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I'll repeat myself: Can you actually find a source for your original claim about Russia using the incredibly costly S-400 platform to shoot down thousands of ch

I'll repeat myself: Can you actually find a source for your original claim about Russia using the incredibly costly S-400 platform to shoot down thousands of cheap Ukrainian drones? Russia has much cheaper systems better suited for that task, so it'd be really interesting to hear more about this. Relitigating the India-Pakistan conflict with someone who seems to have deeply held nationalist beliefs is just not all that exciting to me. >Wow, I would first like your definition of a credible source before bothering even discussing further - it seems you have some extraordinary high standard that neither media nor government sources or international analysts nor satellite imagery nor some of the photos of the crashed aircraft can meet. Credible source? Someone who doesn't have a documented track record of repeatedly reporting false rumors as facts would be a nice start. >How about John Spencer then ? He is a US military expert who has also confirmed the efficacy of the S-400 and Operation Sindoor. Is he also an idiot ? I think John Spencer is generally a decent source, but with a quick search I couldn't find anything resembling serious analysis by him on this topic. He does in fact have a post where he quickly states that "one [Saab 2000 AEW&C] was destroyed—likely by an S-400 system", but no explanation as to how he arrived at that conclusion. However, I find it odd that John Spencer is commenting on this anyway given that his expertise lies mostly in urban warfare. >What about (Retd) Pakistani Air Marshal Masood Akhtar who was reported as saying an AWACS was destroyed ? Is he also an idiot ? It took you only a couple of minutes to go from the AWACS being shot down in a record breaking engagement by the s-400 to it being damaged on the ground by Indian strikes, I've never suggested that the latter did not happen. And for what it's worth, here's another hilarious detail about IAF claims https://www.hindustantimes.com/india-news/four-air-launched-missile-strikes-by-iaf-on-may-10-and-pakistan-was-on-mat-101748052752432.html https://www.hindustantimes.com/india-news/four-air-launched-... Hindustan Times reports that IAF claims to have destroyed a C130J in Pakistan. Pakistan does not and did not ever have a single C130J. Up to you if you want to blame Hindustan Times or IAF for this obviously false claim.

lenkite 11mo ago
> Credible source? Someone who doesn't have a documented track record of repeatedly reporting false rumors as facts would be a nice start. That depends on what you personally take as rumors vs facts. No doubt you would take all Indian/Russian media reporting the S-400 used in drone slaying as rumors. If you wish actual video evidence, it is extremely difficult as obviously the S-400 was only one component of an air defense system used in Sindoor. Its efficacy was confirmed only later by several sources. https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/bought-in-defiance-of-us-pressure-s-400-proves-a-deadly-drone-slayer-india-pakistan-operation-sindoor/articleshow/121045954.cms https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/bought-in-defiance... https://www.businesstoday.in/visualstories/news/game-changer-debut-how-indias-s-400-crushed-pakistans-drone-swarm-overnight-232003-09-05-2025 https://www.businesstoday.in/visualstories/news/game-changer... > Hindustan Times reports that IAF claims to have destroyed a C130J in Pakistan. The IAF did NOT claim that. ACM Singh described it as "A C-130-class plane - i.e., an American-made, military transport aircraft dubbed 'Hercules' - may have also been hit". No mention of the "J" variant.
- monerozcash 11mo ago
  > That depends on what you personally take as rumors vs facts I linked multiple examples of your "analyst" reporting Ukrainian successes that did not happen as facts. > No doubt you would take all Indian/Russian media reporting the S-400 used in drone slaying as rumors Hey, I'll happily accept that claim from any of the decent Russian milbloggers. You know, the ones that are not consistently reporting things as fact that later turn out to be false. But you're shifting the goalposts again, we're moving from Russia shooting down thousands of drones using the S-400 to India shooting down some drones using the S-400.
- monerozcash 11mo ago
  So I spent a few minutes looking at the two Indian medias you linked, both of them are pretty consistently pushing obviously fake stories. Pakistani air force pilot captured during operation Sindoor: https://www.businesstoday.in/india/story/pakistani-air-force-pilot-captured-as-india-strikes-back-targets-lahore-and-islamabad-report-475392-2025-05-08 https://www.businesstoday.in/india/story/pakistani-air-force... No Indian aircraft lost in operation Sindoor: https://www.businesstoday.in/india/story/rafale-jets-hit-nine-terror-camps-in-pakistan-from-indian-airspace-under-operation-sindoor-report-474989-2025-05-07 https://www.businesstoday.in/india/story/rafale-jets-hit-nin... Pakistan did not shoot down a single Indian jet: https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/no-degree-of-drama-can-conceal-facts-india-responds-to-pakistan-pm-shehbaz-sharifs-remarks-at-un-slams-absurd-theatrics/articleshow/124174820.cms https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/no-degree-of-drama... Pakistani C130-J shot down during operation Sindoor: https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/new-updates/iaf-missiles-shot-down-jf-17-thunder-awacs-flying-300-km-inside-pakistan-two-f-16s-and-a-c-130j-during-operation-sindoor-report/articleshow/121375713.cms https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/new-updates/iaf-mi...
- lenkite 11mo ago
  (delayed due to rate limit) > But you're shifting the goalposts again.. Not really - S-400 efficacy in Operation Sindoor was in my original post too. You questioned that and hence the digression. Your goalposts changed into other utterly unrelated statements made by analysts you don't believe and media you don't believe. (I did not respond to those, because it would completely sidetrack the topic and anyways one of your claims is wrong). Please direct the "moving goalposts" accusation to yourself. Please note that ria.ru and tass.com has many, many articles regarding shooting down drone swarms, but only mention S-400 as again a component of an overall defense system, so that won't convince you. Here is a Russian source on specifically only the S-400 being used to shoot down a Ukrainian drone: S-400 "Triumph" used to shoot down drone. https://www.gazeta.ru/social/2024/01/31/18205855.shtml https://www.gazeta.ru/social/2024/01/31/18205855.shtml

