lean muscle mass needs on that frame size, something within 60-90g (which is a huge range!) will work for most American men. Like if someone is a 6 foot 10 body builder, they know their needs. Also the suggested range of g/kg ranges from .8g/kg to 1.2g/kg, which is also a huge range, but that is primarily for building strength, not maintaining. Given the goals here are "rough guidelines on eating healthy", I'm fine saying most men should aim for 60-90g of lean protein a day. That isn't exactly a hot take.
  - zabzonk 9mo ago
    > strength training why do you think you need to do that? most people don't.
    - com2kid 9mo ago
      That question is, honestly, kind of stupid. It is akin to asking why eat healthy or why go outside in the sun. But hey, here we go. 1. Intense physical exercise is the only known way to increase IQ. (Admittedly pure strength training is not the best for this, HIIT workouts are better) 2. Muscle mass is a huge factor in the early death in seniors. Basically people who lack muscle mass are more likely to fall over and fracture something, at which point they are much more likely to die. 3. Lean muscle mass, up to a certain point (e.g. extreme body builders have worse mortality numbers), decreases mortality across the board. 4. I like living w/o pain, and you can choose to either have your joints take the load or your muscles take the load. 5. I enjoy being able to move my body and be active in the world. 6. I'm vain and I like to look good. > most people don't. Most people in America die of a heart attack. Most people in America are obese and have troubles moving around. Most people in America don't read books. Most people in America don't enjoy mathematics. Most people in America don't go to art museums. People should have aspirations to do more than average.
    - SpicyLemonZest 9mo ago
      Most people experience severe mobility problems in old age that would likely have been preventable by strength training.
    - parl_match 9mo ago
      you don't need to do anything. why try? sit at home and watch tv. i can hike elevation all day which is great for backpacking, i look great with a shirt off, and i can stand up from the couch without using my hands. yes, im taking it a bit far at this point, but really that just means eating the average american's protein intake and then a protein shake or two on top
tomjakubowski 9mo ago
> 800g of lentils for 200g of protein, 2500 cal. > im just thinking out loud here, but lentils alone wouldn't be adequate for me. This seems in line with maintenance calories for a moderately active man, am I missing something?
- heavyset_go 9mo ago
  If the goal is both strength training, cardio, and both weight gain and building muscle mass to competitive levels, then that can be not enough.
  - tomjakubowski 9mo ago
    Scale that up to 5000 kcal/day needed for heavy activity (like for an Olympic swimmer) and it still seems like a sufficient, if not excessive, amount of protein: 400g of it. Not even NFL linemen eat that much protein.
hombre_fatal 9mo ago
You would just eat more protein dense plant foods like tempeh, extra firm tofu, and seitan which is the most protein dense food. If the only food in your pantry were seitan, you’d have to eat 260g (960cal) of it to hit 200g protein. It’s not that much food. Most people haven’t tried it but asian stores may sell it next to tofu as “vegan chicken/beef”. It has a nice texture that you can cube and treat like chicken in a stir fry. I eat it weekly.
writebetterc 9mo ago
Tofu's ratio is really good, though? I can get 162kcal/18g of protein tofu here. Anything where P*10 > KCAL is a very good protein source, imo.
- parl_match 9mo ago
  chicken breast is more than twice as "good" ratio wise. > Anything where P*10 > KCAL is a very good protein source, imo. for the average person's protein intake, yes. try doing 200g of protein a day with tofu. for firm tofu, that's over 5 pounds of tofu a day! and that's over 2000 calories. it's doable but i also challenge you to eat 5 pounds of tofu every day of a week and tell me if that's any fun, lol.
  - writebetterc 9mo ago
    > chicken breast is more than twice as "good" ratio wise. Yes, at more than twice the price for me. > for the average person's protein intake, yes. The average person doesn't need that ratio, reaching 60-90g of protein is trivial. That ratio is good for bodybuilding purposes. Now, eating that much tofu, that sucks. Generally, getting 200g of protein sucks, even when you eat protein powder.
    - parl_match 9mo ago
      > The average person doesn't need that ratio That's fine for the average person. > Generally, getting 200g of protein sucks, even when you eat protein powder. I have a some days where I hit 120g and it's not a recovery or workout day and I just give up lol.

teiferer 9mo ago

Depends on "adequate". The average western diet over-consumes protein.

