4 ms·

It's not necessarily close minded to choose to abstain from interacting with generative text, and choose not to use software that integrates it. I could say it

It's not necessarily close minded to choose to abstain from interacting with generative text, and choose not to use software that integrates it. I could say it's equally close minded not to sympathize with this position, or various reasoning behind it. For me, I feel that my spoken language is effected by those I interact with, and the more exposed someone is to a bot, the more they will speak like that bot, and I don't want my language to be pulled towards the average redditor, so I choose not to interact with LLMs (I still use them for code generation, but I wouldn't if I used code for self expression. I just refuse to have a back and forth conversation on any topic. It's like that family that tried raising a chimp alongside a baby. The chimp did pick up some human like behavior, but the baby human adapted to chimp like behavior much faster, so they abandoned the experiment.)

kevmo314 10mo ago
Sure, I am more referring to advocating for Bergamot as a type of more "pure" solution. I have no opinion on not wanting to converse with a machine, that is a perfectly valid preference. I am referring more to the blog post's position where it seems to advocate against itself.
bee_rider 10mo ago
I’m not too worried about starting to write like a bot. But, I do notice that I’m sometimes blunt and demanding when I talk to a bot, and I’m worried that could leak through to my normal talking. I try to be polite just to not gain bad habits. But, for example, chatGPT is extremely confident, often wrong, and very weasely about it, so it can be hard to be “nice” to it (especially knowing that under the hood it has no feelings). It can be annoying when you bounce the third idea off the thing and it confidently replies with wrong instructions. Anyway, I’ve been less worried about running local models, mostly just because I’m running them CPU-only. The capacity is just so limited, they don’t enter the uncanny valley where they can become truly annoying.
- kbelder 10mo ago
  It's like using your turn signal even when you know there's nobody around you. Politeness is a habit you don't want to break.
  - _heimdall 10mo ago
    That's an interesting example to use. I only use turn signals when there are other cars around that would need the indication. I don't view a turn signal as politeness, its a safety tool to let others know what I'm about to. I do also find that only using a turn signal when others are around is a good reinforcement to always be aware of my surroundings. I feel like a jerk when I don't use one and realize there was someone in the area, just as I feel like a jerk when I realize I didn't turn off my brights for an approaching car at night. In both cases, feeling like a jerk reminds me to pay more attention while driving.
    - eszed 10mo ago
      > when there are other cars around that would need the indication This has a failure state of "when there's a nearby car [or, more realistically, cyclist / pedestrian] of which I am not aware". Knowing myself to be fallible, I always use my turn signals. I do take your point about turn signals being a reminder to be aware. That's good, but could also work while, you know, still using them, just in case.
      - _heimdall 10mo ago
        You're not the only one raising that concern here - I get it and am not recommending what anyone else should do. I've been driving for decades now and have plenty of examples of when I was and wasn't paying close enough attention behind the wheel. I was raising this only as an interesting different take or lesson in my own experience, not to look for approval or disagreement.
        cgriswald 10mo ago
        You said something fairly egregious on a public forum and are getting pretty polite responses. You definitely do not get it because you’re still trying to justify the behavior. Just consider that you will make mistakes. If you make a mistake and signal people will have significantly more time to react to it.
- tsimionescu 10mo ago
  I think it makes much more sense to treat the bot like a bot and avoid humanizing it. I try to abstain from any kind of linguistic embellishments when prompting AI chat bots. So, instead of "what is the area of the circle" or "can you please tell me the area of the circle", I typically prefer "area of the circle" as the prompt. Granted, this is suboptimal given the irresponsible way it has been trained to pretend it's doing human-like communication, but I still try this style first and only go to more conversational language if required.
  - bee_rider 10mo ago
    It is possible that this is a personality flaw, but I’m not really able to completely ignore the human-mimicking nature of ChatGPT. It does too good a job of it.

kevmo314 10mo ago

Sure, I am more referring to advocating for Bergamot as a type of more "pure" solution. I have no opinion on not wanting to converse with a machine, that is a perfectly valid preference. I am referring more to the blog post's position where it seems to advocate against itself.

bee_rider 10mo ago

I’m not too worried about starting to write like a bot. But, I do notice that I’m sometimes blunt and demanding when I talk to a bot, and I’m worried that could leak through to my normal talking. I try to be polite just to not gain bad habits. But, for example, chatGPT is extremely confident, often wrong, and very weasely about it, so it can be hard to be “nice” to it (especially knowing that under the hood it has no feelings). It can be annoying when you bounce the third idea off the thing and it confidently replies with wrong instructions. Anyway, I’ve been less worried about running local models, mostly just because I’m running them CPU-only. The capacity is just so limited, they don’t enter the uncanny valley where they can become truly annoying.

kbelder 10mo ago
It's like using your turn signal even when you know there's nobody around you. Politeness is a habit you don't want to break.
- _heimdall 10mo ago
  That's an interesting example to use. I only use turn signals when there are other cars around that would need the indication. I don't view a turn signal as politeness, its a safety tool to let others know what I'm about to. I do also find that only using a turn signal when others are around is a good reinforcement to always be aware of my surroundings. I feel like a jerk when I don't use one and realize there was someone in the area, just as I feel like a jerk when I realize I didn't turn off my brights for an approaching car at night. In both cases, feeling like a jerk reminds me to pay more attention while driving.
  - eszed 10mo ago
    > when there are other cars around that would need the indication This has a failure state of "when there's a nearby car [or, more realistically, cyclist / pedestrian] of which I am not aware". Knowing myself to be fallible, I always use my turn signals. I do take your point about turn signals being a reminder to be aware. That's good, but could also work while, you know, still using them, just in case.
    - _heimdall 10mo ago
      You're not the only one raising that concern here - I get it and am not recommending what anyone else should do. I've been driving for decades now and have plenty of examples of when I was and wasn't paying close enough attention behind the wheel. I was raising this only as an interesting different take or lesson in my own experience, not to look for approval or disagreement.
      - cgriswald 10mo ago
        You said something fairly egregious on a public forum and are getting pretty polite responses. You definitely do not get it because you’re still trying to justify the behavior. Just consider that you will make mistakes. If you make a mistake and signal people will have significantly more time to react to it.
tsimionescu 10mo ago
I think it makes much more sense to treat the bot like a bot and avoid humanizing it. I try to abstain from any kind of linguistic embellishments when prompting AI chat bots. So, instead of "what is the area of the circle" or "can you please tell me the area of the circle", I typically prefer "area of the circle" as the prompt. Granted, this is suboptimal given the irresponsible way it has been trained to pretend it's doing human-like communication, but I still try this style first and only go to more conversational language if required.
- bee_rider 10mo ago
  It is possible that this is a personality flaw, but I’m not really able to completely ignore the human-mimicking nature of ChatGPT. It does too good a job of it.