lenkite 11mo ago

> Credible source? Someone who doesn't have a documented track record of repeatedly reporting false rumors as facts would be a nice start. That depends on what you personally take as rumors vs facts. No doubt you would take all Indian/Russian media reporting the S-400 used in drone slaying as rumors. If you wish actual video evidence, it is extremely difficult as obviously the S-400 was only one component of an air defense system used in Sindoor. Its efficacy was confirmed only later by several sources. https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/bought-in-defiance-of-us-pressure-s-400-proves-a-deadly-drone-slayer-india-pakistan-operation-sindoor/articleshow/121045954.cms https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/bought-in-defiance... https://www.businesstoday.in/visualstories/news/game-changer-debut-how-indias-s-400-crushed-pakistans-drone-swarm-overnight-232003-09-05-2025 https://www.businesstoday.in/visualstories/news/game-changer... > Hindustan Times reports that IAF claims to have destroyed a C130J in Pakistan. The IAF did NOT claim that. ACM Singh described it as "A C-130-class plane - i.e., an American-made, military transport aircraft dubbed 'Hercules' - may have also been hit". No mention of the "J" variant.

monerozcash 11mo ago
> That depends on what you personally take as rumors vs facts I linked multiple examples of your "analyst" reporting Ukrainian successes that did not happen as facts. > No doubt you would take all Indian/Russian media reporting the S-400 used in drone slaying as rumors Hey, I'll happily accept that claim from any of the decent Russian milbloggers. You know, the ones that are not consistently reporting things as fact that later turn out to be false. But you're shifting the goalposts again, we're moving from Russia shooting down thousands of drones using the S-400 to India shooting down some drones using the S-400.
monerozcash 11mo ago
So I spent a few minutes looking at the two Indian medias you linked, both of them are pretty consistently pushing obviously fake stories. Pakistani air force pilot captured during operation Sindoor: https://www.businesstoday.in/india/story/pakistani-air-force-pilot-captured-as-india-strikes-back-targets-lahore-and-islamabad-report-475392-2025-05-08 https://www.businesstoday.in/india/story/pakistani-air-force... No Indian aircraft lost in operation Sindoor: https://www.businesstoday.in/india/story/rafale-jets-hit-nine-terror-camps-in-pakistan-from-indian-airspace-under-operation-sindoor-report-474989-2025-05-07 https://www.businesstoday.in/india/story/rafale-jets-hit-nin... Pakistan did not shoot down a single Indian jet: https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/no-degree-of-drama-can-conceal-facts-india-responds-to-pakistan-pm-shehbaz-sharifs-remarks-at-un-slams-absurd-theatrics/articleshow/124174820.cms https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/no-degree-of-drama... Pakistani C130-J shot down during operation Sindoor: https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/new-updates/iaf-missiles-shot-down-jf-17-thunder-awacs-flying-300-km-inside-pakistan-two-f-16s-and-a-c-130j-during-operation-sindoor-report/articleshow/121375713.cms https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/new-updates/iaf-mi...
lenkite 11mo ago
(delayed due to rate limit) > But you're shifting the goalposts again.. Not really - S-400 efficacy in Operation Sindoor was in my original post too. You questioned that and hence the digression. Your goalposts changed into other utterly unrelated statements made by analysts you don't believe and media you don't believe. (I did not respond to those, because it would completely sidetrack the topic and anyways one of your claims is wrong). Please direct the "moving goalposts" accusation to yourself. Please note that ria.ru and tass.com has many, many articles regarding shooting down drone swarms, but only mention S-400 as again a component of an overall defense system, so that won't convince you. Here is a Russian source on specifically only the S-400 being used to shoot down a Ukrainian drone: S-400 "Triumph" used to shoot down drone. https://www.gazeta.ru/social/2024/01/31/18205855.shtml https://www.gazeta.ru/social/2024/01/31/18205855.shtml