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I have the impression that most people believing and repeating this "great replacement" narrative are not members of the demographics they claim are being repla

I have the impression that most people believing and repeating this "great replacement" narrative are not members of the demographics they claim are being replaced. To me it seems mostly spread by people living outside of Europe trying to paint Europe in a bad light in order to push fear and anti-immigration policies in the general west.

rithdmc 9mo ago
Unfortunately, it's not an uncommon thing to hear from people when performing community outreach (think door knocking). External push, definitely, but it's also being repeated by the demographic this narrative is being pushed to. I can't comment on whether or not they believe it, but it's certainly repeated by some here in Ireland.
- defrost 9mo ago
  > but it's certainly repeated by some here in Ireland. To be fair to Ireland and history they have a valid complaint going back centuries wrt outsiders taking their lands, language, governance, food and labour all while debating "the Irish Question" and reaching for eugenic "solutions".
  - disgruntledphd2 9mo ago
    > To be fair to Ireland and history they have a valid complaint going back centuries wrt outsiders taking their lands, language, governance, food and labour all while debating "the Irish Question" and reaching for eugenic "solutions". Odd then, that they didn't notice when this happened post GFC when basically all of the land banks and large assets were sold off to (predominantly) US based private equity funds. And honestly, Irish anti-immigration sentiment is far more driven by both our complete failures at building infrastructure for a growing population (which we've never had before) and the fact that all refugees are housed in poor areas (which already had much worse services). But it's very important that no residents of South Dublin should be inconvenienced, even at the cost of our society.
    - defrost 9mo ago
      I more or less nodded along in general agreement save for > for a growing population (which we've never had before) and feel I might remind you that in the time span of my comment (past centuries) Irelands population nearly tripled in the 40 years following 1700 to a peak greater than the current population number.
      - disgruntledphd2 9mo ago
        > and feel I might remind you that in the time span of my comment (past centuries) Irelands population nearly tripled in the 40 years following 1700 to a peak greater than the current population number. True, the political system was very different then though, and the government of the time (to put it lightly) was not concerned with the needs of those citizens (c.f. penal laws etc).
    - rithdmc 9mo ago
      I wouldn't say anyone didn't notice "when basically all of the land banks and large assets were sold off", there was years of protest and reporting about this. > Irish anti-immigration sentiment is far more driven by both our complete failures at building infrastructure Yeah, I'd largely agree it's a services issue, and most people I speak with correctly direct that anger at the state.
      - disgruntledphd2 9mo ago
        > I wouldn't say anyone didn't notice "when basically all of the land banks and large assets were sold off", there was years of protest and reporting about this. I definitely was upset at the time, but didn't really notice many people paying attention. We basically sold off our future development policy to get out of the Troika bailout (and I understand why this happened, but I think the long term consequences of this are have been shown to be really, really bad). > Yeah, I'd largely agree it's a services issue, and most people I speak with correctly direct that anger at the state. And they are correct to do so. Basically all FFG have done is wait until the housing issue had gone way too far (and started impacting their voters) and then done a bunch of demand side initiatives which have just pushed up prices rather than focusing on the development side. Not to mention the absurdity of our national spatial strategy where we won't zone more in Dublin and instead want people to move to Meath & Wicklow and commute for hours to their jobs. But at least no-one's left in negative equity. FML.
  - rithdmc 9mo ago
    IMO there's a massive difference between what's happening today, with individuals claiming asylum, compared to the State level interference of our history.
  - RobotToaster 9mo ago
    You could make the same argument for Britain wrt the Normans.
    - defrost 9mo ago
      Seems like a low bar given the entire span of Britain's history - Londinium was founded by Mediterraneans, Danelaw covered half the Big Island for a good period, the Anglo-Saxons were Germanic immigrants pushed back by the Norman wave . . . The UK is immigrant wave after wave all the way back to when it was nothing but solid ice pressing down the entire landmass and practically all the islands.
      - ljsprague 9mo ago
        And each immigrant wave served to displace and/or replace (a difference without distinction) the prior population.

rithdmc 9mo ago

Unfortunately, it's not an uncommon thing to hear from people when performing community outreach (think door knocking). External push, definitely, but it's also being repeated by the demographic this narrative is being pushed to. I can't comment on whether or not they believe it, but it's certainly repeated by some here in Ireland.

defrost 9mo ago
> but it's certainly repeated by some here in Ireland. To be fair to Ireland and history they have a valid complaint going back centuries wrt outsiders taking their lands, language, governance, food and labour all while debating "the Irish Question" and reaching for eugenic "solutions".
- disgruntledphd2 9mo ago
  > To be fair to Ireland and history they have a valid complaint going back centuries wrt outsiders taking their lands, language, governance, food and labour all while debating "the Irish Question" and reaching for eugenic "solutions". Odd then, that they didn't notice when this happened post GFC when basically all of the land banks and large assets were sold off to (predominantly) US based private equity funds. And honestly, Irish anti-immigration sentiment is far more driven by both our complete failures at building infrastructure for a growing population (which we've never had before) and the fact that all refugees are housed in poor areas (which already had much worse services). But it's very important that no residents of South Dublin should be inconvenienced, even at the cost of our society.
  - defrost 9mo ago
    I more or less nodded along in general agreement save for > for a growing population (which we've never had before) and feel I might remind you that in the time span of my comment (past centuries) Irelands population nearly tripled in the 40 years following 1700 to a peak greater than the current population number.
    - disgruntledphd2 9mo ago
      > and feel I might remind you that in the time span of my comment (past centuries) Irelands population nearly tripled in the 40 years following 1700 to a peak greater than the current population number. True, the political system was very different then though, and the government of the time (to put it lightly) was not concerned with the needs of those citizens (c.f. penal laws etc).
  - rithdmc 9mo ago
    I wouldn't say anyone didn't notice "when basically all of the land banks and large assets were sold off", there was years of protest and reporting about this. > Irish anti-immigration sentiment is far more driven by both our complete failures at building infrastructure Yeah, I'd largely agree it's a services issue, and most people I speak with correctly direct that anger at the state.
    - disgruntledphd2 9mo ago
      > I wouldn't say anyone didn't notice "when basically all of the land banks and large assets were sold off", there was years of protest and reporting about this. I definitely was upset at the time, but didn't really notice many people paying attention. We basically sold off our future development policy to get out of the Troika bailout (and I understand why this happened, but I think the long term consequences of this are have been shown to be really, really bad). > Yeah, I'd largely agree it's a services issue, and most people I speak with correctly direct that anger at the state. And they are correct to do so. Basically all FFG have done is wait until the housing issue had gone way too far (and started impacting their voters) and then done a bunch of demand side initiatives which have just pushed up prices rather than focusing on the development side. Not to mention the absurdity of our national spatial strategy where we won't zone more in Dublin and instead want people to move to Meath & Wicklow and commute for hours to their jobs. But at least no-one's left in negative equity. FML.
- rithdmc 9mo ago
  IMO there's a massive difference between what's happening today, with individuals claiming asylum, compared to the State level interference of our history.
- RobotToaster 9mo ago
  You could make the same argument for Britain wrt the Normans.
  - defrost 9mo ago
    Seems like a low bar given the entire span of Britain's history - Londinium was founded by Mediterraneans, Danelaw covered half the Big Island for a good period, the Anglo-Saxons were Germanic immigrants pushed back by the Norman wave . . . The UK is immigrant wave after wave all the way back to when it was nothing but solid ice pressing down the entire landmass and practically all the islands.
    - ljsprague 9mo ago
      And each immigrant wave served to displace and/or replace (a difference without distinction) the prior population.