parl_match 9mo ago
okay? i said "adequate for me", not "adequate for the average western person".
com2kid 9mo ago
I started tracking everything I ate, every single bite. The average western diet may over consume meat, but I have to work my butt off to hit my protein goals for strength training. A slice of bacon has 3g of protein. 150 calories though. Eating enough protein through bacon isn't the best of ideas, even if someone is doing a ketogenic diet! 60-80g of protein is about right for a man who has a moderately physical job or who exercises some small amount. 100g is the minimum for putting on muscle and getting stronger. The average western diet over consumes everything, it could do with less sugar, less processed foods (which are hyper palatable and don't satiate hunger), and more pure protein.
- NewJazz 9mo ago
  Why are you quoting raw protein grams instead of using a g/kg of body weight metric?
  - com2kid 9mo ago
    Because American men average around five nine and given the average lean muscle mass needs on that frame size, something within 60-90g (which is a huge range!) will work for most American men. Like if someone is a 6 foot 10 body builder, they know their needs. Also the suggested range of g/kg ranges from .8g/kg to 1.2g/kg, which is also a huge range, but that is primarily for building strength, not maintaining. Given the goals here are "rough guidelines on eating healthy", I'm fine saying most men should aim for 60-90g of lean protein a day. That isn't exactly a hot take.
- zabzonk 9mo ago
  > strength training why do you think you need to do that? most people don't.
  - com2kid 9mo ago
    That question is, honestly, kind of stupid. It is akin to asking why eat healthy or why go outside in the sun. But hey, here we go. 1. Intense physical exercise is the only known way to increase IQ. (Admittedly pure strength training is not the best for this, HIIT workouts are better) 2. Muscle mass is a huge factor in the early death in seniors. Basically people who lack muscle mass are more likely to fall over and fracture something, at which point they are much more likely to die. 3. Lean muscle mass, up to a certain point (e.g. extreme body builders have worse mortality numbers), decreases mortality across the board. 4. I like living w/o pain, and you can choose to either have your joints take the load or your muscles take the load. 5. I enjoy being able to move my body and be active in the world. 6. I'm vain and I like to look good. > most people don't. Most people in America die of a heart attack. Most people in America are obese and have troubles moving around. Most people in America don't read books. Most people in America don't enjoy mathematics. Most people in America don't go to art museums. People should have aspirations to do more than average.
  - SpicyLemonZest 9mo ago
    Most people experience severe mobility problems in old age that would likely have been preventable by strength training.
  - parl_match 9mo ago
    you don't need to do anything. why try? sit at home and watch tv. i can hike elevation all day which is great for backpacking, i look great with a shirt off, and i can stand up from the couch without using my hands. yes, im taking it a bit far at this point, but really that just means eating the average american's protein intake and then a protein shake or two on top

tomjakubowski 9mo ago

> 800g of lentils for 200g of protein, 2500 cal. > im just thinking out loud here, but lentils alone wouldn't be adequate for me. This seems in line with maintenance calories for a moderately active man, am I missing something?

heavyset_go 9mo ago
If the goal is both strength training, cardio, and both weight gain and building muscle mass to competitive levels, then that can be not enough.
- tomjakubowski 9mo ago
  Scale that up to 5000 kcal/day needed for heavy activity (like for an Olympic swimmer) and it still seems like a sufficient, if not excessive, amount of protein: 400g of it. Not even NFL linemen eat that much protein.

hombre_fatal 9mo ago

You would just eat more protein dense plant foods like tempeh, extra firm tofu, and seitan which is the most protein dense food. If the only food in your pantry were seitan, you’d have to eat 260g (960cal) of it to hit 200g protein. It’s not that much food. Most people haven’t tried it but asian stores may sell it next to tofu as “vegan chicken/beef”. It has a nice texture that you can cube and treat like chicken in a stir fry. I eat it weekly.

writebetterc 9mo ago

Tofu's ratio is really good, though? I can get 162kcal/18g of protein tofu here. Anything where P*10 > KCAL is a very good protein source, imo.

parl_match 9mo ago
chicken breast is more than twice as "good" ratio wise. > Anything where P*10 > KCAL is a very good protein source, imo. for the average person's protein intake, yes. try doing 200g of protein a day with tofu. for firm tofu, that's over 5 pounds of tofu a day! and that's over 2000 calories. it's doable but i also challenge you to eat 5 pounds of tofu every day of a week and tell me if that's any fun, lol.
- writebetterc 9mo ago
  > chicken breast is more than twice as "good" ratio wise. Yes, at more than twice the price for me. > for the average person's protein intake, yes. The average person doesn't need that ratio, reaching 60-90g of protein is trivial. That ratio is good for bodybuilding purposes. Now, eating that much tofu, that sucks. Generally, getting 200g of protein sucks, even when you eat protein powder.
  - parl_match 9mo ago
    > The average person doesn't need that ratio That's fine for the average person. > Generally, getting 200g of protein sucks, even when you eat protein powder. I have a some days where I hit 120g and it's not a recovery or workout day and I just give up lol.