3 ms·

But this mechanism is used to circumvent DNS blockade. Wikipedia may be next to moderate if they can force DNS providers and even the org registrar to give in,

by hirako2000 10mo ago

But this mechanism is used to circumvent DNS blockade. Wikipedia may be next to moderate if they can force DNS providers and even the org registrar to give in, wikipedia could fold too. Then pastebin, never ending cat and mouse game.

zelphirkalt 10mo ago
DNS is another layer. The URLs shown on Wikipedia will still have to be resolved to IP addresses, which is where DNS comes in. Referring to Wikipedia for the URLs/domains does nothing to circumvent DNS blockades.
- miyuru 10mo ago
  Maybe with the upcoming IP address certificates, we can use IP addresses again. I remember using IP addresses to access some sites in the past. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44379034 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44379034
  - rzerowan 10mo ago
    Evenn though its onelayer down - the same tactics that were used to suspend/takeover domains would still apply , at the end of the day one still has to get the IPv4/IPv6 address from someone(who can be coerced).
    - immibis 10mo ago
      When Trump pressures RIPE NCC or APNIC to deregister an IP address block, that's the end of the internet as we know it, and the return to national networks with very limited interconnection. Even Russia still has address registrations despite being sanctioned. Alternatively they pressure USA ISPs to block the addresses. That's already regularly done but it probably won't be enough to satisfy the extortion industrial complex which is out for blood.
      - miroljub 10mo ago
        > When Trump pressures RIPE NCC or APNIC to deregister an IP address block sed "/Trump/US-Govt/g" Why do people here always casually single out Trump? He's not an outlier, it's just how US foreign policy has worked for centuries.
        ddingus 10mo ago
        "Not an outlier" A quick look at the last few administrations is all anyone needs to see how this one interprets the powers and duties that come with the office. One of my favorite phrases coined during the last Trump administration was something like, "not just wrong, but wrong beyond normal parameters." It basically meant exactly what we are discussing here; namely, being an outlier of some sort.
        miroljub 10mo ago
        I specifically mentioned foreign policy. There, I don't remember a single US government that was not a net negative for the rest of the world (Israel excluded).
  - extraduder_ire 10mo ago
    Using a wildcard DNS service, you can already do this. https://sslip.io/ https://sslip.io/ for instance.
- IshKebab 10mo ago
  It circumvents the purpose of the DNS block which is meant to prevent people from easily finding the site. Anna's Archive can easily register new domain names and put them on Wikipedia, thus allowing people to easily discover the new location of the site. Of course many sites can serve as "DNS" - Reddit, Github, X, basically anywhere you can put a URL. So DNS blocking is relatively useless.
YetAnotherNick 10mo ago
Why should wikipedia fold? Can any country put any legitimate pressure against them for just listing a domain.
- layer8 10mo ago
  Linking to illegal services can be illegal, that’s why.
  - miroljub 10mo ago
    > Linking to illegal services can be illegal, that’s why. What is illegal in one country can be illegal everywhere. I don't remember Wikipedia removing LGBTIAQ++ articles just because that's illegal in Iran. If a government thinks Wikipedia is illegal in their country, they can force local ISP providers to block it, but it's not Wikipedia's responsibility [1] to censor itself. [1] at least should not be
    - layer8 10mo ago
      The Wikimedia Foundation is a US corporation. There are national chapters in some other countries, which are corporations in the respective country. The internet isn't the Wild West; websites are subject to the laws of the countries they operate in.
      - gnopgnip 10mo ago
        What country does Anna’s archive operate in?
      - hermanzegerman 10mo ago
        They can also just create a new foundation elsewhere if the US becomes hostile.
  - YetAnotherNick 10mo ago
    No it's not, at least in US. Google fought and won this case.

zelphirkalt 10mo ago

DNS is another layer. The URLs shown on Wikipedia will still have to be resolved to IP addresses, which is where DNS comes in. Referring to Wikipedia for the URLs/domains does nothing to circumvent DNS blockades.

miyuru 10mo ago
Maybe with the upcoming IP address certificates, we can use IP addresses again. I remember using IP addresses to access some sites in the past. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44379034 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44379034
- rzerowan 10mo ago
  Evenn though its onelayer down - the same tactics that were used to suspend/takeover domains would still apply , at the end of the day one still has to get the IPv4/IPv6 address from someone(who can be coerced).
  - immibis 10mo ago
    When Trump pressures RIPE NCC or APNIC to deregister an IP address block, that's the end of the internet as we know it, and the return to national networks with very limited interconnection. Even Russia still has address registrations despite being sanctioned. Alternatively they pressure USA ISPs to block the addresses. That's already regularly done but it probably won't be enough to satisfy the extortion industrial complex which is out for blood.
    - miroljub 10mo ago
      > When Trump pressures RIPE NCC or APNIC to deregister an IP address block sed "/Trump/US-Govt/g" Why do people here always casually single out Trump? He's not an outlier, it's just how US foreign policy has worked for centuries.
      - ddingus 10mo ago
        "Not an outlier" A quick look at the last few administrations is all anyone needs to see how this one interprets the powers and duties that come with the office. One of my favorite phrases coined during the last Trump administration was something like, "not just wrong, but wrong beyond normal parameters." It basically meant exactly what we are discussing here; namely, being an outlier of some sort.
        miroljub 10mo ago
        I specifically mentioned foreign policy. There, I don't remember a single US government that was not a net negative for the rest of the world (Israel excluded).
- extraduder_ire 10mo ago
  Using a wildcard DNS service, you can already do this. https://sslip.io/ https://sslip.io/ for instance.
IshKebab 10mo ago
It circumvents the purpose of the DNS block which is meant to prevent people from easily finding the site. Anna's Archive can easily register new domain names and put them on Wikipedia, thus allowing people to easily discover the new location of the site. Of course many sites can serve as "DNS" - Reddit, Github, X, basically anywhere you can put a URL. So DNS blocking is relatively useless.

YetAnotherNick 10mo ago

Why should wikipedia fold? Can any country put any legitimate pressure against them for just listing a domain.

layer8 10mo ago
Linking to illegal services can be illegal, that’s why.
- miroljub 10mo ago
  > Linking to illegal services can be illegal, that’s why. What is illegal in one country can be illegal everywhere. I don't remember Wikipedia removing LGBTIAQ++ articles just because that's illegal in Iran. If a government thinks Wikipedia is illegal in their country, they can force local ISP providers to block it, but it's not Wikipedia's responsibility [1] to censor itself. [1] at least should not be
  - layer8 10mo ago
    The Wikimedia Foundation is a US corporation. There are national chapters in some other countries, which are corporations in the respective country. The internet isn't the Wild West; websites are subject to the laws of the countries they operate in.
    - gnopgnip 10mo ago
      What country does Anna’s archive operate in?
    - hermanzegerman 10mo ago
      They can also just create a new foundation elsewhere if the US becomes hostile.
- YetAnotherNick 10mo ago
  No it's not, at least in US. Google fought and won this case.